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Lupus, Vitiligo, Plastic Surgery and the concept of ‘self-hatred’. Did Michael Jackson want to go white?

August 13, 2011

Interesting coincidences sometimes happen.  A week ago the accusations of Michael Jackson of ‘black self-hatred’ impressed me so much that I decided to write a few words about this allegation  – touching upon Michael’s health on the way,  and here we are – a certain Dr. Drew Pinsky suddenly uses his TV show to spread old lies about Michael’s nose ‘falling off’ and invite Michael Jackson’s so-called ‘friends’ (Brian Oxman and Deepak Chopra) to say nothing  good of him except that he was an ‘addict’.

Surprisingly, but my post is also going to be about Michael’s looks and even some problems concerning addiction and I will also be quoting a former associate of Michael Jackson – Dr. Arnold Klein who isn’t regarded as Michael’s friend at all – however it is this man who will assure us that Michael’s nose was very much in place and that Michael managed to withdraw from his former addiction to Demerol.  Moreover it is this non-friend who will help us understand how drugs were introduced into Michael’s life and who is responsible for it.

No, in these days of an open battle for Michael Jackson’s good name it is difficult to say who is a friend or foe – some people are definitely undecided with whom to side and are running back and forth. Time to make your choice, guys – we are almost there and afterwards it will be too late.

But let us start where we left the discussion about Michael alleged ‘black self-hatred’. A reader raised it in the comments section and it turned out that some people believed it and applied it to Michael Jackson as this is the only explanation they see why he turned from black to white and had plastic surgery on his face.

GOING WHITE

Only the deaf and blind do not know by now that it wasn’t Michael’s desire to become white. The change in the color of his skin was due to Vitiligo – a grave autoimmune disease which turned his skin into porcelain white and his life into a nightmare. It couldn’t be stopped or healed, was a huge obstacle to Michael’s stage work and public appearances and in addition to bringing him lots of suffering was regarded the world over as a sign of Michael wanting to betray his race.

The MJEOL site worded it perfectly: “For years Jackson lived with the totally unfair, undeserved and unfounded allegation based on something he could not do anything about. All of the hell he was given and all of the jokes that were made could have been an enormous burden on someone who was already utterly self-conscious about his looks.”

Filming “They Don’t Really Care About Us” in Rio de Janeiro in 1995. Makeup effectively covers up the dark splotches in the actual video

Those who still allow themselves nasty jokes about Michael’s desire to ‘go white’ should be reminded on a daily basis that this kind of a behaviour on their part was more or less passable when people were in the dark as to Michael’s disease. Repeating the same old story now – after he told Oprah and others about his vitiligo and the diagnosis was confirmed by numerous pictures and even the autopsy report  – is simply monstrous, same as it is monstrous to laugh at another person’s  wounds. This type of behavior should be stopped by a steel hand by everyone who sees it as there is simply no way it can be justified.

Michael’s dermatologist Arnold Klein said in an interview with Larry King that Michael’s vitiligo was really bad and the ultimate decision to ‘go white’ wasn’t his: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0907/08/lkl.01.html

KING: What is vitiligo?

KLEIN: It’s a loss of pigment cells. And the pigment cells, you — for every 36 normal cells in your body, you have one pigment cell pumping pigment into them. Unfortunately, it’s an autoimmune disease and lupus is an autoimmune disease. And they tend to go together, because you make antibodies against your pigment cells.

KING: Did Michael have it?

KLEIN: Absolutely. We biopsied it.

KING: What causes it?

KLEIN: It causes — it’s caused by your immune system and your immune system destroying your pigment cells.

KING: Do black people have it more than white people?

KLEIN: No. But it’s just more visible on black people, because they have a dark skin. The other thing is, it certainly occurs with a family history. And I believe one of Michael’s relatives did, in fact, have vitiligo.

KING: How bad was his?

KLEIN: Oh, his was bad because he began to get a totally speckled look over his body. And he could…

KING: All over his body?

KLEIN: All over his body, but on his face significantly; on his hands, which were very difficult to treat.

KING: So let’s clear up something. He was not someone desirous of being white?

KLEIN: No. Michael was black. He was very proud of his black heritage. He changed the world for black people. We now have a black president.

KING: So how do you treat vitiligo?

KLEIN: Well, I mean there’s certain treatments. You have one choice where you can use certain drugs called (INAUDIBLE) and ultraviolet light treatments to try to make the white spots turn dark or — his became so severe, that the easier way is to use certain creams that will make the dark spots turn light so you can even out the pigments totally.

KING: So your decision there was he would go light?

KLEIN: Well, yes, that’s ultimately what the decision had to be, because there was too much vitiligo to deal with and…

KING: Otherwise, he would have looked ridiculous?

KLEIN: Well, you can’t — he would have to wear heavy, heavy makeup on stage, which would be ridiculous. And he couldn’t really go out in public without looking terribly peculiar.

Here is the video of them talking:

Dr. Klein’s account of the events same as the words of Michael’s make-up artist Karen Faye explain why Michael turned white almost overnight  (or at least some of us had that impression). Karen Faye says they first tried to cover white spots with dark make-up but when vitiligo became too extensive they had to use light make-up, which naturally brought about an almost immediate change in Michael’s looks into the opposite color:

The change was quickly noticed by the media and was attributed to a “skin-replacement” operation he had allegedly undergone. This lie was so effective that even in my far-away part of the world a great many intelligent people believed that Michael’s skin had been replaced.

And this despite the idea being completely ridiculous, absurd and even delirious. Where does a black man take so much white skin? From a donor? But there are no precedents of a surgical replacement of skin on the whole body! The maximum replacement they do now are separate patches of skin only! And how do these people imagine the full replacement? Full scalping him first? And then gluing back someone else’s skin? Some people must have watched too many horror movies and cannot tell life from fiction as a result!

Other detractors believed that Michael used creams for bleaching his skin. He did use some lightening creams all right as doctors prescribed them for evening out his color and make dark spots look paler – but this is a standard cosmetic procedure for all vitiligo patients which saves them from the embarrassment of facing the public with their leopard looks.  And since the use of these creams is standard it makes all those dirty hints about “bleaching his skin” completely out of place – we don’t laugh at people who use toothpaste for everyday hygiene, do we,  so why all this innuendo and laugh about the “bleaching cream found in his house”? Why not laugh at finding someone’s toothpaste in his home too then?

Like all people suffering from vitiligo Michael was terribly self-conscious about his condition and confessed he had the disease only when he was practically white. If he had said it earlier the hysteria about him ‘wanting to be white’ could have probably subsided, but knowing that no one believed Michael even after his admission I doubt that an earlier confession would have made much difference.

Instead, it could have landed us with photos of speckled Michael, covertly made by paparazzi from some bushes and published in every tabloid with catchy headlines. Can you imagine the juicy stories accompanying those pictures? I very well can – “The Freak Going Freakier Than Ever”, “A Speckled Thriller”, “Are You Scared Yet?”

No, it was wise of him not to say anything until he became one-color again.

THE COMMON CONCEPT OF BEAUTY

But the theory of Michael’s ‘black self-hatred’ is based not only on the dramatic change of his skin color – very much talk concerning this matter revolves around the plastic surgery on his face. Some are sure that this way Michael was keen on acquiring ‘white looks’ and that his desperation to ‘change his race’ was so big that he allegedly had more than 50 operations. After the Bashir interview aired the media wrote:

“Earlier this week, a “Dateline NBC” special examined the singer’s denial that he had only two plastic surgery operations. A doctor who shared an office with Jackson’s personal plastic surgeon claimed the pop singer had over 50 operations”. http://www.lifewhile.com/news/1995933/detail.html

Which doctor? Name please! And how much could he see if he only shared the office? However let us not waste time on these people trying to stop them from going to hell (where they belong) – the question we need to pursue is whether Michael did indeed hate himself for being black and whether he indeed ‘betrayed his race’ by having plastic surgery on his face.

First of all let me say that the idea of ‘black self-hatred’ as such and in application to cosmetic surgery in particular looks to me a heavily slanted and a highly artificial mental construction. You can feel that something is basically wrong with this statement but cannot pin down where the wrong is – all you can say is that the idea is too primitive to explain things which are in fact much more complex.

Unfortunately the phenomenon of ‘self-hatred’ does exist, though I would rather call it self-dissatisfaction or non-acceptance of yourself the way you are. But calling this phenomenon solely black would be a ridiculous exaggeration to say the very least.

The truth of the matter is that most people are unable to accept themselves fully – dissatisfaction with ourselves is a feature typical for the majority of us and it is only the degree of it which varies from person to person. This phenomenon is not only one of the biggest human driving forces (as it encourages changes and working on oneself) but is also one of the biggest maladies in life (as it brings about neuroses).

Taken in a wider context inability to accept oneself doesn’t include only one’s looks. Some people don’t accept their weight and go dieting. Some are unhappy with their intellectual abilities and gifts nature has given them – they wanted something better or more. Some suffer from lack of confidence in themselves or inability to properly socialize and become totally neurotic as a result. Some have a hard time accepting their sexuality or social standing and this can bring about its own huge excesses. However there is one thing which is common to all of us  – practically each and every is dissatisfied with the way we look.

I haven’t met a person in my life who was fully happy with his or her looks. Something is always wrong – nose, ears, condition of skin, shape of hips, belly, legs or mouth. Some have too little or no hair, some have too much hair and not in the right places, those with curly hair want it straight, those with straight hair want it curly, so on and so forth – the list can go on forever.

Dissatisfaction with one’s looks is so widespread that the whole of beauty industry is based on this concept thus making it technically possible to call all avid users of beauty products self-haters too. This would be an absurd statement of course but the popularity of cosmetic procedures and every-day make-up proves that self-dissatisfaction with one’s looks and partial non-acceptance of yourself the way you are is an absolutely routine thing which shows the desire of each of us to reach a certain standard – yes standard  –  ideal of beauty.

I wouldn’t be suddenly talking about this concept if it didn’t have a direct bearing on Michael. He was accused by everyone of a desire to look more attractive and the hypocrisy of these accusations is simply astonishing when you look at it from the point of view of a great many of us who are heavily engaged in similar activities ourselves.

If some of us do not resort to cosmetic procedures it means that we are either very wise people who have learned to accept ourselves the way we are or are simply lacking means to enjoy all the good things the beauty industry can offer us. Considering the latter factor I strongly suspect that if we had his money we wouldn’t be able to resist some of the cosmetic temptations either and would also find what to do to our faces or figures (and at every age too).

As you rightfully say it happened that the ideal of beauty was somehow forced on the world by the white race though it has begun to noticeably change in the past decades. But even despite the new tendencies human mind is still heavily dominated by the ideals which have been evolving for centuries and which are implanted in our minds without us even realizing it.

As a result of this or probably because the concept of beauty is somehow built-in into a human mind (?) I’ll venture to say that there is a certain mental image of beauty which exists in an abstract form for all people of the world irrespective of their race and skin color. This beauty ideal includes a combination of several obligatory elements – the minimal of which are a clean and healthy skin, straight and well-proportioned nose, eyes which are preferably bigger than smaller, ears that do not stick out, not too thin lips, good hair, etc.

The color of skin is not that important because it is a minor factor as compared to facial features – if all

Black Madonna

above elements are present the face remains within a certain common standard of beauty and the color of skin is only a little spice added to the whole picture. Look at the handsome faces of famine refugees in the Horn of Africa who are currently on everyone’s TV screens and you will understand what I mean – many of the faces are so beautifully modeled that if it weren’t for the tragedy of it many of these emaciated women could make ready-made models. Their faces help you realize that it isn’t the color of skin which makes a person beautiful but the features of the face and its proportions.

The point I am trying to make here is that beauty is not in color – beauty is in the proportions of one’s face the complex of which is registered by our brain on some very basic level recognizable to all.

This universal standard of beauty has taken long time to form and it will again take time and some unknown psychological mechanisms to make our brain perceive beauty differently. It is not in our power to change mass public perception of who is handsome and who is not – especially since the media is doing its best to make all of us want to look the way they consider it beautiful at the moment. In the next century the concept of beauty will change and everyone will again try to look that way – and this is something which simply cannot be helped by any of us.

PLASTIC SURGERY IS FOR ALL

Discoloration beneath his right eye, pimples and uneven skin and a big nose the family members laughed at – lots of reasons to be dissatisfied with oneself!

Each of us wants to come closer to the standard of beauty which is currently in fashion and people go to many extremes in order to attain their goal. But if ordinary people are so very much set on it, how much more willing should be those whose face is constantly on the screen and on front pages of popular magazines? And wouldn’t it be extreme hypocrisy to say that what is allowed, promoted and encouraged by beauty magazines for all of us should all of a sudden be forbidden for a man like Michael Jackson?

When I look at Michael’s face in his adolescent years and see him turning from a cute boy into a shy teenager with acne I can understand full well why he was dying to have a cleaner skin and make his nose smaller. The face is well within the accepted ‘standard’ but the nose and state of skin are indeed a deviation from the ideal concept of beauty.

It is true that a wide nose is typical of some black people, however other black people and even whole black nations have noses I can only be envious of.  On the other hand white people cannot always sport the best of facial features – so speaking generally there is no strict determination of who should look how.

But what is interesting is that when it comes to correcting one’s facial deficiencies it suddenly turns out that a white man can have plastic surgery without being accused of anything bad while a black man cannot because he is immediately said to be ‘betraying his race’!

The above is equivalent to saying that black people are obliged to stay the way they are, while white people are not answerable to anyone and are allowed to change their looks the way they want.

See how ridiculous it is? See the absurdity of all these ideas if you detach yourself from common prejudices and look at the problem from a neutral angle?

I suspect that the shape of Michael’s nose indeed made him hateful of his looks especially since it was the subject of constant ridicule from his family members who were more fortunate with their noses (they nicknamed him “Big nose” or something like that) —  so it doesn’t surprise me in the least that he wanted to change its shape.

Haters often laugh at Michael not being able to give the exact number of plastic surgeries he had. In his ill-fated interview with Bashir he first gave the number of two and then corrected it to three.

Does it mean that he was lying about the number of cosmetic surgeries made by the year 2003? No, it doesn’t. Michael was a very honest person –  so honest that he even admitted to fighting his addiction to Demerol in one of his songs. So to me his hesitation in the number of surgery means that he had a difficulty to separate between the nose jobs done solely for “beauty reasons” from those which were a medical necessity.

I want to remind everyone that Michael’s rhinoplasty started with an accident in 1979 when he broke his nose while rehearsing a dance move. It was about that time that he took the opportunity to make his nose smaller which was a very logical thing to do – if you are doing it anyway why not have the full package all at once? However from what we know about it, the operation was not successful as it blocked his nose breathing and had to be redone.

Nasal obstruction is a rather common side effect of rhinoplasty as according to a recent study up to 60% of patients complain about difficulty in breathing after it and seek to revise the operation:

Patients Seek Revision Plastic Surgery to Correct Asymmetric Nasal Tips, Breathing Obstructions

ScienceDaily (Sep. 20, 2010) —

Kathy Yu, M.D., of Columbia College and Cornell University, New York, and colleagues collected questionnaires from 104 consecutive patients seeking revision rhinoplasty between Jan. 1, 2008, and June 30, 2009. Patients ranked the top three reasons for seeking revision surgery, reported any symptoms of nasal obstruction and listed the reasons they did not return to their primary surgeon.

Most patients reported seeking revision surgery because of tip asymmetry, difficulty breathing or nasal blockage, or a crooked middle third of the nose.

Of the 64 (62 percent) of patients who described having difficulty breathing or other experiences of nasal obstruction, 60 (94 percent) had objective physical findings related to obstruction.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/09/100920172642.htm

I don’t know when exactly cosmetic surgery proper was made on Michael’s nose for the first time– at the initial or corrective stage of repairing it, but it isn’t that important. What is important is that out of the two nasal jobs only one of them was partially cosmetic as it only accompanied the first surgery to mend the fracture or, most probably, went with the second surgery to improve his breathing.

How much more cosmetic surgery Michael had later I don’t know but tend to believe him that by the time of the 2003 interview their number was two or maximum three. The reason for the rest of the nasal surgery could have been completely different. Though some say that it was the result of ‘bad judgment’, a much more probable explanation is that Michael had to deal with the consequences of his very first nasal job and the reason for those after-effects was Michael’s lupus.

LUPUS

Even though many people are now aware of Michael’s vitiligo they still tend to forget that he had another terrible autoimmune disease – Lupus. In contrast to vitiligo lupus is practically not seen but is a much graver ailment as it undermines the patient from the inside. In case of lupus the immune system which generally fights infections only, suddenly turns on the body and attacks its healthy tissues instead. The consequences of lupus on a person’s overall condition and everyday life are horrible – just horrible – and even this word will be too mild a way of putting it.

To see how bad an effect it has on a human life here are some video stories about patients with lupus. If you watch them you will see that this disease alone can turn anyone’s life into a total misery – even if a person lives a comfortable life among those who dearly love him, and is not harassed by all the media in the world, sued a thousand and a half times, unjustly accused of horrendous things he has never done and is also a performer whose job is to regularly appear in public and impress people with fantastic shows:

Lupus Awareness Infomercial

Faces of Lupus

We are being told that Michael was suffering from a discoid or milder form of lupus (DLE) which affected ‘only’ his skin – which is no small matter as skin is considered the largest organ of the body. There are also signs that Michael could have developed a graver form of lupus, a systemic lupus (SLE), which spreads onto internal organs.

But whatever form of lupus Michael had, there is one thing common for both of thempeople affected by lupus are not recommended to have plastic surgery (unless they are in a stable remission stage) for fear of grave side-effects. Here is an account of a lupus patient who was surprised to learn than cosmetic surgery was not quite compatible with his disease:

  • A few years ago I attended a lupus seminar for health care professionals and learned cosmetic surgery is not a good idea for those diagnosed with discoid lupus.  MJ, unfortunately, had cosmetic surgery performed on his nose, chin (the dimple) and possibly other areas of his face.  According to one of the doctors who spoke at the seminar, she did not advise her patients to seek out plastic surgery unless their discoid lupus was in remission.  I don’t know if MJ was prescribed this drug or not but anti-malarial drugs like Placquenil are typically prescribed to keep discoid lupus at bay.  Patients on this drug can have successful results from plastic surgery but, there is no guarantee.  If he was on an antimalarial drug he needed to protect his eyes and skin from sunlight and, unfortunately, these drugs can cause damage to your retinas and blindness which coincides with a more recent rumor that MJ was losing vision in either one or both eyes.
  • In the aforementioned seminar, a good deal of emphasis was placed on the dangers of plastic surgery for individuals diagnosed with discoid lupus.  I was surprised to hear this and thought about MJ during the discussion because they said plastic surgery could exacerbate the condition and could cause further scarring and/or difficult or slow healing.”

But if Michael knew that cosmetic surgery was no good for him how could he seek nasal surgery then? Isn’t it exactly the reason why people accuse Michael of ‘bad judgment’? Or was it doctors who didn’t tell him of the dangers of it? And did they know about it themselves?

The truth of the matter is that at the time of the first nasal surgery (1979) neither Michael nor his surgeons knew of his lupus condition. First his broken nose was mended, then it was corrected to improve breathing, and accompanied by some plastic surgery, and only several years after that Michael was diagnosed with lupus (in 1984),  so there was no way Michael could know of possible lupus-related consequences of his initial surgery. Nor could he avoid the operations as both nasal jobs were a necessity.

It will be more correct to address the question about why they disregarded Michael’s lupus to doctors who made those operations. It is quite possible that  some of them simply did not know of it.

The patient who attended that medical seminar says that ignorance about autoimmune diseases is quite common among plastic surgeons. It isn’t their primary business and the disease itself is so tricky that is not easy to diagnose. In fact it often goes undiagnosed for years  as it is known to be a great ‘imitator’ of other ailments and is often taken for something different.

So it is quite probable that none of the surgeons were smart enough to make the right guess and test Michael for lupus before the operation. The lupus patient shares his observations about it:

  • In fairness to plastic surgeons, not all of them are well versed in autoimmune diseases, particularly if the patient never mentions it.  Some will not bother viewing your health records either.  That said, since Lupus DLE, SLE and SCLE (subacute cutaneous lupus erythematosus) are hard to diagnose and many go undiagnosed for years, it is not uncommon for a plastic surgeon to proceed knowing nothing about the patient’s lupus or what effects the surgery will have on their skin.  Many simply don’t know.  Those who do know will defer surgery until such time the patient is in remission.  Now ask yourself, what doctor is going to pass up that much money?

Michael underwent his first rhinoplasty as early as 1979 and his lupus was diagnosed only several years later when Michael, who was suffering from acne, was introduced to Dr. Klein and Klein took a biopsy and made the correct diagnosis. This is how Klein diagnosed Michael with lupus:

Transcript of their conversation:

KING: Doctor, how did you first meet Michael?

DR. ARNIE KLEIN, MICHAEL JACKSON’S DERMATOLOGIST: I met Michael because someone had brought him into my office. And they walked into the room with Michael. And I looked one — took one look at him and I said you have lupus erythematosus. Now, this was a long word.

KING: Lupus?

KLEIN: Lupus, yes. I mean, because he had red — a butterfly rash and he also had severe crusting you could see on the anterior portion of his scalp. I mean I always am very visual. I’m a person who would look at the lips of Mona Lisa and not see her smile. I would see the lips.

KING: Was he there because of that condition?

KLEIN: He was there only because a very close friend of his had told him to come see me about the problems he had with his skin. Because he was — he had severe acne, which many people…

KING: Oh, he did?

KLEIN: Yes, he did. And many people made fun of him. He used to remember trying to clean it off and he’d gone to these doctors that really hurt him very much. And he was exquisitely sensitive to pain.

So he walked into my office. He had several things wrong with his skin. So I said — and you have thick crusting of your scalp and you have some hair loss.

He says, well, how do you know this?

I said, because it’s the natural course of lupus.

So I then did a biopsy. I diagnosed lupus. And then our relationship went from there.

A red butterfly rash on the face and thinning hair on the anterior part of the head and at temples are typical of lupus

Forget about plastic surgery for a moment.

The 20-something year-old man has a severe acne, a red butterfly rash on this face, some hair loss and a thick crusting visible on the anterior part of his head? And vitiligo too which is making his most visible parts – face and hands – turn into a black-and-white mess?

Isn’t it too much for one person? And he didn’t sit at home sulking over his diseases but stubbornly worked to become a genius of a dancer and singer and go down into history as a phenomenal songwriter? Could he have attained all that if he hadn’t been an incredibly tough man who managed to live with all those ailments and still become the best entertainer in the world?

A totally amazing example for all of us! And what a lesson it is for all those who think that strength and toughness are in muscles only….

Okay, so Dr. Klein’s interview confirmed it once again that Michael nasal surgery had started well before Michael learned about his lupus and this is exactly the reason why both he and his doctors boldly stepped on the road of plastic surgery at the end of the 70s.

The difficulty in diagnosing the disease doesn’t release doctors of their responsibility though – they were not only unsuccessful in treatment of his acne (‘hurting him a lot’) but none of them noticed a butterfly rash on his face, his hair loss and a thick crusting on his head all of which are extremely visible signs of a discoid lupus. Dr. Klein saw it the moment Michael entered his office (no wonder Michael kept to that doctor ever since),  but what about the others?

The lupus butterfly rash is so visible. How could they overlook it for so long?

It is true that they probably didn’t bother to check as the first nasal surgeries were a necessity and had to be done anyway, but if doctors had diagnosed Michael’s lupus at that stage it could have saved them from a tremendous amount of medical mistakes later and spared Michael from much pain and extremely grave consequences of the doctors’ (not his) poor judgment!

We learn about what happened to Michael’s nasal surgeries in the years following his meeting Dr. Klein not only from Klein himself, who compromised himself by telling a lot of contradictory stories about Michael, but from another, highly credible source, Dr. Richard Strick.

Dr. Richard Strick isn’t just a nobody in matters concerning Michael Jackson – he is the doctor who was appointed by DA Tom Sneddon to review Michael’s medical records in 1993 seized from Michael’s dermatologist and plastic surgeon. So when Dr. Strick talks about Michael’s surgeries he definitely knows what he is talking about as he studied all the respective documents.

And after studying those documents this medical expert who cannot be suspected of bias towards Jackson as he was working for the government, says it point-blank – all further work done on Michael’s nose was reconstructive and was the direct result of his lupus condition. Michael’s initial nasal surgery was followed by attempts to cope with breathing obstruction (which account for the first two operations) and the follow-up surgery dealt with the damage done to the nose by lupus which destroyed part of its tissues. Further surgery was aimed at simple reconstruction of the nose back to its normal condition:

DR. STRICK:  Michael had a disease vitiligo in which the pigment is lost and attempts had been made to bring that pigment back which had been unsuccessful so he tried to bleach it out so it would be one colour. Lupus is also an autoimmune disease and he also had skin involvement, which had destroyed part of the skin of his nose and his nasal surgeries and all were really reconstructive, to try and look normal.

QUESTION:    So all these nose reconstructions you’re saying was as a result of him treating his lupus?

DR. STRICK:   The first one was to try and reconstruct from some scar tissue and obstruction that had happened with the skin there. It didn’t work out very well and all subsequent attempts were to make it right. I think he was trying to look like a normal guy as best as that he could.”

Besides this eye-opening revelation the full version of the same tape discloses another extremely important point in connection with Dr. Strick’s involvement with Michael Jackson. It is a somewhat side matter for the present discussion so will have to go as a separate point.

I WAS TOLD IT WAS A MATCH

Dr. Strick represents the prosecution side as he was appointed by Tom Sneddon to find out whether Michael had undertaken any changes on his genitalia in order to make them look different from Jordan Chandler’s description. Sneddon thought that Michael could have had some surgery to return to a non-circumcision state or bleach his skin to change the color of his private parts – both of which Jordan got absolutely wrong (we have numerous posts about it, please look up at least this postthis and this).

However,  though Dr. Strick was actually the main authority to make the final determination (this is why he was invited at all), we learn from his interview that he didn’t have an opportunity to compare the photos with Jordan’s description and was simply TOLD that it was a match!

See the full version of the same video where, among the usual biased talk about the settlement, he mentions this crucial fact somewhat in passing, so if you don’t know the context you might not even notice it:

In his interview with Larry King Arnold Klein also confirmed the fact that Michael’s medical records had been passed over to the medical examiner representing the prosecution side:

KING: … have you been contacted by any authorities, police or anyone?
KLEIN: The only thing I’ve done is I’ve turned my records, a long time ago, over to the medical examiner. I’ve not been contacted by the medical examiner.

Of course he wasn’t contacted because there was nothing to contact him about! And though this is a side issue for today’s discussion, considering how important the point is we need to stop here for a second to make some conclusions from the above.

1. Firstly, Dr. Strick’s words are a first-hand proof that the prosecution did have Michael’s medical records in the 1993 Chandler case. Up till now some haters claimed that the medical records were hidden from the prosecution for fear of revealing some “dark secrets” of Michael Jackson, so now these people are requested to please shut up – if the direct evidence from the prosecution’s medical examiner doesn’t suit them it shows that their hatred for Michael Jackson is simply a fixed idea similar to those treated in respective mental institutions.

2. Secondly, the “I was told” phrase is not a simple figure of speech. It is a direct admission of the fact that the prosecution concealed from their own main expert that Jordan Chandler’s description didn’t match the photos of Michael’s genitalia. Sneddon didn’t want even his own medical examiner to know the truth and told to the public a LIE which should be added to the long list of other dirty tricks he used against Jackson during the years of his vendetta.

We knew of this lie long ago when Michael wasn’t immediately arrested after the strip-search and when Jordan’s lawyer Larry Feldman suddenly demanded to bar the photos from the civil trial (for information about his motion please go to this post).

By the way Jim Thomas, the former Santa Barbara county sheriff also said that he was only “told” about the match  (he didn’t see the photos). How very interesting it is – the main medical expert saw the photos but didn’t compare them with Jordan’s description, and the county sheriff evidently saw the description but didn’t compare it with the photos, and both of them were just “told” that there was  a match. Incredible things were going on in Tom Sneddon’s department!  (for post about Jim Thomas please go here).

3. And thirdly, if we return to the matter of our present discussion we see that Dr. Strick’s words about Michael’s nasal surgery show that everything done on Michael’s nose in the period covered by Dr. Klein’s medical records (at least from 1984 to 1993 when the records were seized by the police) was reconstructive  surgery only dealing with the side-effects of his lupus which damaged the tissues of his nose.

Dr. Klein once again spoke about the need to reconstruct and rebuild Michael’s nose before the concerts in London, but confirmed that it was very much in place (despite all the innuendos from guys like Drew Pinsky):

KING: You saw him the Monday before he died.
KLEIN: Absolutely. Yes, sir.
KING: What was the purpose of the visit?
KLEIN: He came to me because, basically, I was sort of rebuilding his face, because he had severe acneand scarring. He had scarring from having a lot of cosmetic surgery. And my expertise is — like it is with every one of my patients. My patients are my treasures. And I was rebuilding his face so he looked much more normal. And contrary to what people said, he could not take off his nose. His nose was attached. But it looked too small. And I just was trying to get him ready to do the concert, because in the way he looked in his face, he wanted it to be absolutely as perfect as it could be.

LUPUS SIDE-EFFECTS

Since so much is being said about the side-effects of cosmetic surgery for lupus patients I’ve decided to have a closer look and see why these sufferers are not recommended to have it. This is what I’ve found among the answers given by doctors to the inquisitive patients:

Can patients with lupus have plastic surgery?

  • Lupus is a disease of the blood vessels and healing can be unpredictable in these patients. In a worse case scenario, areas of the skin can die (skin necrosis) leaving a real mess. Making this potentially worse is the fact that the medications a Lupus patient tends to be on include drugs that further inhibit healing like steroids and immunosuppressive drugs.    http://www.cosmeticsurgerytruth.com/blog/?p=8125
  • Systemic Lupus Erythematosis is a very serious disease which affects the blood vessels which are responsible for healing and keeping the skin alive after plastic surgery. Lupus can cause large areas of skin on the face or tummy to actually die after plastic surgery and result in terrible scars. Please encourage the patient to discuss this and be honest with the doctor. The result of not telling the doctor could be disastrous.

The first thing which attracts our attention in these doctors’ replies is that lupus comes in two forms – DLE (a milder one) and SLE (a systemic and graver one), but plastic surgery is not recommended for either of them. In both types of lupus healing of the skin and other tissues is difficult, the skin can develop a necrosis and die, and this usually results in severe scars. And no one can help this situation as lupus is treated by drugs suppressing the immune system – as it is too aggressive towards its owner –  and such drugs are an additional factor hindering the healing process. It is a vicious circle, you know.

Didn’t Klein say something about Michael already having severe scars when he came to him? The scars he had from lupus and the very first surgery on his nose in 1979? And these were further aggravated by scars from a burn on his head that he got from filming a commercial for Pepsi in 1984?

This article is telling us the dramatic story of Michael’s burn, the area of which was as big as a palm even after it healed. The resulting bald patch was treated by Dr. Steven Hoefflin for several months by means of a laser and other procedures meant to restore Michael’s hair:

Michael Jackson’s hair loss – what happened to his bald spot?

The King of Pop once wore a very different crown and almost had it taken away. It’s hard to believe that Michael Jackson once sported a full afro and everyone’s probably also forgotten that he nearly went  baldat 25 after a freak fire accident.

While filming a Pepsi commercial in 1984, pyrotechnics accidentally set Jackson’s hair on fire. He was rushed to hospital and treated for second degree burns to the back of his head which scarred his hair follicles and left him with a major bald patch.

When hair-bearing skin is badly burnt, the hair follicles are destroyed and replaced by scar tissue. The hair loss is permanent and known as cicatricial (or scarring) alopecia.

Jackson was singing his hit “Billie Jean” in a simulated concert scene when the special effects went wrong. Three thousand fans saw a firework display erupt behind the superstar, showering him in sparks and setting light to his hair. Jackson covered his burning hair with his jacket but some audience members thought it was part of the act.

Jackson later underwent 80 minutes of laser surgery to repair his scalp. His surgeon Dr. Steven Hoefflin, famously known as “Doc Hollywood” who Jackson formed quite an attachment to over the years, said he was able to stitch the wound without having to implant or transplant from other parts of Jackson’s head.

According to Leonora Doclis, senior trichologist at the Belgravia Centre, while laser surgery can make the scar smaller, it won’t help in generating hair growth from the scar.

“Apparently the laser treatment reduced the scar to palm-size, but that is huge,” Leonora says. “If the follicles are damaged they will not produce hair. It is very unlikely that his hair grew back after this treatment.”

This begs the question then – what happened to Michael Jackson’s bald spot? Leonora says treating cicatricial alopecia is challenging. “The best they can do without wearing a wig is if they can hide the scarred bald patch with their own hair.”

Cicatricial alopecia is a broad term that includes all forms of hair loss  concerning inflammation directed at the hair follicle.

“There are several reasons for scarring hair loss. Scalding is just one and there is an autoimmune factor,” Leonora says. In addition to burns and other injuries, cicatricial alopecia can be caused by certain types of infections like granulomas, lupus erythematosus, recurring bacterial or fungal infections, a skin disease called lichen planus, and scalp ringworm.

“Therefore there is no point in transplanting hair from one side of the scalp to another when it can still be subject to an autoimmune attack.”

The progression of cicatricial alopecia as the result of an internal problem is unpredictable but hair loss is irreversible once the follicle is destroyed. Leonora says autoimmune suppressant steroids could be injected but they won’t prevent or treat hair loss.

Despite Dr. Hoefflin’s claims that Jackson’s scalp would be completely healed within several months, Leonora has her doubts over the authenticity of Jackson’s hair.

“I think he may be covering certain areas with a hair system (hairpiece),” she says.

And just so you know…
Back then, hair wasn’t Michael Jackson’s only concern – he’d already had two nose jobs by the time he was 25 and went for his third rhinoplasty shortly after the hair loss incident. From then on his visits with Doc. Hollywood became ever more frequent.

http://www.belgraviacentre.com/blog/michael-jackson%E2%80%99s-hair-loss-what-happened-to-his-bald-spot-084/

Many years after the burn we can see some bald spots on Michael’s head

It is really painful to read that at the age of 25 a nice-looking guy got a huge burn on his head due to a stupid mistake of some pyrotechnics. Even after the wound healed it was still as big as a palm. The doctors treated him for several months to reduce the bald patch and somehow managed to stitch it together. However there was no guarantee it would work as lupus could ruin the whole thing again…

We know that Pepsi paid to Michael a $1,5 mln. compensation for their negligence but no money can of course compensate for this type of damage to one’s looks and Michael donated all the money to other victims of burns anyway….

When Larry King asked Arnold Klein if he gave Michael any painkillers he said Yes, and mentioned numerous surgical procedures Michael had to undergo due to that burn. He even acknowledged that on occasions he did give him Demerol to dull the pain after the procedures made on him by the cosmetic doctor:

KING: “Well, what — what about pain killing medications? Did you prescribe any?
KLEIN: I mean I’ve some sedatives for, you know, when he had surgical procedures that were immense, because, don’t forget, he had a lot of — he had the burn — the serious burn when he was burnt on the Pepsi commercial and the severe hair loss when he, you know, contracted lupus, also.
So when you have to fix all these areas, you have to sedate him a little bit. But if you took all the pills I had given him in the last year at once, it wouldn’t do anything to you.
KING: What was the strongest medication you gave him?
KLEIN: I once — you know, I, on occasion, gave him Demerol to sedate him. And that was about the strongest medicine I ever used.
….

KING: How did you treat the vitiligo?
KLEIN: Well, we basically used creams that would even out the same color and we destroyed the remaining pigment cells.
KING: And did his color change a lot over the years?

KLEIN: No, because once we got — we got it more uniform, it remained stable. But you still had to treat it because once in a while — and he had to also be extraordinary careful with sun exposure because of a lot of things. And that’s why he had the umbrellas all the time (INAUDIBLE) skin now.
KING: So when you have vitiligo, you have it all your life?
KLEIN: Usually. Almost uniformly. You don’t just have a little bit of it. And it’s most disconcerting not in white people, but in black people because you begin to look like a leopard.
KING: You can see it. Yes. Did he have blotches?
KLEIN: He had blotches but we evened out almost all of them. And he was very, very devoted to treating it. I mean he wanted to look well. He wanted to look well for one group of people, his fans. He wanted to embrace and love his fans more than any performer I’ve ever known.
KING: Did he have hair?
KLEIN: He had lost a great deal of it. You forget this first fire…

KING: That was the Pepsi fire, right?
KLEIN: Yes. But then what happened is he used a great deal of what are called tissue expanders in his scalp, which are balloons that grow up — blow up the scalp.

And then what they do is they try to cut out the scar.

Well, because he had lupus, what happened is every time they would do it, the bald spot would keep enlarging.

So, I mean, he went through a lot of painful procedures with these tissue expanders until I put a stop to it.

I said no more tissue expanders, because he had to wear a hat all the time and it was really painful for him.

KING: So what would his — without the hat, what would he look like?
KLEIN: Well, he had a big raised ball on the top of his head because of this device. It would expand the tissue, which you cut out.

But (INAUDIBLE) would you — (INAUDIBLE) too much stretch back in the scar, you understand?
KING: Did you see him one other time?
KLEIN: Of course I did. But he would have a stretch back on the scar.

I mean the scar would get worse after they removed it.

And I had to put a stop to it. So I told Michael, we have to stop this. And that’s when I fired this plastic surgeon altogether.

And I said I can’t deal with this anymore. We’re going to deal with me as your doctor or you’re going to have to find another doctor if you want to work with him”

Frankly when I first read about those tissue expanders I didn’t understand a thing and it is only now – when seeing the whole picture – I realize what was being done to him and for months at a time.

TISSUE EXPANDERS

The initial burn left heavy scars on his scalp where hair would naturally not grow – so to cut out the bald and scarred patch those experimenters put expanding balloons under his scalp. The idea was to stretch his skin in order to have a surplus of it to cover the bald spot.

As soon as the skin expanded they stretched it over the affected area, cut the scar out and stitched the skin together.

However since Michael had lupus, each new surgery on his scalp resulted in a new and heavier scar and the bald spot would only enlarge.

And it was real painful for him.

David Nordahl witnessed skin baloons under Michael’s skin and said he was in excruciating pain

I doubt very much indeed that Michael invented this torturous method himself and I doubt it even more that he agreed to it willingly as it should have been giving him excruciating pain day after day, week after week, month after month – not to mention the fact that he had to wear a hat even inside his home.

We do remember Michael complaining about the excruciating pain of the treatment he received for his burn, don’t we? But all of us thought it was the usual treatment for burns, which is extremely painful too, right? None of us could ever imagine that they would do this to him!

And he had to put up with this agony round-the-clock and for months too while waiting for the skin to stretch? The doctor said it himself that he hoped he would reach the desired effect within several months! And they kept doing it to him again and again though every new scar-cutting-out procedure didn’t work? Didn’t they know that this kind of treatment was useless anyway as Michael had lupus which hindered healing and left him even more scarred after every new surgery?

Shouldn’t they have been working in cooperation with the dermatologist if they themselves were so terribly ignorant of the side-effects of Michael’s lupus? He would have told them that discoid lupus hinders the healing process, is a scarring disease and is in itself the primary reason for permanent hair loss! No wonder that Klein finally put a stop to this nightmare and confronted the plastic surgeon with an ultimatum!

And all this time Michael had to work – sing, dance, record and give shows to the public? And it was because of the need to make him survive through this agony of a treatment that they introduced him to Demerol?  So this is how Demerol started?

DEMEROL

Besides finally realizing what a nightmare this torture must have been for Michael I now begin thinking that this kind of doctors should be sitting on the same bench as Conrad Murray for doing irreparable damage to Michael – and not even in terms of their unsuccessful treatment of his burn but in terms of a careless, unnecessary and forceful putting him on the hook of Demerol.

I don’t want to give any names here but I think you know what plastic surgeon Klein was talking about when he said that he “fired him” – even now they are at war with each other.

Klein acknowledged that Michael developed a problem with Demerol but said that he managed to beat it:

KING: Did Michael have an addiction you were aware of?
KLEIN: Michael, at one time, had an addiction. And he went to England and he withdrew that addiction at a secure setting, where he went off of drugs altogether.

Demerol shouldn’t be confused with Diprivan (Propofol) which sounds similar but is not a narcotic drug. Diprivan is an anesthetic given to most patients undergoing operations and used to help Michael’s severe case of insomnia – which is a separate problem that doesn’t surprise me in the least given his life experience and all mental and physical tortures he had to go through.

Demerol is a totally different thing. It is a narcotic pain reliever similar to morphine which is very addictive.

Since Michael must have been subjected to this totally inhuman scalp treatment for quite a long time they evidently kept giving him Demerol on a regular basis thus forcing him into the Demerol addiction – and all this due to a completely useless treatment which shouldn’t have been done at all or even started considering Michael’s lupus.

Whatever their intentions were their ‘treatment’ didn’t work and Michael had to wear wigs thereafter, but it left him with a much bigger problem in life – that of drug-addiction, which he wasn’t responsible for, never wanted and which he to his great credit stoically fought and even defeated!

Yes, despite the fact that he had to wage this battle in the midst of all that media harassment, non-stop suits and horrendous accusations he managed to do the impossible – he beat the addiction for Demerol as the autopsy report proved it. There were no narcotic drugs or their traces in his system and this makes Michael’s exploit in coping with one of the worst problems a human being can face simply awesome.

Awesome!

Those of us who don’t know what it’s like to fight  a narcotic addiction can learn about it from Michael’s incredible song called “Morphine” which is probably the best anti-drug propaganda tool I’ve ever seen. The song should indeed be used as a powerful argument against using narcotics and should probably be taught at school. Its essence is a stark contrast between two extremes – the soothing lure of the drug which promises you momentary bliss, calm and no repercussions and the monster which strikes you with all the power of it if you ever give in to its false attraction.  The song is a pure work of genius as it takes you through the hell of a fight Michael had to wage in order to get back to normal life.

It is so strong and powerful that it helps you realize the horror of narcotics without ever trying them and shows how desperate and honest with himself and the public Michael was. And how determined to win the fight too – otherwise he wouldn’t have composed and shown it to the outside world at all.

The fight was a deadly one – but he did win. The toxicology report is proof of it as it never mentioned not only narcotic drugs but even traces of them and referred only to that damned Propofol and some regular sleeping pills found in every ordinary household.

The police specifically noted that there was no hard drugs in Michael’s system:

Here is the song. Michael screams of people kicking him in his face, accusing him of hating his race and being a liar… The drug seems a way to dull the anguish of it all, but only until it shows the horrible face of its high-voltage and almost undefeatable power. The song gives you the feel of what it is like to fight this monster:

THE TRUTH

Well, let all of us, haters or non-haters alike, accept the truth at last.

Michael did not take Demerol of his own free will. He was forced into taking it by the not-too-responsible doctors who subjected him to many months of inhuman treatment and lavishly prescribed him the drug to let him still drag his feet throughout the process.

It was them who formed his habit for Demerol and it is them who should face all the music now. The patient is not responsible for the course of treatment chosen for him by his doctors and the medicine they prescribe him in order to dull the pain they so willfully inflicted on him.

Michael didn’t use any Demerol or other narcotic drugs in his later years of life. The media wanted us to think otherwise and told us huge lies about Michael when he died. However whatever they wanted to see in his body – Demerol, Xanax or anything else – there were none in his system. He was not only clean of any drugs but was even found a healthy man for his 50 years of age.

Let us be honest with ourselves at least for once in our lives and accept the indisputable fact – Michael won the battle with Demerol and did it in order to live, raise his kids and enjoy life. He was killed by something totally different – by insomnia and someone who wanted him to sleep forever…

DISCOID LUPUS TURNING SYSTEMIC ?

There are several signs pointing to the fact that Michael could have developed a graver form of lupus which affected internal organs of his body. It is called systemic lupus or SLE. This conclusion is made by many patients who compare their symptoms with what was so often reported by the media about Michael Jackson’s health. One of these patients quoted above found many points of similarity between his (her) own symptoms and Michael’s condition.

This patient’s account is extremely interesting as besides many other points it expressly shows how a lupus patient feels every day of his life (for the full story please go to: A.D. Odom http://stateandlake.net/wp1/2009/06/did-michael-jackson-have-discoid-or-systemic-lupus/ ).

Here is a slightly shortened version of it:

“Over the years I have heard the words “Michael Jackson has lupus” over and over again but I had never heard or read anything confirming MJ having systemic lupus.  Not a thing.  There have been some hospitalizations that have raised an eyebrow for me in recent years but the only confirmation I had or heard came in 1984 when MJ was badly burned when his hair caught fire during filming of a Pepsi commercial.  While MJ was in the hospital, doctors and the media reported lupus lesions were found in his scalp and it was said he had Discoid Lupus.

About Lupus Generally

Discoid lupus, or Lupus DLE, is a separate and different animal from systemic lupus or Lupus SLE.  According to WebMD’s eMedicine:

Discoid lupus erythematosus (DLE) is a chronic, scarring, atrophy producing, photosensitive dermatosis.  Some patients (<5%) with discoid lupus erythematosus progress to SLE1. Patients with DLE rarely fulfill 4 or more of the criteria used to classify SLE. Serologic abnormalities are uncommon. Therapy with sunscreens, topical corticosteroids, and antimalarial agents is usually effective.

Lupus DLE

Note that less than 5% of patients with discoid lupus go on to develop Lupus SLE.  Though 5% looks like a pretty small number, that 5% represents thousands if not hundreds of thousands of people.  When you hear a person has lupus, it is never noted whether that person has Lupus SLE or DLE.  You just hear the word lupus and that could mean anything from skin lesions only to kidney, lung or heart disease.

In MJ’s case, the lesions were found in his scalp after the accident, while he was in the hospital and unfortunately, much of what was done subsequent to his accident to repair his scalp was never quite successful.  There were reports that the scarring never fully healed which is common with discoid lupus.  MJ wore a host of wigs and some said this was done to cover up gray hair.  If the surgeries to repair his scalp were unsuccessful or, if he had discoloring alopecia – which is common with Lupus DLE – then wearing wigs makes sense.

Note, MJ walked around with a hat, facial coverings, and an umbrella to shield his body from UV light. That is a must with discoid lupus.

Lupus DLE to SLE

Discoid lupus. After a few weeks or months, when healing has taken place, dark-colored or pale scars may remain. If the condition extends to the scalp, the person may lose some of his or her hair. Sunlight tends to trigger and worsen the rash of lupus. http://www.humanillnesses.com/original/Kid-Men/Lupus.html

Here’s where Lupus DLE and SLE gets tricky.  When the lesions fall below the neck there is a chance the patient will develop Lupus SLE.  If a patient develops what is known as acute or subacute cutaneous lupus, doctors will watch their patients closely and will begin testing for high levels of ANA proteins in the blood, protein in the urine, and joint pain.  They will look for nonspecific skin lesions displaying anywhere on the body and of course any rash that occurs below the neck will be cause for suspicion.

MJ was diagnosed with vitiligo which is another autoimmune disease.  Where some will develop splotchy discoloration over parts of their body, MJ saw the disease spread over his entire body.  This would place MJ in the category of skin disease that passed the neck line and now the question, could this have put MJ in that <5% category of those who go on to develop Lupus SLE?  In my opinion, it could have.  MJ began having lots of health problems after this.

In 1990, MJ was hospitalized with something called costochondritis.  This is one of many disorders associated with autoimmune diseases.  You can also experience this very painful condition if you have been doing strenuous exercise.  I experienced this in 1989 and called an ambulance to my house because I thought I was having a heart attack.  The paramedic asked me if I had been doing the “rough & tumble” or strenuous exercise.  When I saw my doctor later I was told I had experienced costochondritis which is an inflammation of the cartilage that connects a rib to the breastbone (sternum). It causes sharp pain in the costosternal joint – where your ribs and breastbone are joined by rubbery cartilage. The pain caused by costochondritis can mimic that of a heart attack or other heart conditions.

If MJ’s bout with costochondritis was brought on by dancing and singing, that’s one thing.  It could have been a sign of something more sinister happening within his body which would represent one more thing to add to the shopping cart for Lupus SLE.  If the costochondritis was brought on by Lupus SLE, it would mean either MJ had undiagnosed Lupus SLE – which is possible and happens often – or his discoid lupus went systemic around this time.

In December 1995, MJ collapsed in New York during rehearsal for a TV special and was described as “dangerously ill”.  According to his doctors, MJ had a viral intestinal infection that led to nausea and dehydration and he spent nearly a week in the hospital.  I will say intestinal problems are common with lupus and there are numerous autoimmune diseases that affect the intestines.  If this was an autoimmune disorder we have yet another item for the Lupus SLE shopping cart.

Another curious thing MJ did was tape his fingertips.  In 2005, I too taped three fingers on my left hand.  Why?  Raynaud’s phenomenon.  From MedicineNet:

Raynaud’s phenomenon (RP) is a condition resulting in a particular series of discolorations of the fingers and/or the toes after exposure to changes in temperature (cold or hot) or emotional events. Skin discoloration occurs because an abnormal spasm of the blood vessels causes a diminished blood supply to the local tissues. Initially, the digit(s) involved turn white because of the diminished blood supply. The digit(s) then turn blue because of prolonged lack of oxygen. Finally, the blood vessels reopen, causing a local “flushing” phenomenon, which turns the digit(s) red. This three-phase color sequence (white to blue to red), most often upon exposure to cold temperature, is characteristic of RP.

I had this bad in both hands but, when the hands were not purple or discolored, the fingertips were red, inflamed and sensitive to touch.  I taped my fingers because this protected me from touching something and going through the roof – or to the moon – with pain.  Was this the case with MJ?  I don’t know.  He taped the fingers on his right hand, I taped fingers on my left hand.  He could have turned his painful ordeal into a fashion statement, like the hats and aviator sunglasses he needed to wear to protect his scalp and eyes from UV light.

In December 2002, MJ began walking with crutches and his left foot was wrapped in bandages.  He said this was due to swelling from what he described as a spider bite.  It’s possible or was this something else.  With Lupus SLE anything is possible, gout, swelling of the ankles or heels of the feet, and if the immune system is in overdrive, any infection will go in to outer space in a New York minute.  Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.  Again, if he had Lupus SLE, this would be another item to add to the shopping cart

Stress And Lupus

Now, let’s go to 2005 and the trial in Santa Maria.  Stress will shoot Lupus SLE into orbit as well.  Flares are a lupus sufferer’s worst enemy and I suspect MJ had many of them during the trial.  I was there the day he jumped atop the SUV and began dancing.  That day was the beginning of the trial, however, as the trial wore on, MJ got sicker and sicker.  He had back pain, was hospitalized briefly and appeared at court in his pajamas.  At that time I had been diagnosed with Lupus SLE and wondered if the talk of MJ having Lupus beyond Discoid Lupus was true.  He was certainly displaying all of the signs of a person with Lupus SLE.  By the end of that trial MJ was spent, both mentally and physically. Stress is bad on a body generally, with Lupus SLE, stress will literally kill you. 

Pain Medications

I will honestly say I took pain medication prior to my hospitalization and my pain medicine of choice was ibuprofen – also known as Motrin and Advil.  This decreased my pain significantly and I was not taking 200 mg of the drug.  I often popped 800mg at a time.  The joint and muscle pain can be overwhelming and if you have to work, you do what you need to do. Today, I live with the pain because the alternatives are Vicodin and opiates like OxyContin.  I have chosen to leave all of them alone.

In MJ’s case, being a performer, I can see why someone would go for the stronger drugs.  Again, joint and muscle pain can be overwhelming if you don’t know how to deal with it.  With lupus, particularly when you are around those who do not understand the disease, you will be labeled lazy, uncooperative, and so much more if you complain of something no one can see.

Getting up in the morning for a person with severe Lupus SLE can be one hard road to tow.  You’re tired, you have joint and muscle pain, you feel as if you haven’t slept in days, there is this 40 pound or more weight on your body and gravity is the heaviest of the weights.  You really would like to stay in bed all day and not move.  Anyone with the means to do this will start their day with an upper of some sort to get them going and then a pain pill of their choosing to silence the pain.  If you are a performer, business person, or someone who has to move and do every single day of your life, this is breakfast. 

With lupus, you have to stay under a doctor’s care.  You cannot self medicate because what worked last week or last year may cause you great harm today.  Depending on where the flare is attacking your body, particularly if you become severely anemic as I learned earlier this year, something you thought might work might kill you.

Then There’s The Food Thing

To add something else as well and again, this is pure speculation.  I don’t eat much either.  Some of the medications I take cause me a lot of stomach discomfort and I’ve been hung over the porcelain throne throwing up meals.  I am not anorexic or bulimic but you just don’t want to eat when you think you’re going to suffer stomach upset as a result.  Food becomes less appealing.  You can only swallow so many Tums a day and if you are an active person, eating on the run can present one horrible set of circumstances when you’re feeling queasy.  Not eating is also bad for your heart.  We have to force ourselves to do it.

I heard MJ had a personal chef at one point, don’t know if he could afford it in recent years but some of the food out here will kill you too and MJ seemed very aware of this.  You really become a funny eater after being diagnosed with Lupus SLE.  If you’re not, you could do great damage.

Summary

I have to give MJ a lot of credit for incorporating fashion and function.  He taped his fingers and made it a style.  He might have been masking the redness of his fingertips or protecting his fingers from the pain one would feel from Raynauds when handling microphones.  Dropping the mic and screaming would not have been cute.  He also wore hats and sunglasses to protect himself from harmful UV rays and he incorporated these into his fashion garb. He wore casts, braces and kneepads to possibly protect against the pain from arthritis.  It makes good sense to me, particularly the knee pads, I’d like to have a few of those myself.

Allan Metzger is a lupus specialist who went with Michael Jackson on his HIStory tour in 1996/97.  In this picture Michael Jackson and Dr. Allan Metzger attend the ‘Light the Way for Lupus’ L.A. benefit at the Beverly Hills Hotel on October 1, 2003 in California. The event was sponsored by the Lupus Research Institute. http://www.life.com/image/2555006

In closing, Lupus DLE and SLE is not nice.  There’s a lot of suffering with this disease.  You will have good days and bad days and the bad days can be rough.  Depending on how you manage the disease, you can either live a long and healthy life or a life filled with pain and discomfort brought on by other medications like opiates or excessive use of painkillers, uppers and whatever else is out there.  If you are a person who has a stressful profession and you cannot and will not slow your role as they say, the stress can and will kill you.

You have to watch fats, sugars, caffeine intake, the amount of protein and sodium, and other chemicals that can be harmful.  Depending on what medications you are taking, you may not be able to eat or drink certain foods or juices.  Over-the-counter remedies must be looked at carefully along with exercise and the amount of exercise you are doing.  Then there are days when you will just have to stay in bed and get plenty of rest.  Then there are the days when you will have to cancel all commitments because the body can’t take it.

Additionally, you have to learn to not listen to a lot of folks, particularly those who don’t know a thing about Lupus.  Folks may call you lazy, uncooperative, crazy, faking, and God only knows what.  They are not paying your bills and they are not living in your body.  Distance yourself from them.  Others will tell you it’s mind over matter and will try to make you feel bad for not going with them somewhere.  Limit the amount of poison in your life and that includes people.  If you’re married to them, lock them out of the house.

Today, I’m feeling well thank you and I’m on a chemo drug called Cytoxan.  In seven months, if all is well, I’ll probably still feel well.  And then, I may not.  I may be on another drug then and I’ll be tired and listless again.  Who knows.  But, in the end, I do know what I need to do for me and that’s what matters, not what others say or think.  There are folks right now who are very angry with me for not performing or doing at the level of what I was once able to do.  I ain’t doing it and I ain’t killing myself for someone else.  I cannot do a lot of things now and no amount of verbal pushing will make me do it.  The answer is no.  I am thankful I was able to live long enough to appreciate the word “NO”.

If only Michael could have said “NO” to that beast Randy Phillips who insisted that Michael rehearsed every day as if it were any of his business! Michael knew his songs inside out and didn’t have to dance and sing at every rehearsal – instead he needed to save up his energy for the 50 concerts they forced on him and deceived him into! If Phillips hadn’t demanded an everyday rehearsal,  Michael would have been saved from the mounting stress and would have slept at night, and if he had slept he would still be alive now.  I pray that the Heavens avenge Michael, and that Randy Phillips’ deeds fall on his own head one day. Simple justice is all we are asking for.

The above patient’s account answers lots of questions about Michael. Do you remember his complaints about pains in his back which no one really believed and Rabbi Schmuley ruthlessly advised him not to medicate? Doesn’t it remind you of the pains in the joints lupus patients suffer from?

And do you remember everyone thinking him weird for using umbrella in broad sun-light – though it is a complete must for all lupus patients whether it is DLE or SLE?

Or him being sometimes confined to a wheelchair which was probably due to flares which are also typical of lupus?

And even taping his fingers which everyone thought was a stage whim while the reason for that could the unhealthy color of his nails or even dealing with the pain when he was holding a microphone!

The left hand of Michael Jackson taken at the Guinness World Records event in 2006

I was also wondering about those nails and remember the media screaming about them being “a manicurist’s worst nightmare”. They attributed it to everything including AIDS and skin cancer except the most probable cause for it which is lupus.

This piece has been selected out of many as it presented the problem in the most decent way:

Dr. Klein Makes a Statement, February 1993

After Michael Jackson eluded to Oprah in 1993 that he had a skin disease, Jackson instructed his dermatologist, Dr. Arnold Klein, to release an official statement disclosing the King of Pop’s Vitiligo pigmentation disorder. The New York Times quoted from the statement that Dr. Klein gave the Associated Press, stating that Vitiligo is not contagious, but results from a loss of skin pigmentation. In the months prior to Jackson’s death, Michael made frequent visits to Klein’s Beverly Hills offices. Dr. Klein’s website states that the Dame Elizabeth Taylor was a dear friend of his. Incidentally, Debbie Rowe was a nurse for the skin doctor around the time Michael became a patient.

Author John Randall Taraborrelli attempts to explain Jackson’s course of treatment in the biography entitled Michael Jackson: The Man and the Madness. He says that Michael Jackson had been diagnosed with Vitiligo and Lupus; however, the Lupus apparently went into remission at some point. These conditions perhaps lowered Jackson’s tolerance to the sun. This would explain why Michael was seen dressed head to toe, wearing gloves (not the glitter glove) and sunglasses. He also carried a Mary Poppins like umbrella at times. Allegedly, the doctor combated these illnesses with Solaquin, Retin A and Benoquin.

He also had hydroxychloroquin injected directly into his scalp regularly. The treatments he used for his condition further lightened his skin tone. That combined with skin leveling makeup made Jackson appear relatively pale.

An outward indicator of Michael Jackson’s Lupus, Vitiligo, and other possible health problems can be seen in his fingernails. They appear brown or dark beneath the nails all the way back to photos of his Thriller days. In the last six months or so of his life, news reports actually attested to the dastardly state of the pop singer’s hands.

Changes in the fingernails can signify a fungal infection or a systemic disease like Lupus or anemia.

http://hubpages.com/hub/MichaelJacksonVitiligotreatments

Discoloration of nails is typical of lupus

If you have a closer look at some of Michael’s photos you will indeed see that his nails are an unnatural brown which might indeed be a sign of systemic lupus.

Doctors state that even the malar butterfly rash seen on the face of Michael Jackson sometime in 1983 may be a sign of systemic lupus:

“The malar rash or butterfly rash occurs in association with systemic lupus erythematosus. It is seen in up to 2/3 of patients with systemic disease and may be the presenting feature in up to 40%. It may vary in degree from a mild redness or “rosy cheeks”, to multiple swollen red areas or plaques.

http://www.skincareguide.com/sc/lupus/types_of_lupus.html

The ‘classical’ skin problem in lupus is the butterfly rash. This type of rash tends to occur in the systemic form of the diseasetoo where other organs in the body are also involved.

In fact out of the main symptoms of systemic lupus Michael surely had at least half:

Victory only! Even despite the nails…

The symptoms of lupus differ from one person to another. Some people have just a few symptoms, while others have many. Some of the more common symptoms of lupus include:

  • Achy joints (arthralgia)
  • Unexplained fever (more than 100 degrees Fahrenheit)
  • Swollen joints (arthritis)
  • Prolonged or extreme fatigue
  • Skin rash
  • Ankle swelling and fluid accumulation
  • Pain in the chest when breathing deeply (pleurisy)
  • A butterfly-shaped rash across the cheeks and nose
  • Hair loss
  • Sensitivity to the sun and/or other light
  • Seizures
  • Mouth or nose sores
  • Pale or purple fingers or toes from cold or stress (Raynaud’s phenomenon)

http://lupus.webmd.com/arthritis-lupus

The majority of lupus patients are intolerant to sunlight:

  • The main way in which lupus sufferers can help themselves is to avoid sun exposure. This means covering up with long sleeves and trousers in the sunlight and wearing a hat if out in the sun for any length of time. The use of UV film on windows may also be necessary for those who are particularly sun-sensitive. If a rash develops that does not clear up rapidly then it should be reported to the doctor as soon as possible as a delay in treatment may result in scarring. http://www.uklupus.co.uk/fact8.html

Scarring, always scarring… Even a simple stay in the sunlight could result in scarring! And these demanded cosmetic procedures again and again… How often did the media and general public laugh and call Michael weird when they saw him wearing long sleeves and trousers even on the beach? If I were in their place I would die of shame for what they said about him then and keep saying of him now.

A terrible thing about lupus is once a person falls ill with it, it NEVER goes away. Only some 6% of patients may have achieved that goal and Michael couldn’t fall into that category as his condition was aggravated by vitiligo as another autoimmune disease. This means he suffered from lupus till the end of his life.

See this question from a hopeful lupus patient and the flat “no” given to him by a doctor:

  • Q. “Does lupus always eventually go into remission?
  • A: The simple answer is no. The more complex answer is that, for the majority of patients, the disease is characterized by periods of flares (i.e., active disease) and periods where things are relatively quiescent (i.e., inactive disease). In the latter situation, quiescence is usually achieved with medication. Remission may be harder to define. One definition is that there are no symptoms, the patient is taking no medications, and all tests — including the antinuclear antibodies — become normal. In my study published 20 years ago, fewer than 6 percent of patients achieved that goal”. http://www.lupus.org/webmodules/webarticlesnet/templates/new_communityexperts.aspx?articleid=604&zoneid=96

When Michael died some of the media finally acknowledged that Michael was indeed ill with these diseases he always said he was ill with. Dr. Robert Lahita of the Newark Beth Israel Center was invited to Good Morning America on July 9th, 2009 and explained to Diane Sawyer that what all of us considered to be Michael’s “weirdness” was actually the natural result of his vitiligo and lupus:

THEY WANTED HIM WEAK. BUT HE WAS STRONG

We all knew how much psychological pain Michael had to go through due to media harassment, ridicule and unjust accusations but after learning how many maladies Michael had to fight and how much physical pain he had to put up with I will fully agree with Arnold Klein that Michael was one of the strongest persons we have ever seen:

KING: Do you think, Dr. Klein, that he could have done 50 concerts?
KLEIN: I think he was in great physical condition. I think the autopsy showed that he was in great physical condition.

And I think he was — you know, he was not this person without a nose that was portrayed initially in the press. The press has been hysterical and the press has been so sensational about me, about everything. There is no truth in the press anymore. I mean there’s no truth anywhere anymore in what you read.

So I think he was totally capable of doing this. But they wanted to show him as a meek individual. Michael was far from meek. Michael was probably one of the most talented, and strong people I’ve ever met.”

Michael was indeed one of the strongest persons all of us have ever seen. He went through 30 years of unheard of media harassment, was hounded as an animal, dealt with grave injustice every instance of his life and lived with the anguish of constant human betrayal – however he stoically faced it all and still managed to survive.

It was in these impossible circumstances that he managed to beat his addiction to Demerol which wasn’t his choice but was forced on him by irresponsible doctors who didn’t give a damn about the consequences of the drug they were giving him.

And now we have finally noticed that Michael also had to live with two terrible diseases which gave him extreme embarrassment and lots of physical pain, scars and suffering, all of which he concealed from us by his hat, wigs, umbrella and a smile.

Frankly I cannot even imagine that anyone could cope with so much in his life. No, none of us would have been able to take even a fraction of it – including those haters who boast that they are really tough guys in comparison with a ‘meek and pitible’ creature they think Michael Jackson was. No, if these ‘tough’ guys ever encountered a small fraction of what Michael had to go through, they would have broken down long ago and would be crying like babies in situations where Michael Jackson staunchly kept going –  dancing, singing, writing fantastic music and helping others to survive.

Will it be a decent question to ask now how many plastic surgeries Michael underwent after we learned about a double operation on his broken nose, scars from a burn on his scalp, texture expanders under his skin, cutting out balding spots in his hair, treating a butterfly rash on his face and taking away the thick crust from his head?

Will it be still okay to make fun of his nose now that we know that lupus could have resulted in a necrosis of his skin and probably cartilage which is probably why he often appeared in public with a tape on his nose?

Should we still doubt that by the year 2003 when Michael was interviewed by Bashir the most number of his cosmetic surgeries had been two or probably three – while the rest of them were devoted to minimising the damage done by the accident, lupus and the very limited number of  plastic operations proper he really had?

Even the above enumeration of Michael’s health problems shows that the number of surgeries, cosmetic procedures and other instances of necessary and unnecessary meddling with Michael’s health must have been innumerable – only I would like to look in the face of a person who will dare make nasty jokes after being confronted with so much human suffering.

And all those questions about “Michael having surgery out of “black self-hatred” somehow fall off by themselves too, don’t they?

Photo comparisons by Anne Valle

The photo comparisons made by Anne Valle show that there wasn’t any dramatic difference between the way Michael looked in the early 90s and the later years in his life – so I hope this will close the subject of the “50 plastic operations” he had.

Michael could have had 50, 100 or 200 cosmetic procedures due to his terrible skin condition but it doesn’t mean he was having that much plastic surgery!

The majority of it was just a necessity. Everything he did had a reason for it and was not done just for fun …

Let us be human and accept the truth of it at last.

Did he change that much? This experiment shows that the didn’t (http://www.tribute2michael.eu/looks.html)

UPDATED March 5th, 2012 

Sanemjfan made the following addition to VMJ’s post:

Here is a video I recorded last week from a story on ABC’s 20/20 about America’s obsession with plastic surgery, and in it the doctor talks about some phony nonsense about blacks not wanting to “erase” their ethinic features because of the “Michael Jackson phenomenon”, and my good friend LunaJo67 combined it with a story from Nightline that aired shortly after he died where a very unprofessional doctor passes “judgement’ over MJ’s surgeries, and just goes overboad in her analysis!  They should all be ASHAMED of themselves! That doctor is the LAST person who should be judging the ways other look!

And here is a clip from “Life of an Icon” documentary where a doctor thoroughly explains the extent of MJ’s scalp burns, and the ballooning procedure used to treat it!

And here’s a photo to really put MJ’s scalp burns into perspective!

 

 

417 Comments leave one →
  1. Angie permalink
    October 1, 2014 4:06 am

    Thank you. You are the best. I appreciate it 🙂 <3.

    Like

  2. Angie permalink
    September 30, 2014 11:21 pm

    Thank you. I tried to find a topic where I could ask this question, but I couldn’t find one, and this post was the best related of what I was asking about, so I posted here.

    Again, thank you for your help, I appreciate it <3.

    Like

  3. lynande51 permalink
    September 30, 2014 8:35 pm

    And like Susannerb said nice try. It would have been better if you had not asked MJ Facts about what they think 3 days before you came here. Were they able to give you an answer?

    Like

  4. lynande51 permalink
    September 30, 2014 8:31 pm

    Angie actually the lyrics both above and below those tell a little but more about it and I read an analysis of it by Joe Vogel in Huffington Post. I will leave the link to the article.
    Another thing I take into consideration when I read his lyrics is what he is living through at the time. That is what stimulates most poetry which is what lyrics are.
    At the time he wrote this song he had gone through rehab for pain killer addiction, been through the allegations and was married to Lisa.It was later in their marriage and they were not getting along mostly because Lisa was afraid that he was using the drug again.This led to arguments between them and he was hurt that she did not believe him.
    He also write openly about the good feeling they give you. He also is angry about all of the rumors that circulate about him and what they say.
    That is my take on the lyrics and Joe Vogel’s take on the song as a whole. I hope it helps.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joe-vogel/michael-jackson-man-in-th_b_221797.html

    Like

  5. susannerb permalink*
    September 30, 2014 3:59 pm

    Angie, nice try, but Helena is not here at the moment and her concerns are in a different place right now than in dissecting Michael’s music. The focus of this blog is not the interpretation of Michael’s art. We have another blog of fellow MJ advocates who are specialized in the interpretation and analysis of Michael Jackson’s art. So I suggest you turn to the “Dancing with the Elephant” blog with your questions. It’s not even necessary to write a post about “Morphine” because they already have talked about the song in this conversation and give a lot of very good explanations:
    http://dancingwiththeelephant.wordpress.com/2014/03/13/1723/

    I hope this is of help for you.

    Like

  6. Angie permalink
    September 28, 2014 10:31 pm

    Helena, before I say anything, first let me say this, please don’t assume I’m a troll because I’m not, I’ve been a fan of MJ sense I was 9 years old, a die-hard fan. I love Michael Jackson so much. So let me clear that out for you before you assume I’m a troll. I ask questions out of concern because I love Michael Jackson.

    Okay Helena, I have a question regarding MJ’s ‘Morphine’ song, I have to say it’s very troubling in my opinion, I really don’t like the song at all though it sounds beautiful on the slow part. Anyway, I’m literally begging you Helena, yes, literally begging you to do a post on MJ’s ‘Morphine’ song, because some of the lyrics I really don’t like and don’t know what MJ meant by them.

    In MJ’s morphine song it has these lyrics:

    You got place baby
    Kicked in the face baby
    You hate your race baby
    You’re not the liar

    What did MJ mean by saying “You hate you’re race baby”? And after that he says “You’re not the liar”. What does he mean by “You’re not the liar”?

    Can you please do a post on this song Helena? Please. Thank you <3.

    Like

  7. J5master permalink
    July 25, 2014 7:49 pm

    Every one should read this article. I’m a long time fan who never believed any of the stuff they wrote about MJ but this article puts it all in perspective, even for me. I always knew MJ was strong, but this really captures just HOW strong. WOW!

    Like

  8. Ja Ja permalink
    May 8, 2014 9:07 am

    She said it was something she did. But she was very appalled at it, indicating that it must’ve been a lie, and she stated it led to Michael firing Karen, if I remember that correctly.

    Like

  9. Angie permalink
    May 8, 2014 12:08 am

    Ja Ja, did Pearl Jr. tell you what Karen said about MJ was a lie, or did she just say it was something Karen did?

    Like

  10. Anthonia permalink
    April 24, 2014 12:28 pm

    As a former fan who believed some of the stories out there, it is with shame that I write this. I am suffering from an autoimmune disease and started researching lupus. The minute I saw one of Micheal’s pictures I knew he had it…it was already too late…He was dead. I can say having an autoimmune disorder is no joke and unfortunately for people in the limelight, there is always someone prepared to make money out of you. if you die or lose your money, they move on to the next victim. Unfortunately for Micheal, allegations of abuse never goes away as only 2 people can really say what went on. If this were not involved, I am sure there would have been a credible journalist willing to make a documentary cataloging his illness and subsequent consequences. If he was innocent (i am not making a judgement on the case), I hope one day the accusers can look within themselves to come forward.

    Like

  11. anny permalink
    March 22, 2014 10:41 am

    To JaJa, this is the kind of stuff that eventually put Michael in a very marginalized and vulnerable position. So he was isolated from his family and friends and surrounded by people who care nothing about Michael as a human being but a money maker. No one is perfect. Karen Faye is a friend and long time employer of MJ, Pearl Jr is a loyal fan of MJ who was there to support Michael during his trial, They all have their own opinions and their way to love Michael….and remember Michael. And Michael loves his family, esp his parents. His mother taught him compassion and Christian values, and his father taught him to be a tough and badass man. Because of his father, he was strong enough to fight against injustice in the media and in American society and judicial system. By the way, the main message of Michael Jackson is to unite people to do something good for our future generations( ie our children). He loves everyone including people who are not even kind to him. He started with himself and his own family and he befriended with other families, trying to bring people together.

    Like

  12. Ja Ja permalink
    October 6, 2013 10:27 am

    First of all, I have to apologize for bringing this up. It might be disturbing on several levels. The thing is, I once started skimming through that Kindle book Pearl Jr. published shortly after Michael passed, and she has a whole lot of negative things to say about Karen Faye. Okay, that is mutual, as we know… Anyway, she claims that she has seen emails in which Karen claimed Michael had been taught by his parents to dislike his race… I wrote Pearl an email, and she told me Karen was spreading that kind of stuff about Michael when she wasn’t getting paid. I have never had the nerve to ask Karen about it… She is just way too sulky and arrogant for my taste. However, I’d be interested to know whether anybody HAS ever confronted her about it.

    Like

  13. Angie permalink
    September 21, 2013 3:07 pm

    Beautifully said Helena. Well, eventually one day you will be completely well. We’re praying for you always. God bless you <3.

    Like

  14. September 21, 2013 12:33 pm

    Angie,thank you for the good wishes. Out of all your recommendations getting plenty of rest is the most difficult task because the trial is going on and is drawing to its finale – so it needs a certain concentration of attention now. When it is over the only thing that will remain for me will be to analyze several testimonies and then I will probably consider my mission over.

    It is then that I will try to take care of myself and other Michael’s followers will hopefully take his legacy further. There are so many ways to implement Michael’s hopes, and so many spheres of life to be daring and innovative and be pioneers in. Much work and lots of changes need to be made in our respective parts of the world – all in MJ’s spirit and all of them for the sake of God’s final triumph.

    Now we know how much one person only is capable of doing, don’t we?

    Like

  15. Angie permalink
    September 21, 2013 11:50 am

    Helena I know how you feel, well at least to some degree. I broke my right arm in 2006, including my right hand, and I was right handed, so you can imagine how hard that was to do anything. I was in such pain. I got a cast on my arm, and I was suppose to have surgery on my hand, but I was too afraid because I never had an operation before. When my arm eventually healed, my hand didn’t because I didn’t have an operation on it like I was suppose to. With me being young, they said my hand would eventually heal even if you don’t get the surgery, in which it eventually did, thank God. But it took several months. So Helena, even if it takes several months for you to heal, you will eventually heal. And if you eat a healthy diet like raw fruits and vegetables, drink plenty of fresh water, and get plenty of rest, you will be well in no time. I heard raw ‘Turmeric’ is extremely good for inflammation, one of the best things out there for inflammation. We’ll keep you in our prayers Helena for a speedy recovery. God bless you <3.

    Like

  16. September 21, 2013 10:05 am

    HI HELENA!!!!!!! I MISSED YOU:)- Tatum
    “Hello Helena! You’re back! We missed you. I’m glad you’re well now.” – Angie

    Thank you, girls, but I am far from well yet. My both hands are still in a cast and only fingers are working. There will be a long recovery period with a spike to be taken out of my arm. The left arm will take months to recover, but with the trial being in the final stage I cannot wait that long. So today I’ve tried to gather information for the last week of testimonies there and will hopefully make a post with minimal comment on my part – just to see where we are.

    Like

  17. Angie permalink
    September 21, 2013 12:19 am

    Hello Helena! You’re back! We missed you. I’m glad you’re well now. We appreciate you for all your hard work in vindicating MJ. You helped us learn truth on MJ, and we love you for it <3.

    And yes, I agree regarding people to express their views on MJ, and letting them show their true selves to the other readers. But they too have the opportunity to read all the materials provided in this and other blogs about MJ’s lupus, Vitiligo, his burn and back injury, etc. And if they choose to still stick to crazy stereotypes or not read anything but still repeat their mantras, in both cases, I also agree to give them all the rope to hang themselves with, lol.

    Anyway, we're so happy you're well again. God bless you <3.

    Like

  18. September 20, 2013 11:31 pm

    HI HELENA!!!!!!! I MISSED YOU:)

    Like

  19. September 20, 2013 4:20 pm

    “‘MaxPayne’ I was only asking a question. I don’t know if he was a victim or not. You shouldn’t even come here if you don’t like MJ. Why did you type in ‘Vindicating Michael Jackson’ and leave a comment if you do not like him, and believe the media lies? Go else where if you feel that way about MJ.”- Angie

    Angie, I allow everyone to express their views on MJ unless they call him a ped-le and I don’t drive people away from here.

    When people read all the materials provided in this and other blogs about MJ’s lupus, vitiligo, his burn and back injury or testimonies from Dr. Richard Strick, the doctor working for the government in 1993/94 who reviewed Michael’s medical records and said MJ’s all nose surgeries were due to complications from lupus – and after reading all that they are still saying a lot of nonsense – well, let them show their true selves to the other readers.

    If they read all information and still stick to crazy stereotypes, this is one grave case. If they choose not to read anything but still repeat their mantras this is another grave case. In both cases I prefer to give them all the rope to hang themselves with.

    Like

  20. Angie permalink
    September 19, 2013 8:31 pm

    ‘MaxPayne’ I was only asking a question. I don’t know if he was a victim or not. You shouldn’t even come here if you don’t like MJ. Why did you type in ‘Vindicating Michael Jackson’ and leave a comment if you do not like him, and believe the media lies? Go else where if you feel that way about MJ.

    This site is for the vindicating of MJ, diminishing the lies said about him, etc. And no, his disease did not cause him to get a nose job. He had a nose job before the disease. But I do know that after he got Lupus, that may have been the cause of other nose jobs. Either way, no matter how many nose jobs MJ got, he wasn’t trying to be white. All of his siblings got nose jobs, and they’re not trying to be white. You don’t here the Press and Media lies and rumors about MJ’s siblings trying to be white, that’s b/c they have black skin. Well, MJ was just the same before he got Vitiligo. No one ever said that MJ was trying to be white, not until after he got Vitiligo, so be quite. And the reason why MJ’s nose job turned out the way it did, b/c he had a too wide of a nose. The only way to make that too wide nose any smaller was to narrow it down, how else would he be able to narrow it down? So it wasn’t that he was trying to have European features, he just trying to achieve a smaller nose. Narrowing the nose down was his only option to make his nose any smaller b/c his nose was too wide. I swear MJ is so misunderstood.

    And it should tell you something when MJ got other nose jobs after he had already had the narrow nose look. MJ wasn’t trying to have European features, he was trying to have a smaller nose, which is why after he had already had the narrow nose look, he got a couple more nose jobs. Not because his nose was still wide, but he felt it was still large, which is why he may have got that upward look of the nose, b/c he felt his nose was still to big by it being to long like Pinocchio. Yes, MJ had a couple of nose jobs, but I believe the rest had to do with having Lupus. This is why MJ said he only had 2 nose jobs, b/c those 2 were for beauty purposes, while all the rest were for repairing due to Lupus.

    MJ wasn’t stupid, he knew he didn’t look appealing after all those plastic surgeries, which is why he said “I look like a lizard, I look like, it’s horrible. I don’t like it, I never like it. That’s why I wish I could never be photographed or seen and I push myself to go to the things that we go to”. So there you have it. This is why I believe MJ wasn’t getting those other nose jobs for beauty purposes, except for the first 2, but for repairing purposes due to Lupus.

    If MJ looked like he did with Thriller, no one would of ever said he was trying to be white, no matter how many nose jobs he got. It’s b/c of his skin condition, Vitiligo, which is why people said MJ was trying to be white, an that he could not help. It was confirmed in MJ’s autopsy that MJ had Vitiligo. You either believe the Press and Media, or the Pathologist who actually checked MJ’s dead body. I don’t care what you say, I know the truth and so does the rest of his many fans. I really don’t care what you believe, that’s your opinion, and you are entitled to your opinion, just as I. Nice talking to you. Goodbye. 🙂

    Like

  21. MaxPayne permalink
    September 19, 2013 5:38 am

    what about his nose then … did the dieseas also forced him to Change his appearence? … just silly to see someone liek him as kind of an victim, he was like every Popstar, rich, arogant, perverted … thats what Money lets you become

    Like

  22. Angie permalink
    September 13, 2013 4:51 pm

    ‘Helena’, after watching this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMDsmQoCgUE, oh my gosh, I don’t know what to think. This is crazy. Do you think MJ was infected with vitiligo!?

    Like

  23. August 19, 2013 8:05 am

    “I am wondering if anyone else has *verified information about Randy Phillips car being found at the scene of the murder in the morning before authorities were called. This has come up with people attending the trial. Also what ever happened to the delio emails/hard drive?” – Mary

    Mary, I haven’t heard anything yet, so am afraid that AEG cleaned Frank Dileo’s computer inside out. But look, the very fact that they took his computer into their possession and erased a lot there shows that they have a lot to hide. When you are honest you are not afraid that a third party’s computer will do you any damage. Isn’t it even strange that a person dies and someone comes and takes his computer away? And then assumes the role of this person’s attorney though his widow never asked for it? She was amazed to learn that Mr. Putnam was representing her interests at one point.

    “I feel that more will revealed as to exactly what happened and who was behind it. I also feel that Michael wants this information out and his children unburdened. And safeguarded from the same element that surrounds them now”

    I feel the same.

    Like

  24. mary permalink
    August 18, 2013 4:28 pm

    God I love you guys! You post the best, most thorough information!!! I am new to posting so please excuse..this is off topic. I am wondering if anyone else has *verified information about Randy Phillips car being found at the scene of the murder in the morning before authorities were called. This has come up with people attending the trial. Also what ever happened to the delio emails/hard drive? I feel that more will revealed as to exactly what happened and who was behind it. I also feel that Michael wants this information out and his children unburdened. And safeguarded from the same element that surrounds them now,

    As per the topic, yes he had lupus and numerous afflictions he chose not to make public. And no Katherine did not know close to everything. He suffered in silence and never raised his sword against his enemies. God bless him!!!

    Like

  25. lynande51 permalink
    August 18, 2013 8:47 am

    Kaarin there is a possibility that Michael was given Plaquenil an anti malaria for a flare of his discoid lupus. Plaquenil is used to treat a flare in almost any auto immune disorder from Lupus to Chron’s disease to Rheumatoid arthritis so it could have been given for his discoid lupus.

    Like

  26. Greet permalink
    August 18, 2013 4:09 am

    Carol, Mrs Jackson absolutely does not recall everything about Michael, and I am even sure she does not know every detail of his life either, far from it.

    Like

  27. August 17, 2013 9:37 am

    Yes,Lyn,SLE is a very serious illness.Somehow from somewhere I have the impression that Michael was given this anti-malarial medication used to prevent or medicate SLE.
    People with DLE have a 5% risk of developing SLE.Michael had “dancers feet” and some problems with his joints.Artrithis or arthrosis. Dr. Mezger treated those for him.

    Like

  28. lynande51 permalink
    August 17, 2013 8:28 am

    Here is a link to a photo of a Keloid scar.

    Like

  29. lynande51 permalink
    August 17, 2013 8:24 am

    The ‘blister on my lungs” was pleurisy. That was confirmed by Michael himself in Moonwalker.
    If Michael Jackson had SLE in his respiratory system he would never have been able to perform the way he did during the Dangerous and History tours. Each time he would have pushed himself to that extent it would have brought on a “flare” and he would not have been able to continue with those tours past the first day.
    Michael had something called a Keloid scar which is raised, thick and tight. This type of scar is more prevalent in people with dark skin.
    I think the article was well researched and Debbie Rowe’s testimony back up everything that has been said about Michael’s skin. He had acne with scarring, he filled those scars with collagen or Klein did. He had DLE which would be exacerbated by surgeries and would require even more treatment and that seem to be exactly what happened. The only thing that is missing in this post is a photo of a keloid scar so people have an idea what they look like.

    Like

  30. August 17, 2013 5:28 am

    I recall that when Michael was making the movie, The Wizard of Oz he made the comment:; I have a blister on my lung.That could have been what? SLE?

    Like

  31. carol permalink
    August 17, 2013 1:52 am

    You really need to do proper research if you want to post something of this nature and mostly before you reply to questions….If you read the autopsy report it stated MJ had lupus in his lungs it just isn’t in Arnie Klein’s reports….Also as far as his surgery’s his first nose job was cosmetic..his mother has said and I tend to believe she knows better then any of us also according to the autopsy MJ had many surgeries from a facelift to liposuction…. I would believe that vs photos…If your going to go to put so much time into defending MJ please get the correct information

    Like

  32. June 5, 2013 6:24 am

    “But my question is, why was it not documented in his autopsy that MJ had Lupus, if he had it? It was documented that he had Vitiligo in his autopsy, why not Lupus?” – Angie

    Because lupus does not display itself in an obvious manner. It masquerades as many other diseases (athritis, for example) and to be able to find it it’s necessary to make a good deal of very complicated tests. It is not something you see with a naked eye, like vitiligo. It often takes years to diagnose it. For Dr. Rogers to find it he must have made a series of special tests – biopsy of Michael’s skin (as Klein did when he diagnosed it), special blood tests, etc.

    Discoid lupus was in Klein’s medical records and verified by Dr. Richard Strick in 1993 when he was doing it at the request of Sneddon. It was Richard Strick who told us that further operations on Michael’s nose had to be made because of complications due to lupus. And the fact that later Michael was treated by Dr. Metzger, a specialist on systemic lupus, makes me think that Michael’s problem with lupus was deeper than the discoid one.

    Lupus displays itself not as a specific disease – it is simply a reason for other diseases. In the same way if during the autopsy cancer is found no one will look for a reason that it mught have started due to some parasites, radiation or the immune system being damaged due to prolonged stress.

    Like

  33. Angie permalink
    June 4, 2013 10:34 pm

    ‘Helena’, Please disregard my pervious comment asking why MJ never mentioned that he had Lupus, I did not see my comment or your response to my comment. I clicked on ‘newer comment’, and that’s where I found my comment and your response.I apologize. I hate when simple mistakes happen like this, it’s annoying, lol.

    But I do have one more question, because the question I asked previously wasn’t fully answered. I totally agree with you, when you said MJ did not want to disguss his vitiligo because it was personal to him, and he would only be ridiculed for it. That’s why he took so long to tell the world he had vitiligo, because of that very reason.

    But my question is, why was it not documented in his autopsy that MJ had Lupus, if he had it? It was documented that he had Vitiligo in his autopsy, why not Lupus?

    Like

  34. Angie permalink
    June 4, 2013 10:14 pm

    ‘Helena’, can you explain why no one ever documented MJ’s Lupus? And why it wasn’t confirmed in MJ’s autopsy? Lastly, why MJ never mentioned that he had Lupus?

    Like

  35. TatumMarie permalink
    June 4, 2013 7:09 am

    Also, it was none of the worlds businesss what illnesses Michael suffered. The only reason he told us about the vitiligo was because it was very noticeable. On the Oprah interview, he told her he didnt want to go into his medical history because thats something private.

    Like

  36. June 4, 2013 1:35 am

    “MJ himself never even mentioned that he got Lupus, why?”

    Angie, Michael was a shy young man. It took him some ten years or so to acknowledge Vitiligo – he mentioned it only in 1993 many years after it started (sometime during Thriller), and you expected him to acknowledge Lupus too? Speaking about all these illnesses is a very personal thing.

    And what’s the point? No one would have sympathized with him anyway. They would have only ridiculed him for it. Tabloids would have arranged polls asking questions “Do you believe that Wacko Jacko has lupus”? People would have demanded proof.

    What was he to do? Show the crust on his head which was forming due to Lupus? Point at the butterfly mark on his cheeks to prove it? Or even say that it is due to lupus that he has problems with his nose and was probably having necrosis there? Or that his balding spot was not healing due to Lupus? And admit that he was balding and had scalp surgery at all? And was given painkillers because of that?

    With so many health problems Michael was indeed facing and so much animosity towards him, I perfectly understand why Michael preferred to keep silent about it. No one would have believed him anyway and all these useless explanations are extremely humiliating. They would have only added more derogative names to him and that would be it.

    Wacko Jacko. Freak. Monster. And so on and so forth. None of us know what it’s like to see every paper and TV show speaking about you that way for years. It is impossible even to imagine.

    Like

  37. Angie permalink
    June 3, 2013 8:15 pm

    Great article! I know this is an old article, but it hasn’t been read by many people such as myself. I know for sure that MJ had Lupus and Vitiligo, but why were MJ’s vitiligo acknowledged, and not his Lupus? MJ himself never even mentioned that he got Lupus, why?

    Like

  38. Truth Prevail permalink
    February 23, 2013 2:08 am

    @Helena

    “Of course there was a lot of racism in the media’s attitude towards Michael.”

    Yes, but I was not talking about the media for once I was talking about some people who liked MJ when he had dark skin but ignore his other work just because he was not dark skinned anymore.

    Like

  39. February 21, 2013 11:24 pm

    “Imagine refusing to show Michael’s videos like Smooth Criminal, BAD, Black or White and many more because of his skin color it makes me question the motives of people who think like that and the ones who refuse to acknowledge those pieces of art just because of his skin color”.

    Of course there was a lot of racism in the media’s attitude towards Michael.

    Like

  40. Truth Prevail permalink
    February 21, 2013 11:14 pm

    @Helena

    Yes and if you were a fan of Michael;s because of his artistry then the way he looked should not matter to those people.

    Imagine refusing to show Michael’s videos like Smooth Criminal, BAD, Black or White and many more because of his skin color it makes me question the motives of people who think like that and the ones who refuse to acknowledge those pieces of art just because of his skin color.

    Like

  41. February 21, 2013 12:46 am

    “If a white person who has straight hair curls her hair does that mean she is ashamed of being white? It is a stupid logic IMO.” – Truth Prevail

    Oh, absolutely! Thinking like that is overdoing the whole thing and creating only new dogmas.

    “What attracted them to Michael Jackson, Was it because he was a successful BLACK MAN or was it his TALENT. Is the question I would like to ask them.”

    Good question. Essentially it is about what is a priority in evaluating another human being – the color of his skin or his individual characteristics as a person – his talent, achievements, his way of thinking, system of values, everything that makes him a personality. Do I like him just for being black or the kind of a man he is? And if he were not that great a person would I still like him more than others just for being black?

    Whichever way they go these preferences (color, class, social standing, etc.) are no good. In the 20th century we also went through something similar, only it didn’t involve the color of skin, it involved the class a person belonged to and the family he was coming from.

    Working class people were pronounced inherently better than aristocrasy which had oppressed them for centuries, so after the revolution – and for decades too – the working class ‘background’ was chosen as a priority over individual characteristics of a person. In short it was better to be dumb and uneducated but working class, than clever and educated but come from a family of the nobility. After the civil war they were considered enemies who could disrupt the society and return it to where it was before. Practically Stalin’s regime and repressions were based on this idea.

    If you replace these class characteristics with the color of skin, this example will probably become clearer. There should come a time when no preferences at all should be made – in neither of the directions. Equal opportunities for all (crucial point) and only individual characteristics of a person that matter. To me it sounds like an ideal variant. Of course the world is still far from it, but this is how I would really like it to be.

    Like

  42. Truth Prevail permalink
    February 20, 2013 7:36 pm

    The thing is some people just love the idea of thinking MJ was ashamed to be black, If you prove them wrong with the Vitiligo then they they go for his hair or nose, even though he had nose surgery when he had dark skin.

    Personally I don’t see how changing your hair means you are going against your race I mean the people who do think that it is because you are ashamed of your race the same argument can be used against them. If a white person who has straight hair curls her hair does that mean she is ashamed of being white? It is a stupid logic IMO.

    I even came across a article which praised MJ’s Off The Wall & Thriller and it dismissed everything after that because in those eras he still “resembled a black man” The fact that this person/s also refuses to expose his stuff after Off The Wall & Thriller to their kids on the basis of because of Michael’s skin color to be honest says a lot about those people than Michael.

    What attracted them to Michael Jackson, Was it because he was a successful BLACK MAN or was it his TALENT. Is the question I would like to ask them.

    Because the way he looked to them should NOT matter, As long as he still brought out music and the amazing artistry THAT is what should matter.

    Like

  43. February 2, 2013 4:22 pm

    A word about Dr. Alan Metzger.

    He is a lupus specialist rheumatologist and focuses on immunology. I’ve found that his most cited publication is not on Discoid lupus (which Arnold Klein diagnosed Michael with), but on Systemic Lupus. So Dr. Alan Metzger is an immunology specialist on Systemic Lupus!

    Here is the title of the paper which he co-authored together with other scientists:
    “Telomere Shortening and Decreased Replicative Potential, Contrasted by Continued Proliferation of Telomerase-Positive CD8 +CD28 lo T Cells in Patients with Systemic Lupus Erythematosushttp://academic.research.microsoft.com/Publication/29461528/telomere-shortening-and-decreased-replicative-potential-contrasted-by-continued-proliferation-of

    The fact that Dr. Alan Metzger specilizes on Systemic lupus, was accompanying Michael Jackson practically his whole life and that both attended fund-raising events for lupus patients gives reason to suppose that Michael’s lupus was serious enough for Michael to seek help from a specialist on Systemic lupus. He could eventually develop this form of lupus which often happens to the discoid lupus sufferers. And it is only natural that being Michael’s doctor Dr. Alan Metzger would not speak about Michael’s medical problems – it is his speciality in immunology which speaks for itself.


    BEVERLY HILLS – OCTOBER 1: (L to R) Nicole Paxson, recording artist Michael Jackson, Dr. Allan Metzger and his grandson Kailen Metzger, age two and a half attend the Light the Way for Lupus Los Angeles benefit at the Beverly Hills Hotel on October 1, 2003 in Beverly Hills, California. The event was sponsored by the Lupus Research Institute. (Photo by Frederick M. Brown/Getty Images)

    Here is just an idea of what Systemic Lupus is like:

    “A friend of mine was diagnosed with Lupus when she was in high school in the ’70s and almost died. She went to the Mayo Clinic and thankfully, was saved. Treatment involved lifelong consumption of daily cortisone and anti-inflammatory drugs and pain killers, which, in themselves, cause OTHER health problems… Two decades later, she almost died from a blister on her heel from wearing new shoes! The blister got infected and she almost had to have her leg amputated! After three weeks in intensive care, with the aid of intense medication and skin grafts, her body finally “re-booted” itself regarding the infection-fighting, but then she developed water in the lungs instead. Again, she almost died.

    These kinds of things happen to Lupus sufferers all their lives… The simplest things we take for granted as nothing, like a blister on your foot, can become life-threatening for someone with Lupus.

    While therapies have improved somewhat over the years, people with Lupus continue to be in a lot of pain most of their lives… and there is still no cure.”
    http://www.michaeljackson.com/us/node/1114048

    Like

  44. sanemjfan permalink
    January 11, 2013 7:11 am

    On Monday night, the girlfriend of the winning Alabama Crimson Tide quarterback AJ McCarron became an overnight celebrity after she was complimented by the game’s announcers. Katherine Webb is currently “Miss Alabama”, but she was bullied as a child due to her tall height, as well as having vitiligo.

    In this interview, she talks about how having vitiligo affected her, and how advances in the makeup and self-tanning industries help her hide it: http://www.rsvp-montgomery.com/app-programs/meet-katerine-webb Here’s her bio from the Miss Universe page, and her struggle with vitiligo is mentioned in the “fun facts” section at the bottom: http://www.missuniverse.com/missusa/members/profile/651291/year:2012

    Once the media found out about this, the comparisons to MJ were inevitable, as you would imagine because he’s obviously the most famous person to have vitiligo. However, a website called “The Daily Caller” made a snide and offensive remark by referring to vitiligo as “that Michael Jackson disease”. Can you image if someone was diagnosed with testicular cancer, and someone called it “that Lance Armstrong disease”? How disrespectful can you be?!!! http://dailycaller.com/2013/01/09/katherine-webb-captured-our-hearts-so-we-captured-more-photos-of-her-slideshow/gallery_photo1337400154img_7663/

    Like

  45. December 20, 2012 5:37 am

    lynade51, at 5:39 ??? The video has just 4:41 minutes. But , I understand what are you sayin, the colors gives diferent perceptions of the dimensions.

    Like

  46. lynande51 permalink
    December 9, 2012 5:55 am

    Here is a video that comppiles several photos of Michael with the Cascio’s that were never seen before. if you pause it at 5:39 you can see that he nose was still dark which is what i was saying. due to the configurations of the vitiligo and the fact that his nose was still dark is the reason that Michael’s nose always appeared smaller.

    Like

  47. Susan M-S permalink
    December 8, 2012 10:20 pm

    Have any of you seen this piece in the Huffington Post. Tamar Braxton, Toni Braxton’s sister, has vitiligo. Some comments are good, but as usual, the same old ignorance is displayed by many. Why is vitiligo dismissed as not being real? So many have accused Tamar Braxton of “skin-bleaching”. You just can’t reason with those who will not see.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/07/tamar-braxton-vitiligo-skin-bleaching-rumors_n_2259582.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003

    Like

  48. December 7, 2012 11:18 am

    Here is a report about Michael attending the Lupus Fundraiser event. There is nothing extraordinary about it, but the comments following it are – these people know what they are talking of!

    Michael Jackson Attends Lupus Fundraiser
    Posted on October 2, 2003 by popdirt
    Michael Jackson was in attendance at an Evening of Love, Light and Laughter to Benefit Lupus LA and Lupus Research on Wednesday (October 1) at the Beverly Hills Hotel in Beverly Hills, California. Check out pictures from GettyImages and WireImage.
    http://popdirt.com/michael-jackson-attends-lupus-fundraiser/20620/

    Responses to Michael Jackson Attends Lupus Fundraiser

    Charles A. Derrow, MD says:
    June 25, 2009 at 5:54 pm
    It is clear that Mr. Jackson was unwell. If I head Lupus or any of the autoimmune disease’s, that, would have been a large target for bad things to happen. The man would have been in line for any of the inflammatory disease’s which are fellow carriers. It has been shown that Women with Lupus have a huge risk of stroke due to the inflammatory nature nature of disease. It should now be said that he looked sick and that his so called failure to show up or change course or to go to the Hospital. He was sick and he struggled mightily against his infirmities.
    He will be missed.

    Sam says:
    June 26, 2009 at 1:55 pm
    hi, I have been living with lupus also, and its difficult to say if MJ (RIP) was suffering from a flare in his last few days as it mimics so many symptoms. Also, we don’t actually know for sure what his diagnosis were? some say he had lung disease, fractures from dancing on stage, avoided sunlight etc..all point to a possible form of lupus, sle. I am hoping the autopsy is accurate and if this is the case that MJ has suffered from lupus as well as a heart attack, it will bring much needed publicity to the potential killing disease. It has completely ruined my life and I’m 24. Since finding out that MJ had lupus, I feel that I can relate to him on a completely different level, a sort of connection.
    RIP MJ

    Gillian Rowe says:
    June 30, 2009 at 1:50 pm
    I think that the ‘shame’ in all this is the ‘media spin’. Vitiligo alone can have profound psychological affects on mere mortals and I do not know how MJ delt with it as a Star? Likewise, people do not believe MJ had SLE, Lupus, or any underlying chronic health problem. I do, because it so explains a lot of his past. The media spun it for good news, while the reality was staring at everyone in the face, pardon the pun and they chose to ignore it. MJ is one month older than me, I have Psoriasis and Rheumatoid Arthritis, retired ten years ago. I could not do what MJ was expected to do! No I am not a ‘Fan’ just a person who lives with chronic incurable health conditions.

    Jocelyn says:
    July 8, 2009 at 11:43 pm
    I am a 30 year old female who was diagnosed with Lupus about 6 years ago. It took about 3 years to be properly diagnosed. I do remember my life before Lupus. I remember days without pain. I remember days where I had the energy to do what my mind wanted to do. I remember having a quick mind and sharp memory. Now I have what they refer to as Lupus Fog. Lupus affects every part of your life and every part of who you are. I wish that Michael would have opened up about this condition in order to raise awareness and understanding. I have found that very few people know about Lupus and those who do still don’t really understand it. Stress is a huge contributor to flares of Lupus. Once you are diagnosed, Lupus does not leave you. I must always take my medication. I am always in some pain and never who I used to be. Michael Jackson is now out of pain. God Bless him and his family.

    pat says:
    July 9, 2009 at 7:57 am
    had I known he had lupus, would have sent him a copy of “lupus underground” …it saved my life…

    ITHW54 says:
    July 9, 2009 at 11:03 am
    I am a Lupus patient, I understand everything Michael Jackson has gone through physically. Right now I can’t work because I am out on short term disability. It is a crazy disease. Hopefully, with his death more research will be done and more attention will be paid to it. Before I was diagnosed I had pigment change on my fingers, it eventually returned to the normal color. My daughter is now having pigment change on her toes.

    Ingrid says:
    July 9, 2009 at 2:06 pm
    I’m 36 female and I live with lupus too. So if MJ have had lupus it will explain a lot. RIP MJ

    Brenda says:
    July 10, 2009 at 9:19 pm
    I was diagnosed with lupus, fibromyalgia, rheumatoid arthritis about 5 years ago. My doctor gave me some reading information and it included information about Michael Jackson having lupus. Why aren’t we spreading the word about this life crippling disease. Yes, Michael did have a lot of changes made to his physical appearance but what celebrity hasn’t. He also was probably very much ashamed of how discord lupus makes you look. When I first heard of his death, I thought about the lupus first. I understand why he took so many meds. I have to take medication to get me going in the morning, then something to keep me going through the day, and then something to make me sleep. With lupus, lots of sleep meds do not work after a while. Please CNN, let the world know about this disease. Michael is gone now, leave him alone.

    Cynthia says:
    July 16, 2009 at 4:12 am
    My sister has Lupus. I have supported and watched her suffer for the past twenty years. Thank God she has excellent doctors and a very supportive husband. Lupus totally attacks your body and changes your life. I wish the media would focus on the overwhelming difficulties people with Lupus encounter. Life with Lupus is extremely difficult and is HELL. No one understands the pain unless they have walked in the shoes of a Lupus patient. My sister is in constant pain.

    …Michael must have been in overwhelming pain. But the media wants to focus on drug abuse and not rightly on ALL the different overwhelming factors this wonderful person faced everyday. Yet he gave so much to the world. His God given talent, which he used to reach out to mankind across the world like no other person on earth. He was so misunderstood. Micheal, RIP. The most caring and beautiful people, mankind seems to want to destroy. Evil, they let prevail. It’s strange. Again please CNN focus on the Lupus.
    This would be an excellent opportunity to enlighten the world on the impact of Lupus on countless millions of people who live with this terrible disease everyday. But of course, it will not sell or get the network rating like focusing on drug abuse.

    Valerie says:
    July 21, 2009 at 6:10 pm
    Thank you for sharing stories of Lupus unfortunately even after it has been shared that Michael Jackson suffered from Lupus the media wants to portray him as a drug addict. Maybe after all is said and done there will be good that comes out of this tragedy. May MJ rest in painless peace.

    Joanne Kontic says:
    August 24, 2009 at 9:29 pm
    hello everyone.
    I was diagnosed with lupus sle in 2005. A little after since I have been a Michael Jackson fan for a long time 1980′s thriller and all I have been feeling that he has had lupus. The only one that can tell if a person has it is if the person is going through it emotionally or physically. It is very challenging to your mind and body. If you get help you can survive. I felt Michael Jackson was feeling hurt and alone and people were after him and we wanted to be the best because of his poor child hood. if you have lupus you do want to be perfect because sometimes you have the urge that nobody is listening to you. I have that feeling sometime. But it can be controlled.
    It was hard to control with millions of fans good or bad following him day by day. We all need comfort by riches and or music to get away from the chaotic world.
    We will miss him… forever!

    adorashawn says:
    August 28, 2009 at 11:29 am
    I have heard of book that will becoming out in about a month or so. It is suppose to go into detail about Michael and Lupus and vitiligo. It also calls out the media and their portrayal of Michael. I think my friend said the name was Michael Jackson the Book the Media doesn’t Want You to Read. I can’t wait for it to come out finally some truth

    kibbiek says:
    November 13, 2009 at 11:41 pm
    My heart goes out to everyone who know someone or have Lupus. I myself never knew what this disease was until a month ago. I recently tested positive for ANA and doing more test to see if I have Lupus. My second test came out negative. Which I pray to god it stay that way. Stress do play a big role in this disease. I was hospitalized for four days, with a weak heart, lost 8 lbs in a little over a month. Before I retest the second time, I didn’t even look like myself. I looked ill and was weak. I couldn’t move my legs for 20 min in the hospital and had constant chest pain and I’m 28 yrs old. I pray god its not miss diagnosed. Even so, I can only imagine what MJ was going through. And its really sad to hear the media attack him even after he’s gone.

    Toosexyforu21 says:
    March 11, 2010 at 10:10 pm
    HEY Check THIS OUT!!!!! PEEPS
    floacist.wordpress.com/2007/06/10/vitiligo-photos-michael-jackson/

    ray fullman says:
    March 23, 2010 at 8:02 am
    I have had lupus for the past 14 years. I can attest to the fact of the constant pain, fatigue, weakness, and the over all feeling of helplessness. Lupus has caused 2 heart attacks, degenerative bone disease (I have had 2 hip replacements and a spinal fusion). I have severe skin disorders, I have copd, reynaulds disease, cellulitis, and am in constant pain. Like the writer above I have to take meds to begin my day, meds during the day, and meds at night. (16 pills a day). And still in constant pain.

    http://popdirt.com/michael-jackson-attends-lupus-fundraiser/20620/

    Like

  49. December 7, 2012 10:49 am

    Have you ever read the tribute that the Lupus LA organization posted on their website after MJ died? http://www.lupusla.org/news/la/09-jackson.php

    David, I knew that Michael attended the Lupus LA organization events together with his doctor Allan Metzger but didn’t know of their tribute to him. There was a photo of them together from Lupus Fundraiser to Benefit Lupus LA and Lupus Research with the following description:


    BEVERLY HILLS – OCTOBER 1: (L to R) Nicole Paxson, recording artist Michael Jackson, Dr. Allan Metzger and his grandson Kailen Metzger, age two and a half attend the Light the Way for Lupus Los Angeles benefit at the Beverly Hills Hotel on October 1, 2003 in Beverly Hills, California. The event was sponsored by the Lupus Research Institute. (Photo by Frederick M. Brown/Getty Images)

    And now we find out that Michael was a spokesman for lupus patients! And a generous supporter too (no doubt he was)!

    Here is the tribute from the link you provided:

    Foundation News

    Condolences to the Jackson Family

    Lupus LA would like to express its condolences to the family of Michael Jackson. The pop legend was a generous supporter of our mission to serve the needs of people with lupus and their families in Los Angeles and across southern California by raising awareness, conducting advocacy and community outreach, and supporting novel lupus research on the national level.


    Michael Jackson at the organization’s “Evening of Light, Love and Laughter”
    gala on October 1, 2003.

    Like

  50. sanemjfan permalink
    December 7, 2012 9:19 am

    Helena,
    Have you ever read the tribute that the Lupus LA organization posted on their website after MJ died?

    http://www.lupusla.org/news/la/09-jackson.php

    Like

  51. December 3, 2012 12:32 am

    Michael himself spoke about the addiction that developed as a result of the burn and even went to a rehab.

    Hi Guys,
    Here’s the thing, there is a medical difference between an addiction and dependency. It’s very common to refer to one as the other but a dependency is not accurate. Michael’s dependency to pain killers started in 1993 after he had emergency reconstructive surgery on his scalp; instead of canceling the tour to heal sufficiently he became dependent on medicine to get him through it, something we already know. As a result, he had built a tolerance which still doesn’t have to be an addiction. Apparently Michael was indeed using these drugs for pain so the word addiction or addict cannot be used in any shape or form. When Michael spoke in the 93 video after being successful diagnosed he used the word dependency as well.

    Based on his lifestyle and evidence of pill bottles taken directly as prescribed or lesser than, found in 2003 I do not conclude that he was an addict or had an addiction. If I would blame anyone for this series of events it would probably be the Chandlers because emotional pain and stress always makes the physical pain worse.

    I think the mix up also came in when Liz Taylor made certain statements to the press regarding Michael. She compared him to herself in some of these statements, but the intake of medicine between her and Michael was completely different. Elizabeth Taylor abused drugs and alcohol for years despite the overdosing and issues with her health. I’ve also heard others like (Frank Cascio) make statements like “controlled addict” or “situational addict” when speaking about Michael but the two terms used contradict each other.

    Like

  52. December 2, 2012 4:54 am

    MESSAGE FROM MJ ESTATE ABOUT MEDICAL RECORDS OF MICHAEL

    The Executors of Michael’s Estate were shocked to learn of the attempt to sell Michael’s medical records. Immediately upon the information being brought to their attention, the Estate’s lawyers were directed to send an appropriate letter to the auction house and are taking all steps possible to ensure that these private records remain private.

    MJOnline

    The Official Online Team of the Michael Jackson Estate™

    Like

  53. December 2, 2012 1:58 am

    “That is not what my literature says Helena. Mine is from Lupus.Org and the American Academy of Plastic Surgeons. I know that you have your sources”

    I don’t have “my” sources – all the sources come from the Internet. And “your” literature does not recommend plastic surgery for lupus patients either. It does not rule it out in case of remissions but does not recommend.

    We are talking about the necessity for doctors to do no harm as the Hippocrates oath says it. Hoefflin saw all the harm from the first operation and nevertheless continued – this time with the skin expansion. It was unnecessary pain which lasted for months which required painkillers – and it was then that the addiction started.

    Unnecessary, harmful actions of a doctor – this is what brought about the addiction, and not the burn itself.

    “You are under some assumption that he did not advise Michael of the risks prior to anything he did. Why do you think he didn’t do his job?”

    Because it is the same case as Murray’s. A patient may implore for whatever he likes, but if it is the doctor who decides. However I doubt that Michael implored for all those long months of pain.

    P.S. It is astonishing for me to see your matter-of-fact attitude towards Hoefflin doing this madness to Michael. What we see here is months of suffering which could be very well avoided. And there would have been no addiction to Demerol (and probably Propofol too). We are looking into the very heart of the matter – however you prefer to stretch the truth for the only reason that it is told by Klein, even though it is proven now by independent sources like those documents and the photos.

    Like

  54. lynande51 permalink
    December 2, 2012 1:43 am

    That is not what my literature says Helena. Mine is from Lupus.Org and the American Academy of Plastic Surgeons. I know that you have your sources but if the very site that is recommended to people researching Lupus gives the advice that all of what was done to him by Hoefflin can be done. You don’t know what the rest of Hoefflin’s notes might say. You are under some assumption that he did not advise Michael of the risks prior to anything he did. Why do you think he didn’t do his job? The reason you feel that way is because of what Klein said and for some reason he is more believable than Hoefflin, why, I don’t know.

    Like

  55. lynande51 permalink
    December 2, 2012 1:34 am

    Helena it is really simple none of it would have had to be done if he wasn’t burned. It wasn’t anyones fault that this happened it was an accident.

    Like

  56. December 2, 2012 1:14 am

    “Michael Was not an addict. At least not in the sense you have been implying.”

    Lynande, I am not implying anything. By now you must know perfectly well that I say everything directly, and never “imply”.

    I discussed the problem of Michael’s eventual drug-addiction due to the treatment provided by Hoefflin and Klein after the burn. There is no need to “imply” anything here – Michael himself spoke about the addiction that developed as a result of the burn and even went to a rehab.

    The question was whose treatment was the reason for the development of this habit. The documents and photos recently disclosed show to me that this person was Hoefflin. The same documents show to you (for some reason) that it was Klein.

    I absolutely disagree. Those scalp tissues expanders may be more or less acceptable for ordinary burn victims, and not those suffering with diseases like lupus. Klein informed Hoefflin about Michael’s discoid lupus, so Hoefflin knew that this Michael’s condition was a direct contraindication to any scalp surgery.

    Lupus results in hair loss even without any surgery and surgery can only exacerbate the lupus case. Lupus requires treatment by drugs suppressing the immune system and therefore healing the scars from surgery becomes extremely difficult. Most surgeons are of the opinion that plastic surgery is out of the question for lupus patients.

    Okay, before 1984 when two nose jobs were made on MJ neither Hoefflin, nor anybody knew about Michael’s lupus. And even after the burn, the first time Hoefflin was cutting out the burnt spot he hoped there would be no side-effects. But his hopes did not come true. We know it from the fact that in 1988 Michael was preparing for one more operation and had to live with a baloon expander under his scalp which gave him excruciating pain. How many such operations Michael had we don’t know.

    What we know is that though the surgery did not work the first time Hoefflin still continued with it – only now it involved skin expansion and required months of pain. And he was doing it in total disregard for Michael’s lupus AGAIN.

    With the accompanying lupus the surgery could not work, and it didn’t, so no wonder that eventually Michael had to wear a wig.

    Hoefflin’s operations proved not only useless, but harmful too, and all of it because Hoefflin totally disregarded Michael’s skin condition. Klein said he had to put a stop to those operations, and this is how his quarrel with Hoefflin began. All the rest of it is the history of their mutual accusations and revenge.

    Now comes the crucial problem – the pain Michael had to deal with all this time. Who inflicted it?
    Hoefflin.

    In my opinion the doctor who inflicted all that (unnecessary) pain is the one who is responsible for Michael’s eventual drug-addiction too. If it had not been for that pain he wouldn’t have had to take the painkillers at all – at least for so long.

    You are of a different opinion. It is up to you to choose it this way. But please do not impose your opinion on me.
    I prefer the truth.

    Like

  57. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 1, 2012 11:48 pm

    About a facelift, I had 2 friends who had that done in Mexico, where it is a lot cheaper, and I was shocked at all the stitches, all around their eyes (horrible) and behind their ears –hundreds of them. They looked awful but it did eventually heal and I have to say they did look a lot younger afterwards, but having seen what they went through, I could never myself do it. One got an eye infection but it did get resolved.

    Thanks for this discussion of Michael’s lupus/vitiligo/burns, it is pretty technical but important to understand what he faced and how the drs. handled or mishandled it. Does Sullivan discuss the burns? I know he does the vitiligo and lupus. BTW, there is an except of his (crappy) discussion of the skin issues on the Root.

    http://www.theroot.com/views/how-mj-engineered-his-sound-and-look

    Like

  58. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 10:51 pm

    SLE is an autoimmune disorder that affects the blood vessels. DLE does not.

    Like

  59. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 9:34 pm

    At least not in the sense you have been implying. He had periods of dependency/addiction to the pain relief he was given at the time. He also had long periods of remission and recovery. You have been effectively saying that he was addicted since 1984 am I right?The person that was in the wrong was the one that gave it to him for a procedure where it is not indicated. It was not indicted when he has going in for fillers and Botox to Klein in 2009. Pain control is indicated for surgery such as this and for the burn and for the other accidents he had. Also he was fully aware of his dependency to them as evidenced by the letter between him and Dr. Farshcian in Florida in 2002. It would seem that Michael had been seeking help from other doctors that would not provide it for him. He had even asked about a Methadone program but was told he couldn’t do that. Who was the MD that told him that? It wasn’t Farshcian because he was the one that started him on the Buprenex.

    Like

  60. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 9:27 pm

    Life itself proved that the risk was unjustified. All it ended with was a wig, awful headaches Michael was suffering from and an addiction to painkillers.

    I’m just going to let that speak for itself. All along I thought you were trying to prove what I was…Michael Was not an addict.

    Like

  61. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 9:10 pm

    I guess you have never seen a facelift being done to think it is somehow a milder surgery that a scar removal.

    Like

  62. December 1, 2012 7:34 pm

    “There was no reason for this not to be done. It has been done on many others as well with good results.” -lynande

    NO REASON for all that skin-stretching NOT to be done? Okay, then read the information below. It does not concern stretching the skin by a baloon which is a much more painful and damaging technique – it concerns a much milder and shorter procedure, a face-lift:

    Can Patients with Lupus have Plastic Surgery?
    October 17th, 2012

    Lupus is a disease of the blood vessels and healing can be unpredictable in these patients. In a worse case scenario, areas of the skin can die (skin necrosis) leaving a real mess. Making this potentially worse is the fact that the medications a Lupus patient tends to be on include drugs that further inhibit healing….like steroids and immunosuppressive drugs.

    Some Lupus patients with deforming conditions like breast cancer after mastectomy will have reconstructive plastic surgery to rebuild their breasts. This is higher risk surgery than in healthier patients. These cases need to be considered individually with the patient’s Rheumatologist in the loop to assess her risk and best course of action. Some patients with less involved disease can have smaller operations, but are still at increased risk of problems.

    Best Regards,
    John Di Saia MD
    http://plasticsurgeryguru.net/tag/lupus-and-plastic-surgery/

    Risks of Plastic Surgery on Patient with Lupus and Fibromyalgia
    Question:
    What are the risks of having plastic surgery of the face while also having Lupus and Fibromyalgia? Also, the patient did not tell her doctor that she has Lupus because he might not do the surgery.

    Answers:
    What you describe is every plastic surgeon’s nightmare: that a patient who desires a procedure and has been rejected after disclosing a medical condition will go to another plastic surgeon and intentionally fail to reveal medical conditions that would not be picked up on routine prep testing. I require that my patients complete an extensive medical history form and obtain medical clearance from their personal physicians. I am aware that other surgeons in the area, particularly those who are not board certified in plastic surgery, do not have similar requirements and underplay risks of surgery for patients who have chronic conditions but, as doctors, we must take risks seriously and, in the words of the Hippocratic oath, first do no harm.

    Larry S. Nichter, MD, MS, FACS
    Orange County Plastic Surgeon

    Patients should always work with their surgeons so that they can work together for the best result. Many times, it may require coordination between the surgeon and the physician taking care of the autoimmune disorder to help optimize a patient for surgery. This may include cessation of any medication which impairs wound healing.

    Malcolm A. Lesavoy, MD
    Encino Plastic Surgeon

    These conditions may affect adversly the safety of a facelift and the healing and the final potential result. Some of this depends on the medications you are on that may decrease your ability to heal (ie Prednisone), and can affect your body’s ability to react to stress. You MUST tell your doctor about all of your conditions and you must listen to them if they tell you it isn’t safe to do.

    Richard P. Rand, MD, FACS
    Seattle Plastic Surgeon

    There are always small risks with healing related to lupus and fibromyalgia, but as long as both of the disease processes are in remission it is acceptable to proceed with the facial cosmetic surgery.

    William Portuese, MD
    Seattle Facial Plastic Surgeon

    Lupus and fibromyalgia may adversly affect plastic surgery outcome-you must tell your doctor. Systemic Lupus Erythematosis is a very serious disease which affects the blood vessels which are responsible for healing and keeping the skin alive after plastic surgery. Lupus can cause large areas of skin on the face or tummy to actually die after plastic surgery and result in terrible scars. Please encourage the patient to discuss this and be honest with the doctor. The result of not telling the doctor could be disasterous.

    Brooke R. Seckel, MD
    Boston Plastic Surgeon

    There are different forms of Lupus, but I would be very concerned doing a facelift on a patient with both diseases. The patient should discuss this with her rheumatologist and surgeon. Complications could be severe and deforming.

    Richard W. Fleming, MD
    Beverly Hills Facial Plastic Surgeon
    http://www.realself.com/question/facial-plastic-surgery-lupus-fibromyalgia

    Lynande, as you see, most of the plastic surgeons say there might be severe complications of a facelift for a lupus patient, and only the most risky ones say that in a state of remission it is possible.

    Hoefflin took a much bigger risk as he heavily cut the scalp of a lupus patient and then placed a tissue expander under the partially burned or damaged skin.

    Life itself proved that the risk was unjustified. All it ended with was a wig, awful headaches Michael was suffering from and an addiction to painkillers.

    Like

  63. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 7:15 pm

    Here is a link on tissue expansion.
    http://www.plasticsurgery.org/Reconstructive-Procedures/Tissue-Expansion.html
    Here is the link for tissue expanders from wiki. One of the most common uses of tissue expansion is in scalp scarring.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tissue_expansion
    Michael was being treated by Dr. Metzger with Plaquenil and Atabrine both anti malarials used to treat the lupus when it was active. There was no reason for this not to be done. It has been done on many others as well with good results.

    Like

  64. December 1, 2012 7:15 pm

    Okay, I see your point.

    In your opinion Klein’s treatment of Restylane and collagen was damaging for Michael though the most your article says is that collagen is to be used with caution. And Restylane is even recommended: “If depressed, the scars can be filled in with hyaluronic acid such as Restylane.”

    On the other hand the fact that Hoefflin did so much surgery on Michael knowing that he was a lupus patient, inflicted him so much unnecessary pain and started Michael’s addiction for painkillers was a necessary and justified thing to do.

    Moreover according to you it is Klein who is responsible for Michael’s drug addiction while Hoefflin is not. Klein is the bad guy, and Hoefflin is the good one (despite it all).

    Okay, you have every right to your opinion, no matter how far from the truth it is.

    Like

  65. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 6:54 pm

    Q. Is treatment with lasers, collagen, restalyne, Botox or Thermage okay for people with either cutaneous or systemic lupus? What about microdermabrasion chemical peels and sclerotherapy for spider veins?

    A. With the recent attention on plastic surgery and other cosmetic procedures, more people — including those with lupus — are questioning the safety of various skin treatments. Some may be considering dermatologic interventions for disease-related reasons, including side effects from lupus treatment (such as stretch marks) or from lupus itself (such as scars from discoid lupus).

    However, a distinction should be made between reconstructive or reparative treatments for damaged skin and purely cosmetic procedures. Lupus patients in remission who are left with permanent scarring may be treated the same way as a person who has been in a car accident or in a fire. Certainly we are cautious with these treatments because any technique that manipulates the skin could reactivate the lupus. There are a number of criteria we establish before considering a person with lupus for these types of skin treatments.

    First, the person’s lupus must be in full remission — and his or her rheumatologist and dermatologist must agree with the planned treatment.

    In the last three to four years, pulsed-dye and other laser treatments have been particularly helpful in reducing the blood vessels caused by the lupus malar, or “butterfly,” rash. This is the same technology that has been used on children with port-wine birthmarks on the face.

    CO2 laser resurfacing of scars has also shown promise in selected patients. Again, all patients considered for laser treatment are pre-screened as outlined above. We also make sure that any drugs they are taking will not significantly delay healing. Striae (stretch marks) are a very troublesome problem subsequent to steroid treatment. No one technology works as well as we would like.

    Collagen has been used for years to fill in scars in the skin, often caused by acne or burns. The use of collagen in lupus — or any autoimmune disease — has been quite controversial for many years. Dermatologists who treat lupus patients with collagen have not seen an increase in significant or unusual reactions, but caution is advised. And, although we pre-test everyone for any allergic reaction, there also can be problems if a person is on high doses of immunosuppressives or corticosteroids, since a false-negative test result may occur. Recently, a new form of collagen derived from a human cell line has been introduced, and no allergy pre-testing is required for its use.

    The latest filler is Restalyne (pronounced REST-uh-lyn), a synthetic hyaluronic acid gel which is injected into the skin in tiny amounts with a very fine needle. A similar product has been injected into the joints of osteoarthritis patients. Restalyne is a natural substance, so theoretically there is should be minimal or no allergic reaction. However, since patients with lupus have increased levels of hyaluronic acid, or mucin (a characteristic of inflamed skin), we are proceeding carefully in treating such patients with restalyne. So far in our practice we have treated six such people with extremely low amounts of restalyne to monitor their responses. Over time, we feel this bioengineered filler will prove very useful — especially for people who have scars that lasers cannot totally fill in.

    As for Botox, we really don’t have any issue with this as a skin treatment. In 2002 the FDA granted approval to use Botox Cosmetic (Botulinum Toxin Type A) as a treatment to reduce the severity of frown lines for up to 120 days. Small doses of the injectable form of sterile, purified botulinum toxin block the release of a chemical called acetylcholine by nerve cells that signal muscle contraction. The product is a protein complex produced by the bacterium Clostridium botulinum, which contains the same toxin that causes food poisoning, although there is no chance of contracting botulism from Botox injection. Since this treatment basically just paralyzes the muscles, no allergy testing is required, and it does not appear to have any side effects when used prudently.

    Thermage (pronounced thur-MAJ), approved by the FDA in 2002, uses heat from a radio frequency device to tighten or lift the skin. It’s currently being used in the eye and forehead areas. Heating up the skin causes new collagen to form — a process similar to laser treatments. But thermage uses deeper, radio-frequency-produced heat rather than light-induced heat. So, theoretically, there is a greater possibility of reactivating skin involvement of lupus. Clinical trials are needed to determine if this treatment is safe for people with lupus.

    Microdermabrasion is a relatively harmless procedure which addresses superficial skin problems such as blemishes and pore size. It should be used with caution to avoid potential reactivation of cutaneous lupus.

    Finally, doctors are using injections of detergent-based sclerosing agents, or sclerotherapy, to reduce spider veins in the legs. Patients with lupus will be more susceptible to side effects such as local reactions and infection. This procedure is not recommended for larger blood vessels. Combination treatment with laser technology is sometimes helpful, but caution is advised until more studies are done.

    NOTE: Any patient with clotting disorders, including the anti-cardiolipin antibody/antiphospholipid antibody and lupus anticoagulant should avoid these procedures

    Helena it is perfectly normal for patients to have repairitive sugery or even cosmetic surgery when they have Lupus. Either kind. Of course now we have laser and chemical treatments that can do the same thing when removing kerotinous scars ( raised) but flat scars will require tissue expansion.laser and chemical treatments were not available in 1984. It is that simple.
    You are thinking he could have transplanted hair over the burn when he couldn’t because the subcutaneous tissue was also gone from the burn. It was 3rd degree and since then they have even changed the staging of burns to include a 4th degree burn. If the tissue is missing the only way it will expand is to stimulate it back then by stretching it, now there is stem cell treatment available too and other chemical stimulators. They were not available in 1984.

    http://www.lupus.org/webmodules/webarticlesnet/templates/new_empty.aspx?articleid=603&zoneid=76

    Like

  66. December 1, 2012 6:25 pm

    “However Klein continued to prescribe Michael that Benoquin for his entire life which also exacerbates the Discoid Lesions.” – lynande

    Can I have a source to prove the above statement please?
    Arnold Klein was treating Michael with cortisone (at least Hoefflin said so), but this is the usual treatment for discoid lupus:

    “The most common treatment for lupus is corticoid steroid hormones. Corticoid steroids are related to cortisol, a natural anti-inflammatory hormone. They hold back inflammation very quickly.” http://lupuscleveland.org/what_is_lupus/

    Arnold Klein was also the first to diagnoze Michael with lupus and he did it by a mere looking at Michael when he entered the room. Not a single doctor who treated Michael before that was able to make the right diagnosis. Whether you like it or not, but Klein is indeed one of the best US dermatologists who helped Michael a lot. This is the reason why MJ stayed with him until his dying day.

    And he was the one who stopped that madness with stretching Michael’s scalp, which was something Hoefflin never forgave him.

    Here is an earlier post about Klein and Hoefflin providing all the details we are talking of: https://vindicatemj.wordpress.com/2011/08/27/doctors-around-michael-jackson-dr-arnold-klein-and-dr-steven-hoefflin/

    Like

  67. December 1, 2012 6:06 pm

    “Helena since it was not my intention to mislead people on Michael’s diagnosis I will start again.”

    Lynande, you do not have to start it all over again. You may be doing it unintentionally but you ARE misleading people – at least as regards that skin-stretching technique. Anyone unbiased will tell you that it was an incredibly unjustified risk to do that skin-stretching on a patient with discoid lupus. A burn is a different matter but even making that big incision to cut out the burn was highly risky. It could have been treated differently – by transplanting hair, for example:

    Treatment for Lupus may involve the use of corticosteroids or other immuno-suppressants.
    In some cases hair transplants may be used to cover small patches of scarring alopecia resulting from Chronic Discoid Lupus Erythematosus. http://www.belgraviacentre.com/lupus/

    Hair transplants:

    “He had DLE not SLE I think you might be doing that unintentionally. You are attributing characteristics of one form of Lupus with characteristics of another.” – lynande

    I am perfectly aware of the difference as I did my research and wrote this post. But it is exactly the Discoid Lupus which does not allow plastic surgery. One of the symptoms of discoid lupus proper is HAIRLOSS (even without any surgery being done):

    “Discoid lupus erythematosus is a chronic dermatological disease that can lead to scarring, hair loss, and hyperpigmentation changes in skin if it is not treated early and promptly.

    Discoid lupus starts as a plaque, usually on the head or neck, with an adherent scale. The lesion tends to spread centrifugally and as it progresses there is follicular plugging and pigmentary changes, generally hyperpigmentation at the periphery, and hypopigmentation with atrophy, scarring, and telengiectasia at the center of the lesion:

    discoid lesion

    Involvement of the scalp commonly produces a scarring alopecia (hair loss):

    null

    DLE is a chronic scarring and potentially disfiguring disease seen in all parts of the world and among all ethnic groups. It is an important cause of irreversible hair loss and is associated with considerable morbidity.

    Early effective treatment may lead to total clearing of skin lesions, but failure of treatment results in permanent scarring; the depressed scars, hair loss, and pigmentary changes are often extremely disfiguring, particularly in darker-skinned people.

    Because cutaneous lesions of lupus are known to be induced or exacerbated by exposure to ultraviolet light, a logical approach in the management of discoid lupus must include sun avoidance and the liberal application of sunscreens. Patients should be educated about the use of sunscreens and protective clothing and behavior modification to avoid sun exposure, particularly between 10 AM and 4 PM. They should also be aware of water, snow, and sand surfaces, from which ultraviolet light may be reflected, and where harm can occur from reflected ultraviolet light.

    They should be instructed to use sunscreens daily and apply liberally; they should reapply them if there has been prolonged sun exposure or when they are wet.Protection against both ultraviolet A and ultraviolet B is desirable because lupus is aggravated by both. With disfigurement and alopecia, patients may benefit from advice on camouflage and the wearing of a wig. http://www.jabfm.org/content/22/2/206.full

    Camouflage and wearing a wig – this is what Michael actually ended up with. And also with addiction to painkillers due to unsucessful and unnecessary surgical treatment.

    Like

  68. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 5:24 pm

    And back to the auction of those photos and the discharge summary. I was looking through some of the other things that are up for auction on the site and am looking to see if they might have belonged to Michael. There is a signed photo of The Three Stooges that he would have snapped up if he was alive so are there other things that belonged to Michael being autctioned that no one has noticed yet? I’m going to go back and look some more.

    Like

  69. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 5:13 pm

    Helena since it was not my intention to mislead people on Michael’s diagnosis I will start again.He had DLE not SLE I think you might be doing that unintentionally. You are attributing characteristics of one form of Lupus with characteristics of another.
    Dr. Hoefflin did not have any choice when he set about repairing the burn.Or do you think that he should have just left that alone?Do you think any doctor would hesitate to repair a burn scar on any patients head with Lupus? It is still done that way. Precautions are made of course but surgical repair was the only option.Why ? Because it does not happen everytime this is done. It happens to some people and not to others. There is no way to know even today how each persons body is going to react.
    Scar removal for discoid lesion scarring on the scalp is still done to this day the same way he did it then on Michael for patients with Discoid Lupus.So are you as outraged at their doctors for doing the same thing to them?
    You are somehow taking the word of Klein over Hoefflin and this is wrong. Klein, as a matter of fact was way overdoing the Restylane that he was using on Michael in the last few weeks before he died.He was essentially injecting the very same substance that naturally occurs in the skin in a discoid lesion. He was in there 2-3 times a week and then Klein charged an astronomical amount to “fly” in for a weekend call.I know you think that Klein is somehow right and was not just pointing fingers but he was. How do I know that? Because Michael did not have more than the three surgeries done by Hoefflin.Like I said the repair of the burn and the scar repair were long processes.However Klein continued to prescribe Michael that Benoquin for his entire life which also exacerbates the Discoid Lesions.
    To be honest everything that Michael did from the hair coloring to the hair extensions manipulate the scalp so maybe we should be blaming Karen Faye and his hair stylist as well.
    I have even gotten confused about what it is that you think was wrong with what Hoefflin did. Is it the use of pain medication?.Of course he needed pain medication he had a burn on his head. Of course he would have needed it before when he had the two rhinoplastys.Then there are the doctors that gave him pain medication when he broke his foot, his ribs, his fratured spine. They were all necessary at the time.He had knee surgery and the wound on his leg all of which would have needed pain medication.
    The only one that is suspect is Klein because he gave Michael pain medicatio for procedures where is was not indicated.That is if he gave it to him.
    Maybe you should take a closer look at someone else that Klein worked on to get an idea about just exactly what it was he was doing.
    Carrie Fischer was having cosmetic reconstrution on her face as well around the same time that Michael was. She gets done with the restorative treatments and shortly after that she has to go to rehab again. Does that make you question if he is acting in his patients best interest? .
    Here is a link to the treatment and scar removal of discoid lupus. It is still done to this day just exactly as Dr, Hoefflin did it back then if it is indicated.

    http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1065529-treatment#a1156

    Like

  70. December 1, 2012 1:17 pm

    “Helena the information that you rely on to prove that Hoefflin was “torturing” Michael is erroneous. It was not known yet in the late eighties and early nineties that if the Lupus was active it would not work. How could Hoefflin possibly have known what was not known yet?” – lynande51

    I am astonished to hear opinions like the above from someone in the medical profession. Lupus is a disease where the body is attacked by its own immune system, so in order to minimize the effect of lupus doctors give drugs suppressing the immune system. Suppressing the immune system results in grave problems with healing. You don’t have to be in medical profession to put two and two together and learn that lupus is a direct counterindication to plastic surgery.

    Okay, Hoefflin did not know about it when he did Michael’s nose job prior to the burn, but he KNEW it all right when he Arnold Klein informed him about it on the day of the burn. This should have changed his attitude once and for all in treating Michael – everything could be tried except surgery.

    And the information that the post-operative and further skin-stretching process was torturous for Michael is not just my idea. David Nordahl saw it with his own eyes, and Arnold Klein also confirmed it, so why we should doubt both of them I really don’t know. Denial the truth never helps.

    As to how many surgeries Hoefflin made on Michael even if there were only two of them (of which we know for sure) even these two would have been enough to form an addiction due to long periods of having to live with pain.

    Why do you avoid a direct answer to my question?

    If it was Hoefflin who was inflicting all that pain on Michael wasn’t it him who was responsible for his addiction to painkillers too?

    Yes or no?

    Like

  71. December 1, 2012 7:41 am

    Arnold Klein is a disgrace, but he never claimed that he didn’t give Michael Demerol. He only rebutted the amounts that the press claimed he gave him. I have to find the interview but I specifically remember him saying he gave Michael really small dosages or something.

    Shelly so they planned on him making money from interviews that he did about Michael? Do you have a document or anything?
    This is an interesting point because Klein didn’t want to do the TMZ LIVE interview at first ( Harvey said that someone talked him out of it) and then he went ahead and did it the next day. Could it possibly be because they don’t pay for interviews? He had no problem going on every other station under the sun.

    What is Darvocet?
    Darvocet contains a combination of propoxyphene and acetaminophen. Propoxyphene is in a group of drugs called narcotic pain relievers.
    Darvocet is used to relieve mild to moderate pain with or without fever.

    Does it have a different effect on everyone because I think I was almost addicted to this drug? My mother was given it (Darvocet) and Ultram to take after she had her spinal surgery. I remember that she was taking between 2 .5 of these pills a day. She gave me one for a headache and I felt so happy, it wasn’t a high but it was a bit of contentment. When I explained to her the effect it had on me, she looked at me like I was crazy. It didn’t mess with her mental at all it just made her back pain go away. I found myself going into her purse and popping them for no reason – which is why I had to stop. It’s my understanding that they discontinued them though.

    Like

  72. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 6:27 am

    Shelly that is very interesting. On another note the authentication letter for Michael’s signature in the medical file being auctioned of was done in New Jersey on Sept. 6th or 9th of 2012. I don’t know if it is someone that Pristine Auction regularly uses or if it is taken in by someone to the closest authenticator. Either way Pristine Auction house is in Arizona and this was authenticated in New Jersey. So that does sort of point to Mann/Vaccaro doesn’t it since that is where Vaccaro is from. Asbury Park to be exact.

    Like

  73. December 1, 2012 5:31 am

    Khiliji and Pfeiffer were also the beneficiaries of Klein’s will.

    Like

  74. December 1, 2012 5:27 am

    @lynande,

    Yes, I have docs. I can give you screen shots now

    Like

  75. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 5:14 am

    Shelly so they planned on him making money from interviews that he did about Michael? Do you have a document or anything?

    Like

  76. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 3:04 am

    Helena the information that you rely on to prove that Hoefflin was “torturing” Michael is erroneous. It was not known yet in the late eighties and early nineties that if the Lupus was active it would not work. How could Hoefflin possibly have known what was not known yet?
    Then he tries to repair a scar from a discoid lesion in the early nineties with the balloon.How could it possibly be his fault if he went with what was widely used to remove that scar at that time. Where do you get the idea that he did this over and over again?

    Like

  77. December 1, 2012 3:03 am

    “Then when Jason Pfeiffer/Klein were set to appear on ET, it was Debbie who got it nixed it, it would seem because again, once Klein heard Debbie was involved he got scared.”

    I don’t know if it’s relevant but I know for a fact that Pfeiffer and Khiliji created an LLc in August 2009 and Klein was supposed to give his money from media interviews to that llc.

    Like

  78. December 1, 2012 2:28 am

    Lynande, I have already gone to bed but following Michael’s example could not sleep. It is 2 am here and I will comment on some of your points.

    Helena how long do you think it takes to stretch the tissue? This is a very slow process where you periodically go in and have the same balloon inflated more and more.It is not just skin it is the subcutaneous tissue and muscle tissue that has to be stretched First he would have to expand the tissue past what is needed and then excise what is not needed and suture the wound closed.

    You explained perfectly well how long and torturous the process must have been for Michael. Thank you.

    You forget what I said about the pain medication as well. That burn and those surgeries were not the first time that Michael would have been given pain killers. First there would have been the broken nose, then the first rhinoplasty both done by different doctors. Hoefflin came along and repaired what was done wrong in the first surgery.

    I don’t forget what you said. And it is very good that Hoefflin came along to repair the first surgery, but it isn’t very good of him to torture Michael for several years stretching his skin (the way you described it) and in total disregard for Michael’s lupus too. He should have stopped after the first unsuccessful operation, but his pride, ambition, greed (?) and indifference to his patient’s suffering prevented him from making the right choice.

    “Lacienegasmiles is right. It wasn’t the doctor that stopped giving them to him it was the one that gave them to him when he shouldn’t have. Hoefflin never gave Michael Demerol. That was Kleins drug of choice.”

    First of all we don’t know who was the first to give Michael Demerol – it could be Hoefflin all right. I cannot imagine a surgeon leaving his patient suffering in pain after such an operation.

    Second, if he started stretching Michael’s skin and did it for a very long time he was obliged to provide him with strong painkillers and if he didn’t it was simply a crime.

    Third, the drugs he gave Michael initially, even after the burn were also addictive as these are opiates too.

    Hoefflin prescribed him Percocet or Darvocet. I looked them up :

    What is Percocet?
    Percocet contains a combination of acetaminophen and oxycodone. Oxycodone is in a group of drugs called opioid pain relievers. An opioid is sometimes called a narcotic. Percocet is used to relieve moderate to severe pain.

    Oxycodone may be habit forming and should be used only by the person it was prescribed for. Never share Percocet with another person, especially someone with a history of drug abuse or addiction. Keep the medication in a place where others cannot get to it.

    When used for long periods of time or at high doses, Percocet may not work as well and may require higher doses to obtain the same effect as when originally taken. This is known as TOLERANCE. Talk with your doctor if Percocet stops working well. Do not take more than prescribed.

    Some people who use Percocet for a long time may develop a need to continue taking it. People who take high doses are also at risk. This is known as DEPENDENCE or addiction. If you suddenly stop taking Percocet, you may experience WITHDRAWAL symptoms including anxiety; diarrhea; fever, runny nose, or sneezing; goose bumps and abnormal skin sensations; nausea; vomiting; pain; rigid muscles; rapid heartbeat; seeing, hearing, or feeling things that are not there; shivering or tremors; sweating; and trouble sleeping.
    http://www.drugs.com/cdi/percocet.html

    What is Darvocet?
    Darvocet contains a combination of propoxyphene and acetaminophen. Propoxyphene is in a group of drugs called narcotic pain relievers.
    Darvocet is used to relieve mild to moderate pain with or without fever.

    Important information about Darvocet
    Darvocet was withdrawn from the U.S. market in November 2010.
    Propoxyphene may be habit-forming and should be used only by the person it was prescribed for.

    There is a serious risk of overdose associated with Darvocet-N, which may lead to death within the first hour of overdosing, especially in patients with a history of emotional disturbances or suicide attempts or those who also take sedatives, tranquilizers, muscle relaxants, antidepressants, or other CNS depressants. Do not take more than 6 tablets of Darvocet-N 100 or 12 tablets of Darvocet-N 50 in 1 day.

    Darvocet-N is a potential drug of abuse. Do not share this medication with others or take it in any way other than how your doctor prescribed it for you. Keep out of reach of children.

    Hoefflin prescribed Percocet – 1 tablet every 3 hours ( 6 pills a day) or Darvocet N100 – 1 to 2 every 3 hours (or 6-12 pills a day).

    Michael’s initial severe condition required all these drugs and Hoefflin was absolutely right in prescribing them.

    BUT his later condition was not better at all (if not worse), judging by the cut Hoefflin made on his sculp a year later. By then the burn had already been healed and was relatively small. However when the bald spot was cut away the wound was four times as big as the initial spot and I suspect that Hoefflin had to prescribe something much stronger than those two drugs.

    This type of wound requires a lot of medication to dull the pain:

    MJ's bald spot cut by Hoefflin Dec.1984

    And THIS was followed by all that skin-stretching….

    But nevertheless it is Klein who is responsible for everything Hoefflin did.

    Who said it?

    The media said it.

    And what did Michael’s fans do?

    They believed it.

    Like

  79. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 1:14 am

    And it has been Klein that has been auctioning off Michael’s and Elizabeth’s memorabilia to pay for his bills after filing for bankruptcy. So considering he might just be prosecuted for what he did I wonder if it is him that released the file for auction? He might have had a copy too.

    Like

  80. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 1:10 am

    Arnold Klein denied that he gave Michael Demerol. Then during Murray’s trial we all found out that he did give Michael Demerol. Immediately after the sentencing the Cal Med Board subpoenaed Klein. his lawyers quit so it was on stall. He was ordered by the board to undergo psychological tests, physical tests and drug screening tests. In July he sued them saying he wanted them to give proof as to why this was being order and that it would have to include transparency.Now we have the findings of that. Kleins case has been referred to the California Attorney General for prosecution.That is why he was lying and pointing fingers at everyone else.

    http://www2.mbc.ca.gov/LicenseLookupSystem/PhysicianSurgeon/document.aspx?path=%5cDIDOCS%5c20120719%5cDMRAAADE6%5c&did=AAADE120719233431738.DID&licenseType=A&licenseNumber=24719#page=1

    Like

  81. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2012 12:51 am

    Helena how long do you think it takes to stretch the tissue? This is a very slow process where you periodically go in and have the same balloon inflated more and more.It is not just skin it is the subcutaneous tissue and muscle tissue that has to be stretched First he would have to expand the tissue past what is needed and then excise what is not needed and suture the wound closed.
    You forget what I said about the pain medication as well. That burn and those surgeries were not the first time that Michael would have been given pain killers. First there would have been the broken nose, then the first rhinoplasty both done by different doctors. Hoefflin came along and repaired what was done wrong in the first surgery.
    Lacienegasmiles is right. It wasn’t the doctor that stopped giving them to him it was the one that gave them to him when he shouldn’t have. Hoefflin never gave Michael Demerol. That was Kleins drug of choice.

    Like

  82. December 1, 2012 12:09 am

    “If Michael needed painkillers for legitimate medical reasons, like reconstructive surgery” – lacienegasmiles

    “Legitimate reconstructive surgery”?

    Even though Lupus is a DIRECT contraindication to such surgery?

    And this surgery was made again and again though it did not prove effective for AT LEAST the first 4 years of its making?

    Michael was in great pain and needed painkillers day and night, but it was still “legitimate reconstructive surgery”???

    “The problem is the doctor who started giving MJ painkillers for no reason”

    NO REASON???

    Like

  83. November 30, 2012 11:48 pm

    If Michael needed painkillers for legitimate medical reasons, like reconstructive surgery, then I don’t see the problem. Whether or not he should’ve had that reconstructive surgery is something I don’t feel I have enough information to say on. I can understand Michael seeking out this surgery to fix things if he could.

    The problem is the doctor who started giving MJ painkillers for no reason.

    Like whoever was giving him the demerol in 1993 before he got sent to rehab. Frank Cascio said Klein was there on this trip, he doesn’t say he was the one who gave MJ the drugs, he doesn’t name that doctor, but I felt it was interesting he noted that Klein was there.

    Like

  84. November 30, 2012 11:37 pm

    “Klein is terrified of Debbie and that’s interesting to me.” – lacienegasmiles

    Okay, let him be terrified as long as he wants it. But can anyone here answer a simple question – after all you’ve read about Hoefflin stretching Michael’s skin for so long whom do you consider responsible for Michael getting addicted to Demerol in the 80s?

    Like

  85. November 30, 2012 11:31 pm

    Klein is a man that is trying very hard to hide something.

    And Debbie seems to know about this too.

    Within days after Michael died she started showing up at his clinic to see another doctor next to him. It was during these visits she yelled out to paparazzi asking her questions about who the father of MJ’s kids was and she said, “He’s dead, he’s dead.”

    Klein got so upset about these visits he threatened to call the police if she showed up again. So Debbie shows up again the very next day and confirms that yes, Klein had threatened to call the cops on her. But he was obviously too scared to go through with it. An unnamed female also called the police at this time to give them info about Klein.

    Then when Jason Pfeiffer/Klein were set to appear on ET, it was Debbie who got it nixed it, it would seem because again, once Klein heard Debbie was involved he got scared.

    Klein is terrified of Debbie and that’s interesting to me.

    Like

  86. November 30, 2012 10:57 pm

    “To me Klein is a man that “protests too much” and makes me question something: If that Demerol was not found in Michael’s system where did it go?” – lynande51

    Where did it go? Interesting question. And where did it go when Klein was away on holiday and Demerol was given to Michael in the biggest quantities than at the time when Klein was present in the office? (Just a side question, because I do not rule out that the Demerol could be used for his or any other’s personal need).

    But discussing Demerol in the year 2009 does not have anything to do with the now disclosed photos and Michael’s lupus from the year 1984.

    These events are 25 years apart.

    You are talking of one thing, while I am talking about another – my concern is only about the way the addiction started. Why are you so adamant to throw everything into one pile?

    And we don’t have only Klein’s word for those scalp operations performed by Hoefflin. David Nordahl made friends with Michael in 1988 or 4 years after the burn accident. It was David Nordahl who was the first to tell us that Michael was in great pain from the baloon expanding his skin. His words can date back to any year later than 1988 but absolutely not earlier as he simply had not met Michael by then.

    But even if we take the year 1988 as the earliest for that baloon stretching of Michael’s skin, it means that Hoefflin’s efforts continued for at least 4 years after the burn. And all this time Michael had to be given painkillers. Wasn’t it enough to form an addiction?

    “When they were trying to repair that burned spot, he had a balloon under his scalp that was inflated,” Nordahl says. “He let me feel it. It was a huge mound. As the skin got stretched, they cut it out and stitched the scalp. He was in excruciating pain.” http://www.legendarymichaeljackson.nl/?page_id=337

    The question is – who is to blame for it?
    Who was that person in your opinion?

    Like

  87. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 10:29 pm

    Helena there is nothing other than the word of one doctor against the other in this case. First you have Klein saying that it was Hoefflin that started Michael on propofol. All of this nonsense started in the very early days after Michael died. Hoefflin said ( in the Sun) that is was Klein that gave Michael painkillers and showed Murray how to give Michael propofol.
    Then Klein reacts by suing Hoefflin. Hoefflin is only talking through his attorney’s now because of that lawsuit.
    Then Klein goes on the offensive first with just about anything to make Michael look bad.Even the Michael was gay story to was refute what was said by Hoefflin in the Sun interview.That is where Hoefflin said that Klein was giving Michael pain killers well into 2002 and had him having surgery that was performed by someone else under Kleins direction.Klein says one thing and calls Hoefflin crazy when just a few months later we have Klein saying something equally as crazy about the Department of Homeland Security (what he thinks terrorism has to do with Michael I don’t know) and other things. Then he files bankruptcy and a whole slew of mess is created by him including a lawsuit against him by Jason Pfieffer.
    He goes on the record and claims Michael is gay and that the kids are his. He claimed that to the court when he actually sought cusotdy of Michael’s kids after he died. It was in the custody hearing that the judge replied to him that he had no legal standing because the kids were Debbies and Michael’s. Everyone overlooks that because the story is not as much fun as the alternatives that the tabloid make up.
    All of this is because of the grandiosity of both of those men. However Klein even contradicts his own statements when in early statements he says one thing and then later contradicts that very thing in a later statement.For instance he talks about all these surgeries that Hoefflin supposedly did on Michael and yet the first thing about Hoefflin that came out of his mouth was that he hadn’t seen Michael professionally in over 10 years.
    Nothing however tells the truth more than the nurses notes from his office where he regularly gives Michael a drug that is not indicated in the procedures that he was doing to Michael.
    To me Klein is a man that “protests too much” and makes me question something: If that Demerol was not found in Michael’s system where did it go?
    Any nurse or doctor out there can tell you that if that medication isn’t where he said he put it it is a red flag for some kind of diversion going on in that office. This is what I think he was so afraid was going to be found out. I think that is what Pfieffer had over his head and why he went along with that stupid story to throw the press off and have them go in some other direction. because if it is found uot that he was diverting drugs for his personal use or the use of other patients that should not have had them he will lose his license, be fined and possibly go to prison.
    Klein is a man that is trying very hard to hide something.Hoefflin has been silent since the lawsuit was filed.When that one goes to court we will finally have the answers that we have been looking for. Up til now we only have Klein that is talking in the press.
    From what I can tell from all this is this: Hoefflin repaired the burn. Then a few years later he tried to fix the scar and the tissue expander was used. That was around 1991 after the Bad tour and befoe the Dangerous tour. After that all we have are Klein words that any other surgery was done.
    Here is what the press knows too. The story about Michael being horribly disfigured form the cosmetic surgery came from an article that appeared in June of 1992 in The daily Mirror. Michael sued them and the photographer Ken Lennox that provided them with the photos that he had doctored up.They filed a coutersuit. They demanded Michael’s medical records. They got them. They demanded that one of their doctors come to the US and examine Michael. They did and so did the previous editor. Then 6 years after the original lawsuit was settled when Michael won what he wanted. The previous editor of the The Daily Mirror was forced to go public with a retraction. SO all along the story about a hole in his nose has been a big fat lie. Then just like everything else Michael, it gets rehashed as his nose was a hole.

    Like

  88. November 30, 2012 9:48 pm

    Michael was between a stone and a hard place, so to speak.Some of the lyrics of “I wanna be startin´something” refer to thundering pain that he could not get over,neither under.It could have been this that inspired those words.He never complained openly,maybe only now do we understand what he had to go through.And the photo above where he is performing with a white cap over his scalp,seen when he takes off his hat.What courage to perform at a time like that!

    Like

  89. November 30, 2012 8:40 pm

    “Klein could not have “fired” Hoefflin because one doctor does not “fire” another doctor. Michael would have been the only one that could have stopped seeing Dr. Hoefflin because his medical provider is his choice.”

    Lynande, it is a figure of speech meaning that Klein persuaded Michael to stop seeing Hoefflin. Nothing more than that.

    “They are still doing cosmetic surgery on people with scarring from the discoid rashes today. It is only recent research that has shown that it works when the disorder is in remission and it doesn’t work when it isn’t.”

    Do you mean to say that when Hoefflin saw the first operation not successful it was perfectly all right for him to continue? Even despite all the pain of it and Michael having to be fed painkillers because of the skin-stretching?

    I know that all of you don’t like Klein, but isn’t the truth about the matter worth more than your feelings about this or that person?

    Like

  90. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 8:03 pm

    Shelly yes I saw that one and it coincides with the lawsuit that was between Goodstein, the nurses and Hoefflin. Goodstein was going around telling the press that Michael had 50 nose jobs.
    Klein could not have “fired” Hoefflin because one doctor does not “fire” another doctor. Michael would have been the only one that could have stopped seeing Dr. Hoefflin because his medical provider is his choice.
    They are still doing cosmetic surgery on people with scarring from the discoid rashes today. It is only recent research that has shown that it works when the disorder is in remission and it doesn’t work when it isn’t.

    Like

  91. November 30, 2012 8:01 pm

    I was speaking about that letter on page 2, it’s from 1999

    http://www.radaronline.com/sites/default/files/HOEFFLIN%20consents%20and%20documents.pdf

    I believe he did an interview with the Sun when MJ died where he shows them some medical records.

    Like

  92. November 30, 2012 7:43 pm

    @lynande,

    I know KJ signed a letter for Hoefflin but I was speaking about a letter MJ signed in the nineties.

    Like

  93. November 30, 2012 7:33 pm

    “We don´t know about Michaels possible expectations of continued surgery.”

    Kaarin, the patient always expects only good from continued surgery. No patient will ever agree to a surgery if he knows or thinks that it will bring him only more damage. The patient trusts the doctor and what he tells him.

    Even if Michael had stood on his knees in front of Hoefflin asking him to cut his scalp further, Hoefflin should have never agreed if he knew that the risk was too big and was not justified. However I doubt that Michael really asked him for the resumption of that surgery – it was too painful for him, as it involved further skin stretching and having to live with this pain for several months more.

    Like

  94. November 30, 2012 7:14 pm

    That burn was not just a spot. It was more extensive than that and deep too.The initial treatment was correct for what was possible at the time.When it comes to later treatments by Hoefflin it makes no point to argue about Hoefflin v.Klein. We don´t know about Michaels possible expectations of continued surgery.The best he could have done was to seek further expert opinions.All in all that accidental burning of his scalp had major repercussions on his future,.

    Like

  95. November 30, 2012 6:59 pm

    “Not everyone that has lupus has complications during sugery.” – lynande

    That is true and this is the only reason why we can justify Hoefflin for taking the risk with the first surgery. But we know from the end result (Michael wearing a wig) that Michael did have complications. And according to Klein Hoefflin continued with that surgical treatment even though the first operation to cut out the bald spot was not a success.

    This is what I call irresponsible behavior on the part of Hoefflin.

    Over here we are reconstructing the events as they were, in a chronological order, so today’s problems between Klein and Hoefflin, or Klein giving Demerol to Michael when he was “rebuilding” his face before the London shows in 2009 do not have anything to do with those times, and I suggest we don’t mix them together. One problem at a time please.

    The question I am asking is “How did the Demerol problem start?” The answer I give is that it started due to Hoefflin making operations on Michael’s scalp. The operations were risky, not successful, involved very much pain, and who gave Demerol as a result of them does not really matter to me.

    The root of the problem were the operations themselves.

    Like

  96. November 30, 2012 6:21 pm

    “Helena I think you missed the point of what the problem is between Klein and Hoefflin.”– lynande

    No, I am not. The recent controversy between Klein and Hoefflin is the continuation of their old strife, and that strife stemmed from the time when Klein, as he said it himself, “fired” Hoefflin. And he fired him exactly because of those operations on Michael’s scalp.

    This strife is also connected with the issue of drugs. Hoefflin was making operations and stretching Michael’s skin, but Klein was the doctor to whom Michael evidently went to address his pain. Klein most probably gave him Demerol, but the ultimate reason for it was not Klein himself, but Hoefflin.

    In short if Hoefflin had not been making those operations (and no stretches of skin) there would have been no need for Demerol.

    And if there hadn’t been all that pain, there is a chance that Michael would have slept better too (with no need for propofol). However propofol is a side issue here – we are talking about Michael’s addiction to opiates and Demerol is an opiate derivative.

    Who was responsible for it? The one who inflicted all that (unnecessary) pain.

    Like

  97. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 6:17 pm

    Helena there was underlying tissue, like muscle, involved with the burn. You can’t graph that it and it does not grow back on it’s own. To leave it you would have had exposed bone and you can’t do that. Not everyone that has lupus has complications during sugery. It can happen but if they need it they have it. People with Lupus have ot have knee and hip replacements along with other surgeries all the time and they recover just fine.

    Like

  98. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 6:08 pm

    Helena I think you missed the point of what the problem is between Klein and Hoefflin.
    None of Kleins accusations came out until Murray said that he had given Michael opiates. In return he said Michael was not addicted to opiates but to propofol.
    When they started to investigate Klein after Michael’s death he started pointing at other doctors not because of the opiates they gave him but he said the Hoefflin was the one that got Michael “addicted” to propofol. He only added to the problem we have refuting Murray’s claim that Michael was an addict. Murray claimed that the reason Michael couldn’t sleep was a relapse of his opiate addiction and pointed at Klein. Klein in turn said Michael did not have an opiate addiction but was addicted to propofol and that Hoefflin started that.
    Michael was not addicted to propofol. It was not possible for Hoefflin to have caused an addiction that does not exist.The only reason that people think Michael was addicted to propofol is because Murray said so. I don’t believe anything he says. Klein was just saying anything he could not to look like he was doing something wrong and he said someof the stupidest things I have heard.
    That is all I’m saying is that the truly irresponsible doctors in Michael’s life were Murray and Klein. That and it is my guess that the propofol started with a recommendation from Tohme. Up until someone investigated him after Michael died everyone, including Michael, thought that man was an orthopedic surgeon.I think he was the one that suggested it and Murray was the one that did it.

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  99. November 30, 2012 5:51 pm

    “And there was no way to repair that burn without surgery.There was no way it would heal without surgery.”

    Lynande, it is perfectly clear that a bald spot resulting from a burn will never grow hair. BUT a doctor is always to weigh up the benefit of his treatment with the possible harm of it.

    The first rule of a doctor’s oath since Hippocrates is not to do harm (“I will keep from harm and injustice”.) So if there is a possibility that more surgery will bring about only more damage a doctor should refrain from it.

    This was the essence of a quarrel between Hoefflin and Klein. Klein saw that every new surgery only expanded the wounded area and brought more scarring. He put a stop to it after Hoefflin’s several tries. And all this time Michael had to be given painkillers.

    Whether Klein gave them to Michael or Hoefflin, it does not really matter – we should look into the root of the problem, and the root of the problem was HOEFFLIN. He took much risk though the odds against the operation were very big due to Michael’s lupus.

    What else could they do with that spot? I don’t know but even wearing a hairpiece would be a better solution. Probably stitching into the skin some artificial hair could help (though this is an operation too, and the artificial hairs could be rejected and fall off). I really don’t know. But what I do know is that Hoefflin took too much risk with Michael’s lupus and also totally disregarded the issue of Michael’s extruciating pain.

    How did he expect Michael to cope with all that pain? Wasn’t it irresponsible of him to first make the operation and then wash off his hands of the resulting pain? And continue with that “treatment” again and again? Remember that he was stretching his skin!

    Like

  100. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 5:35 pm

    And there was no way to repair that burn without surgery.There was no way it would heal without surgery.

    Like

  101. November 30, 2012 5:34 pm

    “That burn ,damaging forever his hairgrowth must have caused a psychological trauma too, to a young man not so pleased with his looks to start with.” – kaarin

    Oh, it must have been a very big psychological trauma. It also didn’t allow him to date girls. And the hairgrowth problem stretched itself into several years afterwards when Michael had to battle with all those operations on his scalp. It was probably due to all that stress that his vitiligo also became very extensive which added new problems to those he already had.

    All this makes you really understand why Michael was so shy with women during that period of his life. Having all those problems one after another is a really big blow to a young man’s self-esteem and confidence.

    First acne, then a crust on his head due to lupus, then a burn and a bald spot, then stretching his skin and having even to sleep in a hat (with a baloon stretching his skin under it), then the operations, than even more baldness, and finally extensive vitiligo with him first going spotty and then totally white!

    A fraction of all those problems would often be enough to make a young man shy with girls, and Michael had them all!

    Like

  102. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 5:21 pm

    I see now that you are talking about Michael’s pain and his drug addiction. He had drug addiction issues off and on through out his adult life from many things that happened. He would have gotten many doses of opiates for pain following everything from his broken nose to the surgery that repaired that and the one that repaired the surgery. Hoefflin did the second one that repaired the poorly done first one. Then he was probably on them for the scar removal. There is also the dental work that he had done that he would have gotten them for. He had broken ribs, he had a broken foot, he had compression fractures to his spine and yes he would have gotten them for each and everyone of them even after he was in rehab because that is what would have been the only thing that treated his pain.
    I think that blaming a doctor to give someone the only thing that works is wrong.
    Then in the very end we have Klein giving him Demerol for his work in 2009.If you are going to blame Hoefflin for what he did then you have to blame Klein for what he did because his was the one that most recent and he was aware of Michael’s previous addiction issues. When and where it began was long before Hoefflin did his first surgery.It might have started with the removal of his wisdom teeth for all we know.
    I have explained in length the way that opiates work. Everyone that takes them becomes addicted to them because of the way they work on the brain.Unfortunately in the beginning they were thought to be the best pain relief out there because in fact they are.Doctors will continue to use them when they are indicated.
    Then there is the fact that what is known about healing and Lupus is really about healing and Systemic Lupus. And also back in the mid eighties and early nineties not much was known about Lupus. You have to take into account what was known then and what is known now.The two are not the same.
    Instead of becoming angry with me for pointing out what is in the photos you could give a thought to the fact the Klein was fully aware of Michael’s previous issues with pain control and gave him Demerol for proceedures where it is not indicated.It was indicated in everything that Hoefflin did. I could get into what he did but you should know that the investigation in Klein is not over he just has it in a stall right now that’s all. And since I have yet to see a letter or anything else from the Estate or Katherine giving Klein permission to talk about Michael I will have to say that he has no business even talking about Michael.

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  103. November 30, 2012 5:04 pm

    This reopens the discussion of Michaels considerable health problems. That burn ,damaging forever his hairgrowth must have caused a psychological trauma too, to a young man not so pleased with his looks to start with.
    I am sure Hoefflin nor any other doctor or hospital would never have released medical records. Very disturbing is the Smoking Gun re Michael´s other very personal documents,including letters he had written, other privately written material, his Blue X card with SS nr and so on. Has that issue with Vaccaro (?) been resolved yet?There seems to be no end of exploiting Michael, who in life did all to protect his privacy.

    * * *

    VMJ: Kaarin, I think you meant “never” instead of “ever” and corrected it. Okay?

    Like

  104. November 30, 2012 4:36 pm

    “After saying all of that all I can say is that I don’t think Hoefflin is the one behind the auction of those photos.” – lynande

    I don’t think that he is either. But for me a much more important thing is the fact that he kept doing surgery on Michael though he knew of his lupus. And offered that terribly painful treatment which ended in MJ’s drug addiction.

    The burn spot after the year of conservative treatment (by dressings, etc.) was something Michael could live with. It could be masked in some way. But instead Hoefflin expanded it to the size of a huge wound which brought about only new and huger problems.

    This was what it was like before the surgery, on December 18, 1984, almost a year after the burn:
    MJ's burn Dec.18, 1984

    And this is the size of it after the surgery:

    MJ's burn after surgery Dec.18, 1984

    Doing things like that KNOWING all the time that the patient has lupus?

    It is IRRESPONSIBLE!

    Like

  105. November 30, 2012 4:24 pm

    “As for the burn it looked like he closed it. Then a few years later the scar tissue from closing it became a problem for Michael so he attempted to remove that scar tissue. Sometimes that happens to people with or without discoid lupus.”

    Lynande, you seem to be overlooking the point that with lupus patients problems ALWAYS happen and that making that operation was a huge risk, which was not justified.

    “The removal of that tissue would have been Michael’s choice at that point because closing the wound would have been considered the resolution of the accident.’

    A patient always chooses hair instead of baldness and will be ready to take the risk in an attempt to restore his hair. But doctors should not allow themselves this risk when they know for sure that the wound will never really heal (due to lupus). And please remember that to be able to stitch the skin together first it also had to be stretched!

    This resulted in PAIN which brought about DRUGS (no matter who gave them to MJ). And the end result of all that highly risky treatment was a WIG anyway. This surgical treatment did not work and should NOT have been done in the first place. I agree with Klein!

    Like

  106. November 30, 2012 4:16 pm

    “Helena the photos show the injury from the beggining until the end of the treatment.”

    Lynande, this is exactly what I mean.

    “When a person is burned badly (3rd-4th degree) the skin becomes necrotic or dead. Sometimes and as a matter of fact most of the time, the underlying tissue is burned and is also necrotic. Necrotic tissue cannot be left it must be removed or it will become infected.”

    You don’t have to explain it. Most of us understand what it is like. My foot was also severely burnt when I was a small child, and I still remember those procedures as if they were yesterday.

    I was talking about a totally different thing. When Hoefflin made his reconstructive surgery a year later there was no necrosis in that area. All that was there was a bald spot which had already healed by then.

    Like

  107. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 4:01 pm

    After saying all of that all I can say is that I don’t think Hoefflin is the one behind the auction of those photos. First because Hoefflin has never released anything from him before and he has not made any statements to the press. The press got things but they got them when he was on sabatical in Mexico working for his chartiy.

    Like

  108. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 3:51 pm

    You can tell that Michael had a problem with scarring because of the two little scars on each side of his nose from his rhinoplasty. He has something happen that is in fact quite common in black people called keratinization. That means that when he scars they become raised instead of flat or indented. This causes tightness and sensitivity in the scar and some people chose to have it removed or attempt to.The funny thing about those bilateral scars on Michael’s nose is that it proves his skin was still like a black persons inspite of the loss of melanocytes from the vitiligo.

    Like

  109. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 3:36 pm

    Shelly Katherine Jackson signed a letter then she recinded it. Her handwriting is the same and the signature appears the same in the letter releasing Dr. Hoefflin as it does in other things she has signed. Unfortunately after Michael’s death Katherine has signed and given permission to doctors, and business associates that she then denied that she had given. We have seen that to be the case more than once unfortunately. If that is the case then someone is signing things for her and that should be investigated. If that is not the case Katherine has made some mistakes in judgement and then regretted it. So what.
    Most of what went on with Hoefflin goes back to the late 1990’s when he was being sued by those nurses. It coincides with him turning Wallace Goodstein into the Cal Med board. After he did that Goodstein has been on every program he could saying that Michael had over 50 nose jobs when such a thing is not even possible.
    Now what is going on with Hoefflin is between him and Klein. It is a toss up at this point which one of them is worse when it comes to talking about the other but I have noticed that he hasn’t been attacking Klein in the press as much as Klein is talking to the press.
    As for the burn it looked like he closed it. Then a few years later the scar tissue from closing it became a problem for Michael so he attempted to remove that scar tissue. Sometimes that happens to people with or without discoid lupus. The removal of that tissue would have been Michael’s choice at that point because closing the wound would have been considered the resolution of the accident.
    There is also the difference between then and now. Now depending on what was wrong with scar tissue it can be dealt with non surgically, but back then some of these alternatives were not available.

    Like

  110. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 2:48 pm

    Helena the photos show the injury from the beggining until the end of the treatment. They would have to because Pepsi was paying for the resolution of that wound. He showed what it looked like when it happened, what it looked like prior to the surgery and what it looked like after the surgery. That is when it was considered resolved.
    There would have been several stages in the process of resolving the burn wound. The photos only show three. You don’t have photos of the dressings and the debridement to get to where it was just prior to the surgery.
    When a person is burned badly (3rd-4th degree) the skin becomes necrotic or dead. Sometimes and as a matter of fact most of the time, the underlying tissue is burned and is also necrotic. Necrotic tissue cannot be left it must be removed or it will become infected.Once the tissue is removed through debridement that is when they start the grafting of skin or in this case because there was tissue also lost due to the burn they must start the tissue expansion so that the grafting can take place.

    Like

  111. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 2:32 pm

    Here in the United States we have something called the HIPPA Act. That means that in the health care field all of your records must be kept secure and private. A doctor, nurse, dentist, hospital or any kind of clinic cannot even acknowledge if that person has been a patient with out a release of information. Klein is the one that Michael gave permission after the 1992 Oprah interview to confirm that Michael had vitiligo.

    Like

  112. November 30, 2012 2:28 pm

    “Nothing in those photos or in the notes indicate in anyway that Dr. Hoefflin deviated from the standard of care and in fact he went above and beyond when he consulted with all of Michael’s doctors.”

    Lynande, nothing in the notes for January 27-28, 1984 indicate that Dr. Hoefflin deviated from the standard of care. But am I the only one who noticed that some pictures in that file refer to December 1984 or almost a year later?

    If my deciphering the dates is correct don’t you understand that the file covers not the two days in hospital only, but spans almost a year? And that the smaller, healed spot of the burn actually refers to Hoefflin’s reconstructive surgery when he made a long excision almost across the whole of Michael’s head?

    If the December 1984 date is correct then we are talking about totally different documents, not the ones provided to lawyers upon Michael’s release from the burn center, but the photos made by Hoefflin (or the burn center) and added almost a year later.

    Like

  113. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 2:27 pm

    No he has a letter from Katherine to talk about Michael not to release his records. She gave him permission to talk about Michael to the press. I have the letter.

    Like

  114. November 30, 2012 11:15 am

    If I remember well, in 2009, Hoefflin stated he had a letter of permission form Michael to release his records.

    Like

  115. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 8:05 am

    Hi Shelly I don’t think he did give them to Hoefflin in the 90’s. Here is a link to the original lawsuit against Vacarro. It is on page 11. Medical records some of which bear his Social Security number.
    http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/michael-jackson-wants-his-stuff-back

    Like

  116. shellywebstere permalink
    November 30, 2012 6:25 am

    @kaarin,

    The Estate is working on that.

    Like

  117. November 30, 2012 5:55 am

    The family on behalf of Michael should request the medical records,or the Estate.At least they need to find out who is behind this auctioning of such confidential material.

    Like

  118. shellywebstere permalink
    November 30, 2012 5:14 am

    I thought he gave them to Hoefflin in the nineties.

    Like

  119. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 4:44 am

    The file they are auctioning off came from Brotman Burn Center not from Dr. Hoefflin. That is who Michael signed the release of information to. From there they went to Lavely and Singer law offices. When the case was over and Pepsi Co, paid in full theu would have returned them to Michael because they were his records.

    Like

  120. November 30, 2012 3:58 am

    I just thought he could come from Hoefflin.

    Like

  121. lynande51 permalink
    November 30, 2012 3:45 am

    I don’t believe that these are from his lawyers. I think they are from Howard Mann. He purchased all of the contents from that storage locker from Henry Vacarro in 2009. He is partners with Fredric Marc Schaffel. I am pretty sure this is where they are coming from.
    About the photos and the notes with them. What it is, is Michael’s discharge summary the day after the burn.The amount of drugs that he was given were minimal for a 3rd degree burn to the scalp. The notes also says that the 3rd degree part was deep and I know no one wants to look but it appears to have gone to the bone,scalp tissue is not very thick. When the tissue is missing like it was in this case you have to use tissue expanders in order to get the tissue to cover the bone again.In other words it didn’t just include his skin but the underlying tissue. You can’t graft skin to bone you have to have the tissue too.
    Nothing in those photos or in the notes indicate in anyway that Dr. Hoefflin deviated from the standard of care and in fact he went above and beyond when he consulted with all of Michael’s doctors.
    Michael was given Dalmane( an old fashioned hypnotic) for sleep, Percocet and Darvon for pain control, and it had to be debrided before it could be repaired. That was done with the Silver Sulfadine and the dressings. He was on Plaquenil and Atabrine, both quinine derrivatives for his Discoid Lupus. They are used for “flares” in autoimmune disorders. He had a previous scalp infection from his discoid lupus and that is why Dr. Klein suggested Celcor instead of penicillin because it is better for skin infections.
    All this does is prove that Michael got the best care from all of his doctors that night and the next weeks. But releasing them for auction proves that Mann (my primary suspect) is an a**h***.

    Like

  122. November 29, 2012 2:59 pm

    Medical records are highly confidential.Now Michael had given them to his lawyers for reasons of claiming compensation. They still remain confidential and his lawyers should know that, To put them up for AUCTOIN is shameful.–To see the actual damage is shocking even when you have heard about it before.,and to know of the futile attempts to corect his scalp that caused him pain for years.He donated the whole sum he got as compensation to the burn center.And this is how he is treated.

    Like

  123. November 29, 2012 2:36 pm

    ““A verbal consultation with his treating dermatologist, Arnold Klein, M.D., revealed that the patient has had recent diagnosis of discoid lupus erythematosus with scalp flakiness and previous scalp infection.” So Michael already had a lupus infection on his scalp before the burning, which made the healing much more difficult.” – Susanne

    Susanne, and the most terrible thing of all is that it is Hoefflin who is writing it – so he KNOWS of Michael’s lupus! Earlier we doubted that he knew about it, but now this fact is proven by Hoefflin himself!

    Even we know that the skin would not heal if a patient has lupus and Hoefflin is a DOCTOR who nevertheless put an expanding baloon under that dreadful burnt skin to stretch it! It would stretch slowly, for weeks and probably months, after which he would cut it and stitch it up. But it didn’t work the first time, it didn’t work the second time, it didn’t work several times he tried! And all these months Michael was in extruciating pain! What was the point of making those operations if Hoefflin knew that lupus skin would not heal and would leave only more scars?

    Did he care? Or was it a challenge for him and he wanted to be a success no matter what? Now I understand why Dr. Klein was such a grave opponent of Dr. Hoefflin’s procedures and why Michael stayed with him and not with Hoefflin. Klein was absolutely right. Hoefflin may be an excellent plastic surgeon but he tried to sustain his magnificent reputation at the expense of his patient, his pain, his suffering and his eventual drug addiction that developed as a result of all those unnecessary operations.

    Even the sight of that burnt skin, expanded and then cut, makes you almost faint, so can we imagine how much suffering it gave Michael and on an ongoing basis too? DAY AND NIGHT! And for MONTHS!

    Isn’t it a complete joke to speak of “sleep” in these circumstances? Who can sleep with a scar like that?

    And who can blame Michael for taking Demerol when he suffered so much? Of blame Dr. Klein for easing his pain? It was an absolute must!

    And just imagine it – none of us knew of the nightmare Michael was going through. He never complained, never showed to anyone his pain. In fact he even performed despite his condition and tried to look cheerful. The more you learn about Michael, the more awed you are of his stoicism.

    To spare everyone the pain of seeing the other pictures I am placing here only the photo of the stiched up scar:
    MJ's burn scar stitched up

    It seems that it is dated December 18, 1984 or almost a year after the burn (January 27, 1984). And this means that we see here the result of all that stretching.

    All this year Michael lived in unbearable pain. And how much more of it was still to come?

    Like

  124. November 29, 2012 12:14 pm

    Helena, that’s exactly what I thought: The shocking thing is that it is up for sale. The good thing about it is again that the documents confirm our knowledge about Michael’s lupus. The document says: “A verbal consultation with his treating dermatologist, Arnold Klein, M.D., revealed that the patient has had recent diagnosis of discoid lupus erythematosus with scalp flakiness and previous scalp infection.” So Michael already had a lupus infection on his scalp before the burning, which made the healing much more difficult.

    Like

  125. November 29, 2012 5:33 am

    “It’s about his medical record. http://twitition.com/75288” – Shelly

    Shelly, I’ve moved the petition agaisnt selling Michael’s medical records to the post about lupus and I’ve signed it. Though the matters disclosed will explain in most graphic detail why Michael had to take painkillers, the fact that someone is making money on Michael’s sufferings is disgusting. I could never even think that the photos like that could be sold.

    Anything for money?

    Like

  126. November 29, 2012 5:26 am

    “Oh Jesus Christ, has anyone seen this: https://www.pristineauction.com/auctions/index/details/id/72650 ” – Susanne

    Susanne, the documents are awfully distressing but they will shock the public into finally realizing in how much pain Michael was and mostly due to Hoefflin’s operations on Michael’s scalp. The documents are damning for Hoefflin and helpful for understanding how the addiction to painkillers started.

    For me the most shocking thing is that someone is putting this for SALE. If the documents appeared in some medical journal or tabloid it would still be very distressing, but offering them for sale is a total disgrace and degradation. I really don’t understand the mentality of some people.

    Like

  127. November 4, 2012 7:55 pm

    Hi, thanks for an intresting article and a great blog! It’s really impressive.

    After reading this article I thought about the eating-part of it, and how some claimed that Michael was anorexic. First let me say I think it’s obvious that Michael weren’t “very” anorexic becouse if he were, he would not have been able to dance or really do anything. I think of the people who basicly gets very weak.

    But I remember something Michael said in the so called Glenda-tapes. I have only quickly looked through small parts of them (but it wasn’t so intresting..) but I remember that at one point in Michael’s conversation with his female freind, he basicly talked about some problems that bothered him, and he said “…and I also got this anorexia-thing”. I think that’s what he said.

    Now, he could have said that for just saying it, but I do think he felt he had some problems with food althrough it was probably under control. He also told that therapist or what he was, tha Rabbi, that in he’s teens he would starve himself as self-punishment, becouse he was so angry at Joe but took it out on himself through food, and becouse he wanted to “control something”.

    That sounds very typical for how anorexia can develop. And believe me, I sadly have experienced it close with both a family member and myself.

    Like

  128. September 9, 2012 10:30 pm

    Poor mj I wish the best for you and your relatives

    Like

  129. Truth Prevail permalink
    August 15, 2012 4:36 am

    Whats the deal with Michael’s hair the media likes to say Michael was bold when he passed away but we saw that picture MJ had hair.

    Did Michael use a hairpiece or have a hair transplant?

    Like

  130. August 14, 2012 8:41 pm

    “Some people just refuse to believe MJ had vitiligo they say stuff like the autopsy report never proved anything because the Jackson family paid them to write it down he had.”

    Truth Prevail, this proves to us that if Jordan Chandler were to confess his guilt in slandering Michael these people would say the same – “Someone paid big money to him and he lied again, this time in favor of Jackson”. These people will never know the truth even if it is thrust in their faces. They live in lies and will die in lies because siding with lies is the choice they’ve made in their life.

    And we in the meantime should try to get to the truth without any Jordan Chandler’s confessions.

    Like

  131. Truth Prevail permalink
    August 14, 2012 7:44 pm

    Some people just refuse to believe MJ had vitiligo they say stuff like the autopsy report never proved anything because the Jackson family paid them to write it down he had.

    Pathetic!

    Like

  132. nannorris permalink
    May 21, 2012 8:38 am

    Lyndande51

    I agree it was PTSD..If you look at this clip which I did show Randy T, he is not drugged, he is acknowledging people , saying thank you etc ..He is just an emotional wreck as we all would be ..Ms Yu was very emotional; , , sobbing,when the verdicts were being read.
    Frankly I would have fainted if someone was putting me through that ..Which , to me , shows what strong character MJ really had..
    If you look at the footage of mj still in the courthouse , leaving and going by all the reporters , Randy is way on the other side..
    Just look at the faces of the reporters, and the court officers as he walks by ,
    This was a group of people who clearly were not on his side, ….
    Randy had told me he wished he hadnt described MJ as really drugged in his book , he wished he had chosen different words , or something to that effect..He said he still felt he was on medication though…
    There is a world of difference between someone taking a medication and someone drugged up..
    I have since heard Randy describe MJ as traumatized that day , not drugged , so it is good to have a dialogue with people whether you agree or not, since no one is putting a camera in face and asking my opinion..
    I had also asked him if MJ had ever threatened any reporter there , growled at them in any menacing type way or had ever been rude to any of them , because I had heard someone say that happened and with all the cameras everywhere , i was surprised that no one had it on tape..
    He told me in no uncertain terms that never happened , he was there every day , not only would he have seen it take place , but it would be completely out of character ..
    Then I told him it was DD…LOL , and he had no response..LOL

    Like

  133. May 20, 2012 7:47 pm

    Being nice to a journalist who was intent on going around proclaiming himself as MJ’s “official biographer” isn’t considering them a friend. JRT claims to be friends with people like Beyonce, Angelina Jolie, etc, do you really think he’s their friend too just because he says so?

    Like

  134. Rodrigo permalink
    May 20, 2012 7:17 pm

    Michael thanked Taraborelli for defending him back in the day, by offering him a llama as a gift or something?

    I mean, to Michael’s face he was a friend type, but behind his back, it was a different story.

    Like

  135. May 20, 2012 6:41 pm

    Michael didn’t consider JRT his “friend”, that’s why there’s only one photo of JRT with MJ and the Jacksons (JRT often crops the other Jacksons out of the shot) from 1978.

    Like

  136. Rodrigo permalink
    May 20, 2012 6:10 pm

    Taraborelli considers Dimond and Orth as his friends?

    Is he for real?

    And he considered himself a friend to Michael?

    That. Is. Twisted.

    I shouldn’t be too angry about it though. Taraborelli has come out with SOME honest things in his career. But he’s also come out with his own crap, which I’m sure Michael wasn’t aware of, otherwise Michael wouldn’t have considered him HIS friend.

    But at the end of the day, we’ve seen so many so called ‘friends’ turn traitor to Michael, dirtying their souls for money and career, its a tad bit tiresome now.

    Like

  137. lynande51 permalink
    May 20, 2012 8:40 am

    Has anyone here ever seen someone following a trauma? That is what PTSD originates from is a trauma. In the past and from soldiers following a war it was called shell shock, or battle fatigue. After a long battle during a war some of the soldiers would walk around looking dazed as if they were lost or had been hit but they had no injuries. Some of them would even question why they were still alive and even if they were still alive.It is a type of disociation that the mind uses so the person can endure and survive what they just went through. That is exactly what Michael looked like when he walked into and out of that courtroom on the day of the verdicts. He would not have needed drugs to make him look like that and as a matter of fact drugs would have made him look better. Everyone should remember when he left Neverland that day he had no idea what was going to happen. He had no idea if he would be going home or to jail or what his fate would be as he rode in that car to go to court. I for one am bone tired of hearing that he was taking drugs and that is why he looked like that! I would just love for JRT, DD or any of the way to many others go through what Michael went through and then see what they looked like!

    Like

  138. Hilary permalink
    May 20, 2012 7:33 am

    @nannorris HE DELETED YOUR QUESTIONS??

    Wow, wth. I never thought people could be such vultures and backstabbers until I learned about the people surrounding Michael.

    Like

  139. Hilary permalink
    May 20, 2012 7:30 am

    @Truth Prevail

    Yeah, I HIGHLY doubt they are good friends, but I don’t doubt they Michael kept in touch with him over the years.

    Randy claims he was there during the Pepsi burn accident. I wonder why though? His first book came out in 91, the burn was in 84.

    Randy said in an article that the last 4 years of Michael’s life were probably his best (though he went on to say that he never saw Michael since the acquittal). WHAT? When he was being frivolously sued left, right and center? When he couldn’t even afford to pay his own bodyguards and get a plane ticket to Jesse Jackson’s birthday (if those stories from teh bodyguards are true, that is)? I guess he meant Michael was happy cause he had time to relax and spend with his kids, so in that regard, yes they were happy years. But Michael had to deal with the fact that everywhere he went, people were thinking, “Did he do it or not?” And from just looking at photos of Michael, he didn’t really look like the Michael the public once loved. His spirit was drained after that trial.

    In that same article, he said that Michael was so drugged up on June 13, 2005, that he didn’t even react to the verdict. BS! if you were walking into a room where you would find out if your fate was in the hand of 12 strangers, would you not be so afraid, that you were emotionless? I feel sad just thinking about that footage of Michael walking out of the courtroom after he was acquitted. He never looked that sad (if you could call that sad) during the entire trial, even on pyjama day. Mesereau even said Michel was always clear and lucid during the trial so he definitely wasn’t on drugs.

    Like

  140. Truth Prevail permalink
    May 19, 2012 3:50 pm

    I also hate the fact that randy keeps saying he was a good friend of Michael which i highly doubt.

    Like

  141. Truth Prevail permalink
    May 19, 2012 3:49 pm

    @nannorris

    In other words they are turn coats and go with the whats popular at the time.

    Like

  142. nannorris permalink
    May 19, 2012 8:16 am

    I happen to have been on randy t page when diane dimond dropped in to correct someone spelling..long and short of it is people went started telling her off ..and i remember randy saying Diane Dimond is awesome !..In an attempt to defend her…

    I very quickly asked Diane to give her opinion regarding some info that came out in the F.B.I. files, what she aware that the prosecutors had not handed over exculpatory evidence to the defense ..Randy deleted my questions.
    Although I know she follows his page , i havent seen her comment again…
    He has also said nice things regarding maureen Orth also, saying that on a personal note , they are some very nice people., that covered the MJ trial
    When the local show that had zonen on ,” Just between Us”was posted on his page , he had a measured comment regarding how Ron should have just said he respected the jurors verdicts..
    I assumed he did that because you never know when you may need info from someone or an interview from Ron Zonen..He always plays neutral..I could be wrong but i recall him saying he didnt have any animosity toward bashir for his documentary., a long time ago..
    But that was when it was popular to blame Mj for any and all circumstances he found himself in…
    randy is a likeable personality , but i find that , just like Schumley, MJ appeal can come from how much money he makes for people.
    i first saw Schumley criticism of Mj on Belief.net and he said he had interviewed MJ for a chapter in a book he was doing on childhood..3 months later MJ became the entire book and it was critical…He also implied he didnt know if mj was guilty or not., when interviewed on tv..at least that was the impression i got..
    As MJ popularity increased , his next book was kinder to MJ and he was no longer believing he was capable of any wrongdoing.. that he was accused of..
    Now we see Schumley defending MJ from being a Nazi sympathizer the other day…
    The more popular MJ gets , the more sales he generates and more good friends he seems to get..
    This isa good barometer for how Mj image is being resurrected..

    Like

  143. Hilary permalink
    May 18, 2012 9:46 am

    OMG he also has Maureen Orth and Stacy Brown listed there! This guy is disgusting.

    Like

  144. Hilary permalink
    May 18, 2012 9:45 am

    OMG More reason to hate Taraborelli. This is straight from the lateest edition of his MJ book:

    “In 2005 I covered the Michael Jackson molestation trial in Santa, Maria, California for CBS News and Court TV…I’ve met so many amazing people during my time with CBS-media colleagues, many of whom I now count as GOOD FRIENDS OF MINE and who were supportive of me in my efforts to do my best job. I would like to acknowledge just a few of them here: MY VERY GOOD FREINDS Bruce Rheins and Dawn Westlake (he continues to list like 20 names and then)….DIANE DIMOND…!”

    DIANE DIMOND? Is this guy serious? No friend of Diane can be a friend of Michael.

    Like

  145. lynande51 permalink
    May 18, 2012 7:34 am

    Yes I remember that silly story going around that Michael was Latoya and then a couple of years later he was Janet? Poor Rebbie never got an honorable mention in that crazy story. That was around the Bad era I think. At an awards ceremony Michael had all of his sisters come up on stage with him to prove that they really were different people. It was cute.This is the one with Janet there is a different one with Latoya too.

    Like

  146. May 18, 2012 7:27 am

    There was a dermatologist who also commented on it and said that vitiligo CAN be caused by using those kinds of creams, so it’s not just an anti-Michael theory, it’s been proven.

    They only mean in small bits though. The skin is an organ and rejuvenates, a normal body will continue having new melanin grow, so although if you use the creams you can permanently damage your skin and cause patches of whiteness, it’s impossible to completely strip your skin unless you already have vitiligo. Even with vitiligo if you start using creams you have to use them for the rest of your life because your body will still have melanin coming back in in places. So when dermatologists says that, you can permanently eradicate melanin in some places, but you can’t actually give yourself what Michael had. Nobody else on this planet has ever managed to whiten their skin entirely other than Michael supposedly.

    She became like 10 shades lighter to as white as Michael was, and now she’s much darker

    That was only really bad make up, you can see it caked onto her during that time. She’s always been light, there are photos of her as a child where she’s really light. She still gets like that now. If you notice Joe is light in contrast to his kids too, it’s because his mother was biracial.

    Like

  147. lynande51 permalink
    May 18, 2012 7:25 am

    The autopsy report lists vitiligo on it and an autopsy report is a legal medical document. Actually all medical documentation is considered legal documentation because you have to write exactly what something is.
    As for Benoquin is is very strong and you actually are not supposed to apply it to the already lightened areas because it can cause a chemical burn. You are not even supposed to apply it with your fingers but should use a cotton swab to apply it so it does not get on your fingers and the application is more precise. If you look at Michael’s fingernails in a close up you can see the different shades where he has lost pigment under his nail bed as well and you can’t get Benoquin under a fingernail to do that.
    The reason that his nails appear dark is because under the nail in the area called the nail bed there are melanocytes too.That and the contrast of his hand to the pigment of his nail bed is what appeared to make them dark. If you look at the first photo in Helena’s article here you can see some of the pigmenting differences in his nail bed. The closer to the base of the nail bed or the matrix it is darker than at the tip.

    Like

  148. Hilary permalink
    May 18, 2012 7:14 am

    @lacienegasmiles

    Hey thanks for getting back to me. I was always conflicted about Taraborelli, but now I know not to really trust him.

    I had no idea Michael showed vitiligo symptoms in the 70’s. that throws that chicken-egg theory out the window. There was a dermatologist who also commented on it and said that vitiligo CAN be caused by using those kinds of creams, so it’s not just an anti-Michael theory, it’s been proven. But I believe you when you say he had it in the 70’s. Heck, I just realized, in the Oprah Interview, Michael said vitiligo started in Off the wall…

    But about Latoya…yes, she was lightskinned, but remember that Latoya-and-Michael-are-one-and-the-same era? She became like 10 shades lighter to as white as Michael was, and now she’s much darker. So I don’t think the thing about her using lightening cream is totally bunk. I myself have used a lightening cream called Fair & Lovely, which is from india. I don’t consider that to mean that I’m ashamed of my background, so that’s where I’m coming from when I say Mike or Latoya might have used them. It’s not a ‘bad’ thing to me.

    I never believed he “bleached” his body white. That’s ridiculous. A friend of mine told me she once bleached her face (I don’t know how and where, this was years ago) because she went on vacation and came back really dark, and it helped restore her back to her ‘normal’ color. When I looked at her face close up, I could see her facial hair had also been lightened to an orange-blond. From what I understand, that’s all skin bleaching can ever do. The only way Michael could get that white is if he bathed in Javex. And besides, if you look at his hands, you can see how his skin appears translucent, the way Oprah said, and sometimes his face looks that way too, depending on how his makeup is done.

    And thanks for the information aboout benzene! I learn something new on this site everyday! Let me use that against teh 12 year old trolls on Youtube…LOL.

    “Anyone who said MJ faked his vitiligo at any point have only just exposed how easy it is to lie about Michael”

    great point! I always believed he had vitiligo, because I’ve seen many people with it, but when I read that comment from Taraborelli, I doubted if that was the reason for his going white.

    Like

  149. Hilary permalink
    May 18, 2012 6:52 am

    @Truth Prevail I know, I was being sarcastic about Diane Dimond. She is full of it. And by it, I mean shit. LOL.

    Like

  150. lynande51 permalink
    May 18, 2012 4:52 am

    No that one is bigger but was only used as an example because you can really see it. That was my only point in using that one and some of them are smaller and some are even larger.

    Like

  151. May 18, 2012 4:45 am

    Not all lupus lesions look like that, some are less severe like the other photos listed there.

    Like

  152. lynande51 permalink
    May 18, 2012 4:43 am

    His x rays from Murray which is about the only thing that I would believe from him because they were done by someone else showed infiltrates and he was given antibiotics.That is more indicative of pneumonia which was his diagnosis. That is why his body guard Mike called him in the first place. All pain associated with the lungs is called pleural pain. It means that it hurts when you inhale. The scarring would have been caused by a burst blood vessel in his lungs because blood vessels in your lungs aren’t supposed to burst. When they do it would leak into the interior part of the lung and cover the alveoli causing them to deflate temporarily. Then when they reinflate they would be scarred from the healing process. Fibrin cells would replace the regular cells which is called keratosis or scarring. It would be thicker just like any other scar on any other part of the epithelial tissue.

    Like

  153. lynande51 permalink
    May 18, 2012 4:37 am

    Here is a photo of what discoid lesions look like.
    http://dermis.net/dermisroot/en/38389/image.htm

    Like

  154. May 18, 2012 4:29 am

    Those marks look like lupus lesions that he’d tried to cover up. Klein said during the trial that some of the filler treatments he’d given to Michael in 2009 were related to covering up marks in his skin relating to lupus.

    Michael had plueritic pain in his lungs in 2007 according to Murray too, damage also showed up on an X-Ray that he had back then.

    Michael said in Moonwalk:

    I later learnt that this condition was related to pleurisy.

    Making it seem like an ongoing problem.

    Like

  155. lynande51 permalink
    May 18, 2012 4:13 am

    Pleurisy, also called pleuritis, is an inflammation of the pleura, which is the moist, double-layered membrane that surrounds the lungs and lines the rib cage. The condition can make breathing extremely painful.
    It is most commonly associated with viral inflamation or pneumonia. Yes people with Lupus can have pleurisy but considering how long it had been since the burst blood vessel and his death he could not have had SLE something entirely different than DLE. If Michael had had a pneumo thorax an exterior scar on the effected side would have been evidence of reinflating the lung and there is no scar listed in that area on the autopsy report. To reinflate a lung you have to put in a chest tube and that is done from the outside in.
    Not everything that speaks of Michael’s health was accurate when it became public. The scars that were listed were primarily from taking skin to reconstruct his scalp and the ones on his neck were where they had the tissue expansion devices inserted and removed. Since DLE is also considered an autoimmune disorder he would have had flares of that so he would have gone to Dr. Metzger for treatment of his DLE too. Dr. Metzger is a specialist in internal medicine called a rheumatologist. I did not say that he did not have DLE but I never saw a lesion that resemble one on him. What I saw in photos was the natual progression of his other autoimmune disorder Vitiligo.
    It’s hard to describe what Vitiligo looks like when it is progressing. Not all of the skin is affected and you can sometimes get areas that look lighter and darker all within the same area because it is such a slow process. I see that we both wrote what Dr. Metzger is though that’s funny.

    Like

  156. May 18, 2012 3:57 am

    Here are some photos of other people with lupus lesions:

    http://www.aafp.org/afp/2001/0715/p289.html

    Michael has confirmed himself he had lupus. He was seeing a rheumatoid lupus specialist Dr Metzger for a lot of his life, and they even gave a speech together at a charity in 2003 to raise money for lupus.

    Like

  157. May 18, 2012 3:51 am

    The pnuemo thorax was related to pleurisy, confirmed by Michael a few times, pleurisy is associated with lupus. Michael complained to Quncy about having “blisters in his lungs” he was talking about his pleurisy.

    He might have had discoid lupus

    He did have discoid lupus.

    Like

  158. lynande51 permalink
    May 18, 2012 3:48 am

    The changes in his lungs was called Squamous Metaplasia. I think I might be able to clarify something so there is not a misunderstading here. The skin is made up of epithelial cells and that is what the lungs are epithelial tissue.
    A lot of the damage to his lungs probably occured post trauma during ressucitative efforts and the mechanical ventilation. The “scar” could have been changes due to any irritant. He also had pneumonia according to Murray’s minimal records because he was treating him for it. In 1977 according to his own book Moonwalker he suddenly had chest pain and shortness of breath while at Jermaine’s house. He was taken to the emergency room and he had a blood vessel burstin his lung. That could also cause scarring. A discoid lesion is usually very round in appearance because the word discoid means round. They are usually dry and scaly and look bright read because they involve the dermal layers of the skin. He might have had discoid lupus and that could have involved the lungs but his other organs gave no evidence of SLE and by age 50 his body would have shown involvement in other organs if it had gone to SLE.

    Like

  159. May 18, 2012 2:39 am

    He did suffer from discoid lesions.

    http://rhythmofthetide.com/category/michaels-appearance/lupus-michaels-appearance/

    Michael’s lupus involved lung damage so it did involve more than just his skin.

    Like

  160. lynande51 permalink
    May 18, 2012 2:35 am

    I do have tosay one thing about MJ and Lupus. The kind of Lupus that he was supposedly diagnosed with by Dr. Klein was Discoid Lupus not Systemic Lupus Erythematosus. The prognosis is very good for people with Discoid Lupus. Some 10% may go on to develope SLE but it is rare and would have effected Michael’s other organs by the age of 50 and would have been very evident in the last few years of his life. I do think he might have had these lesions but there are no photos of him with a discoid lesion so the onyl documentation was the documentation is Dr. Klein.
    Vitiligo is an autoimmune disorder and like all other auto immune disorders is much like an allergic reaction. What happens is that the body responds to itself in certain ways like it would to an allergy. The result is that in Michael’s case for whatever reason his own body thought that his melanocytes were something that needed to be reacted to like poison Ivy and it started to destroy them.

    Like

  161. Julie permalink
    May 18, 2012 12:02 am

    @lacienegasmiles – I’m so glad you said that about Taraborelli. He flip flops worse than anything I have ever seen and whenever he is on anything having to do with Michael – I either fast forward of flip the channel until he’s off.

    He was on the David Gest documentary that I watched recently and he was saying that he was the only journalist during the trial who thought Michael Jackson was innocent – yet if you saw him on documentaries done while Michael was alive and you read his book (and many updates) — he doesn’t say anything in support of Michael’s innocense, but rather makes it appear that he leans toward Michael’s guilt in my opinion.

    Like

  162. May 17, 2012 11:55 pm

    I didn’t read over all the comments, but I read that Taraborelli claims Michael WAS whitening his skin and that in turn caused an autoimmune attack on his pigment in the early 80′s. Apparently the white skin is a chicken-or-the-egg thing: vitiligo vs skin lightening treatment. Even if that was true, that doesn’t mean anything. There are plenty of naturally light skinned black people. If Michael wanted to be light skinned-I’m NOT saying he did- it doesn’t mean he didn’t want to be “black”.

    Taraborrelli claims a lot of things.

    He said MJ and Toya would cover themselves in bleaching cream… LaToya has always been light skinned. It was just a way for him to trash Michael and bringing in the naturally light skinned sister and making it seem like she had to be using it too, because nobody black can ever be born with naturally light skin.

    Michael’s vitiligo was showing up in the early 70s, you can see little marks on his hands, then in 77 he had a pnuemothorax relating to pleurisy, pleurisy is something that is directly related to lupus, which is what Michael also had. If people think Michael faked his vitiigo, do they also think he faked lupus? He fakes one autoimmune disease but manages to still have another?

    It isn’t a chicken/egg anyhing, Michael had vitiligo and in order to treat it he was given creams but only in 1990 according to depositions made by his doctors about it. You can’t bleach your body white, it isn’t physically possible. Nobody else on the planet has ever supposedly done this other than Michael. The main ingredient for the creams is benzene, which is a carcinogen, if he’d been pouring it over his body the way he would have had to have done to strip his pigment like that he would have had cancer years and years ago.

    Now his son has vitiligo. Anyone who said MJ faked his vitiligo at any point have only just exposed how easy it is to lie about Michael, and Taraborrelli has proven that a long time ago. I remember in one edition he even said Blanket was blond, and in 2007 claimed Michael was hoping to make his children go into the entertainment business and then live vicariously through them.

    Like

  163. Truth Prevail permalink
    May 17, 2012 7:21 pm

    @ Hilary

    Diane Demon a proven liar the amount of times she has been proven to be a liar you would think she would distance herself from the Jackson name by now i remember she said on twitter that Mike’s humanitarian efforts was a PR stunt then when the Murray recording was shown in court someone asked her if she still thinks Mike’s Humanitarian efforts was a PR Stunt? and she denied the whole thing saying she never said any of that in the first place. This women is beyond Pathetic!

    Like

  164. Hilary permalink
    May 17, 2012 9:20 am

    You know what I don’t get? Why does it matter if Michael had 2, 5 or 200 surgeries? Like seriously, WHO CARES? I get the interest in the skin color, but plastic surgery? I would be EMBARASSED to ask even people I personally know if they got this done, or that done.

    And I am not being sarcastic by asking this, but why is it surprising to people that Michael and Lisa had sex? Seriously, I don’t understand why you would even ASK that question. What’s so unattractive about Michael? You can’t sleep with a man who wears women’s makeup, is that it? No, it can’t be, because Marilyn Manson married hot women and wasn’t questioned that way. Or is it because he was accused of molesting a little boy? No seriously, why did Diane Sawyer ask that? And why did Oprah think he was a virgin? Are we all looking at the same guy? I would have went all Thriller on thier a$$es if I was him. Honestly, I’m getting physically agitated thinking about the stupidity of thier questions.

    I was surprised you guys didn’t cover the “feminization” of Michael’s look, though. Would be an interesting topic. When Jermaine was asked if michael was transexual/homosexual/asexual on LKL in 2003, he never answered and said to love Michael for the person he was, which I thought was incredibly stupid to say. Would fuel more rumors. He said in the outtakes of the bashir interview how people call him a girl (so he was obviouslly denyint that by mentioning it) but I don’t think he was trying to look like a woman, but rather, he liked the makeup and wanted to test the boundaries. Karen Faye also said that in 2010. And michael even wore some women’s designer clothing at times. I’m not saying he was trans, but I think his was of pushing the boundaries was really interesting.

    Like

  165. Hilary permalink
    May 17, 2012 8:54 am

    I once heard someone say that making fun of Michael Jackson for being white would be like making fun of Stevie Wonder for wearing sunglasses.

    I didn’t read over all the comments, but I read that Taraborelli claims Michael WAS whitening his skin and that in turn caused an autoimmune attack on his pigment in the early 80’s. Apparently the white skin is a chicken-or-the-egg thing: vitiligo vs skin lightening treatment. Even if that was true, that doesn’t mean anything. There are plenty of naturally light skinned black people. If Michael wanted to be light skinned-I’m NOT saying he did- it doesn’t mean he didn’t want to be “black”.

    It’s funny, ever since Michael died, I realize how many people that I come into contact with that have vitiligo. There are TONS OF people in my neighborhood (mostly South Asian, not to say that they get it more, but because where I live has a lot of South Asians). There’s alittle girl at my brother’s school who has such extensive vitiligo on her face that it looks like she’s wearing foundation to make her face 10x lighter than her arms. There are a few patches on her arms, but her entire face is almost alabaster white except for a thin line around her lips. Or some people have it jut on their hands and not on their face. My sister’s friend’s dad, whos been attending our church for the past 15 years, has it, but I was so used to seeing him when I grew up that that was considered normal to me, so I automatically believed Michael when he talked about vitiligo in the Bashir film. One of my uncles in India has it too, but I was 6 when I first saw him, and never really cared. Back then, it was an “eh, whatever” type of thing, but now when I see it, it reminds me of Mike and what he must look like underneath the makeup.

    @Truth Prevail “I always thought Michael’s brothers voices were high also especially Jackie and Jermaine i think it just runs in the family.”

    Why don’t I let Diane Dimond explain the high voices to you? Apparently she’s gotten a degree in psychology since we heard from her in the trial. Starting at about 4:20

    On a serious note, you’re exactly right. Almost all the Jacksons have that soft-spokenness in their voice, Janet too, so those “female hormone theorists” can beat it.

    Like

  166. Truth Prevail permalink
    May 13, 2012 7:40 pm

    I read somewhere that Katherine Jackson said on Oprah that Mike was “addicted” to plastic surgery i haven’t seen the Interview if she did say that what did she say that mike had done and did she talk about Mike’s skin condition?

    Like

  167. May 12, 2012 11:06 pm

    “What I’m trying to educate myself about is when he began to show serious symptoms and how he managed it and how it changed his life at that time.”

    @Lindethiel, I think that Michael himself said that vitiligo started sometime around “Thriller” (in a conversation with Oprah?). And at first he surely tried to repigment as doctors suggest it as a standard treatment for all patients with little vitiligo. However a moment came when vitiligo became too extensive and repigmentation or the dark make-up had to be used for too big patches of white. This was when he started using Benoquin and to the surprise of many people turned from dark to white almost immediately.

    The reason for that was that he gave up using dark make-up and started on Benoquin to lighten up the brown patches. The result looked like he underwent an operation and I remember it very clearly that in my country people talked that he “had his skin replaced”. It brought about many sneers and no one told those nitwits that such an operation is impossible – the skin is the largest organ in the body and the immune system will make the body “reject” so many alien cells brought into the system.

    However, the amazement at Michael’s total change in color was so big that I also remember suspecting that there might have been some truth to those stories. People tend to think that when someone has much money doctors can work wonders. If only we knew what a nightmare Michael was going through with all his vitiligo, lupus, the burn on his scalp and loss of hair and all the sneers he heard and saw at every turn!

    Now I wonder when his “sudden” change in color took place. Was it before his Dangerous tour in 1992? Was there a moment when he “dropped” out of everyone’s sight and reemerged being a light color?

    Like

  168. lynande51 permalink
    May 12, 2012 8:18 pm

    Because benoquin sometimes needs to be used continuously for it to completely remove pigment and it may not always work on some spots. That is because not all of the skin is effected by vitiligo even when it is as extensive as Michael’s was.

    Like

  169. shellywebstere permalink
    May 12, 2012 9:24 am

    Why did he have a pigmented nose at the time of his death if he used benoquin.

    Like

  170. lynande51 permalink
    May 12, 2012 7:58 am

    Michael’s nose remained pigmented even at the time of his death. I think if you look at close ups of him during the trial you can see that his nose is still dark. That is why it always looked smaller than it actually was because of how shading works in photos. I don’t know about back then but a successful repigmentation was not avaialbe until a stem cell line was created by a Dr. in the UK.

    Like

  171. Lindethiel permalink
    May 12, 2012 7:07 am

    @VindicateMJ “Do you seriously think that Michael would have allowed to have the footage from the making of Thriller show him with white spots on his face or chest? Of course he is wearing makeup here too.”

    No no no, of course. I think you misunderstood. I have no doubt that Michael wore makeup all the time, even at home. Otherwise I’m certain we would have seen a leaked picture by now, or more people would have been aware that Michael had vitiligo before his Oprah interview.

    What I mean is Rick Baker, the makeup artist on Thriller is an experienced makeup artist and would likely have been able to tell that Michael was wearing makeup, and would also potentially asked him to remove it so his zombie makeup had a clean base. In which case Michael would either have to remove it, or come up with a reason not to, rather than reveal his secret.

    The plaster bust of Michael you showed is made from the face cast they took, we would need to see the inside of the face cast, as this is the part that made direct contact with his skin. I had a look at the footage and it actually appears that there could be a bit of makeup residue in there, difficult to tell from the angle.

    Another reason I wonder also is that Karen Faye mentioned on twitter a few months back that the first time she had to conceal vitiligo on Michael’s face was for Say Say Say, which was shot shortly after Thriller. Still leaves Thriller potentially in the time period that Michael was concealing it from her still, and remember, she was available on set, Karen did his standard makeup for Thriller. Or, perhaps he really didn’t have any patches on his face yet and Karen was helping him conceal them elsewhere. If he did have vitiligo on his face at this stage I don’t believe he would have been capable of concealing it so well yet without the help of a makeup artists teachings, a makeup artist who stated that she didn’t begin concealing until Say Say Say. Particularly when things are being glued to his face, he’s wearing grease paint and having an over all application of plaster.

    I found where I heard about Michael’s potential re-pigmentation.

    http://mjfa.forumotion.com/t153-michael-did-not-change-his-skin-color-he-had-vitiligo

    It’s at the bottom of that first post, I’m wondering if anyone knows anything about that. I believe that could potentially be what happened between those triumph photos and mid to late 1983. I also could be completely off the mark. Those triumph photos could really just be normal stage makeup running off a winter time complexion, after all Michael isn’t all that dark naturally anyway. I would have to look up Triumph tour dates to be sure.

    There’s another theory that was mentioned briefly in the vitiligo special Geraldo did, that there are skin stains that can be used as well, but aren’t as effective as makeup. I’m fairly convinced Michael used both, often at the same time. Particularly on stage during the Bad tour. Often times he looks uneven coming off stage, but is obviously not completely bare. I think he may have been using a stain beneath his stage make up as another line of defense after his make up had sweated off.

    At the end of the day ‘sometime after Thriller,’ ‘OTW/Thriller’ is actually pretty vague when it comes to explaining when he started to suffer. Particularly with the photographic and footage we have. I hope that explains my irregular train of thought, lol. What I’m trying to educate myself about is when he began to show serious symptoms and how he managed it and how it changed his life at that time. Sorry for the long winded post, lol.

    Like

  172. Truth Prevail permalink
    May 11, 2012 9:22 pm

    You can also hear Michael’s Low voice in the beginning of you rock my world when he is talking to Chris Tucker on the invincible album.

    Like

  173. May 11, 2012 8:14 pm

    Vitiligo is more common in blacks and of course more noticeable.Female hormones have absolutely nothing to do with becoming white. Michael was often soft-spoken, but did have an equally natural lower voice, I think even LMP remarked on that.
    Blacks are also more prone to get melanoma, a serious matter. This in itself is not directly connected to vitiligo. But in vitiligo the dangerous UV rays are just more so. That’s why the use of umbrella and usually being fully clothed even on sunny days.
    So due to the risk of melanoma it is advised that blacks use sunscreens too.

    Like

  174. May 11, 2012 1:16 pm

    “Did Michael actually undergo treatment to re-pigment back in the early days of his vitiligo? The reason I ask is because I’m having a hard time understanding the Triumph Tour pictures with running makeup, and then the footage from the making of thriller in which Michael appears shirtless in the make up chair, devoid of even his usual eyeliner.”

    Lindethiel, are these the pictures you are talking of?

    And this one when making Thriller?

    Do you seriously think that Michael would have allowed to have the footage from the making of Thriller show him with white spots on his face or chest? Of course he is wearing makeup here too. In the make-up chair he is not sweating and it looks natural. I think this is all there is to it. Who knows, probably Michael hid the fact of his patches even from his make-up artist? Karen Faye said that he tried to conceal vitiligo even from her.

    See how different Michael’s real skin looked in comparison with his skin in Thriller and what a terrible effect all that makeup had on his face. Dancing in the makeup could be one more factor for creating additional skin problems for him. The skin is red and looks swollen after all that dancing and sweating. Of course part of it could be glue but still…

    In this picture taken in Moscow in 1993 he has a brown vitiligo spot near his ear:
    vitiligo in Moscow 1993 and here is one more picture showing the same brown spot and some spots on his neck:

    Like

  175. Lindethiel permalink
    May 11, 2012 8:11 am

    I wonder, is there more information regarding Michael’s early attempts to RE-pigment? I seem to recall reading this as a brief fact here, or perhaps it was somewhere else…

    Did Michael actually undergo treatment to re-pigment back in the early days of his vitiligo? The reason I ask is because I’m having a hard time understanding the Triumph Tour pictures with running makeup, and then the footage from the making of thriller in which Michael appears shirtless in the make up chair, devoid of even his usual eyeliner. There was no makeup residue in the face cast they took, and the make up artist would have noticed if Michael was wearing makeup and requested that he take it off for a ‘fresh face’ to work on.

    Is it possible that he re-pigmented between these times? What I’m wondering is when, for how long, and how successful it could have been.

    Like

  176. Julie permalink
    May 5, 2012 12:19 am

    @Truth Prevail – I heard that too some time ago and i took it with a grain of salt. I’m not sure why he said that – maybe ignorance regarding vitiligo, who knows? But Michael used to say that kids would come up to him and ask him that and it would upset him and he said emphatically that he never did that. People accused him of that because of his singing register and when he spoke, he did so in a higher register than his normal speaking voice. I read that his vocal coach had him speak higher and softer so that he would be able to hit the high notes on his songs; However he did have a 3 1/2 – 4 octave range.

    Again, I think Gregory was trying to give a reason for Michael’s change in skin color because so many people truly did not believe he had vitiligo. I’m sure they felt foolish or should have when the autopsy came out. I hope Quincy Jones felt really foolish!

    Like

  177. Mona permalink
    May 4, 2012 11:49 pm

    What’s the connection between female hormones and becoming white…? And some guys just have natural high voices, no need for hormones of any kind, some singers just have more octaves to their voices (the lucky ones!) than most males do. Plus, Michael could modulate his voice from quite high to quite low. In the song ‘2000 Watts’, for example, he uses a very low deep voice. So I’d say, at least in the latter days, that the high voice was a choice from an artistic point of view rather than something chemically produced.

    Like

  178. Truth Prevail permalink
    May 4, 2012 10:04 pm

    Okay i just watched a video of a guy called Dick Gregory he seems like a wise man but he claims Michael was injected with female hormones and that’s why he became white has there ever been any proof of this medical records etc.

    I always thought Michael’s brothers voices were high also especially Jackie and Jermaine i think it just runs in the family.

    Like

  179. April 8, 2012 3:47 pm

    “He could have worn a hair piece over his bandages like he did two days later at the Grammy’s, but chose not to. Obviously to remind Pepsi of what he went through for them, taking a bow, removing his hat and showing the price he paid. That picture was taken, after all, at a Pepsi Convention. Which I find absolutely hilarious and a very good example of his good natured, tongue-in-cheek character.”

    @Lindethiel, I haven’t seen the photo you are talking of, but found an article with a photo of Michael’s burnt head. Captain Donester of the fire department says the burn accident was absolutely preventable. It was the director of the commercial who made Michael stand directly under the sparks and stay there longer than he should. The article stresses that Michael’s problems with prescription drugs started after the accident:

    http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/16/michael-jacksons-burns-preventable-pepsi-commercial/#.T4F4Spk9UXc

    Fire Capt. Blames Director For Jackson’s Burns

    A captain with the L.A. City Fire Department tells us the burns Michael Jackson suffered during the filming of the 1984 Pepsi commercial were caused by a director who wanted to get a more dramatic shot.

    Captain Don Donester was at the filming, working as a fire safety inspector. Donester says after doing take after take, he overheard the director tell Jackson, “Stand there longer [under the sparks]. You’ll look more majestic.” According to Donester, by making Jackson stay under the sparks for a longer period of time, it would look as if the singer was emerging from the smoke and sparks.

    We just spoke with the director, Bob Giraldi, who said “That’s not true. Whatever.” Then he hung up.

    In Michael’s autobiography, the singer backs up Donester’s story, writing Giraldi “came up to me and said, ‘Michael, you’re going down too early. We want to see you up there, up on the stairs. When the lights come on, we want to reveal that you’re there, so wait.'”

    Donester says the director’s decision went against the rules set by the senior fire safety inspector. Don also told us he was one of the people who helped put out the fire on Michael’s head.

    Various people connected with Jackson say the serious burns the singer suffered triggered his prescription drug addiction, that consumed him for the rest of his life.

    MJ's burn

    Like

  180. Lindethiel permalink
    April 7, 2012 11:11 am

    The scalp expanding resonated with me, could all that extensive stretch and pull and removal of Michael’s scalp skin also have an effect of how the skin of his face lay on his features? Essentially giving the illusion of a face lift?

    It would have obviously been subtle, but from the time of the Pepsi burn and onwards, the tissue & skin of his face did appear a little less ‘full’ than it potentially should have. I think between the years 84-88 his face did get sharper. Make no mistake though, he was in that ‘sweet-spot’ of late 20’s to early 30’s where most men loose that boyish youthfulness and start to mature physically, so I could be totally off.

    Judging by the fact that Michael appeared at his Guinness World Records party just 11 days after his Pepsi accident seemingly sporting a full head of hair (obviously with a hair piece.) I would say that last photo, which was taken on the 26th of February, a month after his accident, is definitely Michael’s idea of a cheeky joke. He could have worn a hair piece over his bandages like he did two days later at the Grammy’s, but chose not to. Obviously to remind Pepsi of what he went through for them, taking a bow, removing his hat and showing the price he paid. That picture was taken, after all, at a Pepsi Convention. Which I find absolutely hilarious and a very good example of his good natured, tongue-in-cheek character.

    Like

  181. lynande51 permalink
    March 25, 2012 8:01 am

    Yes Michael would have had patches and as a matter of fact he showed them to Tom Mesereau. He said he was spotted on his torso. It is also in the autopsy report as mutifocal which means all over.What people don’t realize is that his face still had dark spots on it and one of them was the end of his nose. Just imagine what fun people would have had with that if he wouldn’t have covered it up. It was a lose lose situation for him. I just noticed that the photo above in Rio during the shoot of They Don’t Care About Us says that it was covered up with makeup. Actually it was done with computer graphics after the shoot. They did the same thing for You Are Not Alone.That is why the edges look blurry or softened when you look at the video.
    @ Truthprevails
    As for his plastic surgeries, the number that the detractors use is from Dr. Wallace Goodstein. A former partner of Dr. Hoefflin’s that sued him because Dr. Hoefflin kicked him out of the practice for all of the screw ups. You should read that mans MD report card and it will tell you everything you need to know about him. The case between him and Hoefflin was active at the time of his interview on NBC about Michael. When I know what kind of Dr.Goodstein was I question everything he said.Dr.Hoefflin ended up winning his countersuit against Goodstein in 2006.
    http://www2.mbc.ca.gov/LicenseLookupSystem/PhysicianSurgeon/Lookup.aspx?licenseType=G&licenseNumber=26339
    http://www2.mbc.ca.gov/LicenseLookupSystem/PhysicianSurgeon/document.aspx?path=%5cDIDOCS%5c20061030%5cDMRAAABI7%5c&did=AAABI061030203605359.DID&licenseType=G&licenseNumber=26339
    http://www2.mbc.ca.gov/LicenseLookupSystem/PhysicianSurgeon/document.aspx?path=%5cDIDOCS%5c20090603%5cDMRAAABI55%5c&did=AAABI090603215929139.DID&licenseType=G&licenseNumber=26339
    http://www2.mbc.ca.gov/LicenseLookupSystem/PhysicianSurgeon/document.aspx?path=%5cDIDOCS%5c20110310%5cDMRAAADE2%5c&did=AAADE110311003120078.DID&licenseType=G&licenseNumber=26339
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/wallace-goodstein-md/michael-jackson-dr-conrad_b_523716.html
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/wallace-goodstein-md/conrad-murray-trial_b_1009846.html
    http://www.people.com/people/package/article/0,,20287787_20290367,00.html
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3080078/ns/dateline_nbc-newsmakers/t/new-look-dark-accusations/

    Like

  182. Truth Prevail permalink
    March 25, 2012 3:24 am

    I honestly hate the fact that people want an explanation from MJ for having plastic surgery Michael had plastic surgery for the same reason any other famous person gets it Yet know one bothers them or pushy questions of why. And also the fact the media has painted this picture of MJ being a plastic surgery addict.

    Here is a video of Tom Jones Talking about MJ now i don’t think Tom was being a bad guy or wanted to offend anyone it was actually the interviewers fault on the questions he asked and the way the interviewer asked it was like he was asking Tom why MJ had these changes and Tom replied he didn’t know what was in MJ’s head about all the plastic surgery procedures he didn’t understand. My point is no other famous person would be asked about another famous person’s plastic surgery and the fact Tom seemed to be brainwashed by the medias picture of MJ as a plastic surgery addict so thought maybe he should give this annoying interviewer a reply oh how i hope more people who knew/met MJ were like Thomas Mesereau and jus simply threatened to walk out of the interview.

    http://news.sky.com/home/video/15322486

    Like

  183. annamaria permalink
    March 10, 2012 6:58 pm

    I don’t know if Michael still had visible patches on his body in 2003, but we know from the Murray trial that he ordered bleaching creams in the times before his death so he must had them. In the 2005 trial gavin arvizo towards the end of his cross examination, when Mesereaou brought up the topic of vitilligo and the patches on Michael’s skin, because gavin had mentioned Michael’s make-up in his testimony, Gavin said “I didn’t know about patches. I thought he was just all white” in the same time he claimed that he and he brother had saw Michael naked earlier. So if what he said is true (I know it’s not) how he didn’t know about paches?

    Like

  184. sanemjfan permalink
    March 10, 2012 5:12 am

    The video at the end of the post with the doctor discussing MJ’s scalp ballooning procedure has been updated with additional informatin and interviews!

    Like

  185. sanemjfan permalink
    March 8, 2012 5:47 am

    I added a new photo at the very end that shows how MJ had to protect his scalp burns!

    Like

  186. sanemjfan permalink
    March 5, 2012 11:38 pm

    I added another video clip! It’s at the end of the post, and it’s a clip where a doctor explains the extent of MJ’s scalp burns.

    Like

  187. March 5, 2012 3:03 pm

    I wonder if they realised they were speaking about a human being?

    Like

  188. sanemjfan permalink
    March 5, 2012 1:03 pm

    I added a new video at the end! Prepare to be disgusted and offended!

    Like

  189. ares permalink
    February 28, 2012 9:47 pm

    This is a video of a girl speaking about her vitiligo. Because we can never have enough proofs with haters.

    Like

  190. Mona permalink
    February 24, 2012 9:35 am

    One more thing… the fact that he has white kids and supposedly he wanted them white, is just as dumb to consider. Is it so difficult to understand he didn’t care what color his children are/ would be? He was not a racist in any sense of the way, but that is so difficult for people to understand because truth is that most people are at least a little biased or maybe even racist when it comes to such matters, even without realizing it and it is human nature to just judge according to what you would do yourself. So, no, I don’t think he was going for white kids, he just wanted to have healthy children, no matter what kind.
    On the other hand, let’s think about it from the non-believers’ point of view. What if he had a preference, without even realizing it maybe, for white women? Brooke Shields, Liz Taylor, Lisa-Marie Presley, etc, they were white, so what if he did? Does that make him a self-race hater? I’m white, as you can see from my avatar, however I do like black men. I like the way they look, i think they’re sexy. I also like black kids, I just happen to find them a lot cuter than white ones, there. So that makes me what: a racist? Against whom? The blacks or the whites? Or maybe it makes me a hater of my own race, just because i have a personal preference?
    Come on, people, whoever you guys are, who think he wanted to be white and have everything about and around him white, OPEN YOUR EYES! It wasn’t a choice, it was a given that he became white. Why God gave him that cross to bear we don’t know, but hey… couldn’t it be just so that we’d all open our eyes? Racism can be so subtle nowadays, it would be hard to recognize sometimes. Let’s all look in the mirror and not see the color of our race, but the color of our soul. Michael’s was in brilliant vibrant colors. Let’s all go for that, rather than just for black or white.

    L.O.V.E.

    Like

  191. Mona permalink
    February 24, 2012 4:31 am

    Just to very simply and logically answer the question in the title: ‘Did Michael Want to Go White?’ NO! He was always very proud that he was a black man, that’s what he always said. But let’s just not take his own word for it, as people don’t usually believe him. Let’s just look at facts. Would you say that a man who goes through all the effort that he went through to help and promote the black community would want to turn white? Why did he help his race if he didn’t want to be part of it? He was the one who got colored artists on MTV, the one who always spoke in his books and speeches about the equality of races, one of the ones that made it possible for USA to have a black president, I learned all about it from Moonwalk, that was published in 1988, and since then i have a problem with every form of of racial issue. Michael was my mentor in having a free mind since I was a kid and despite all that he is accused of wanting to be white…? Do you think a man who hates his race would give so much credit to black artists before him? It’s so LUDICROUS and SAD and STUPID at the same time what these people accuse him of.

    I think that Michael turning white, although not by his choice, and certainly with a lot of grief and physical pain, was just a sign to show to show the world that he transcended race. LOVE works in mysterious ways…

    Like

  192. February 9, 2012 11:21 am

    MJ first suffered from a pnuemothorax in 1977, this was documented at the time. When he had that he discovered he had pleurisy in his lungs. Pleurisy is one of the biggest problems involving lungs that people diagnosed with lupus suffer from.

    The first lupus rashes he had seemed to occur in 1983. He was diagnosed with lupus in 1986 with Dr Klein.

    Michael may have been suffering from other problems related to his lupus before and during these years but he might not have known it was lupus because lupus has many different symptoms and can go into remission. It’s only when something “big” happens like a pneumothorax or when you have a visible symptom like the malar rash or the loss of hair he was apparently also getting, that people are diagnosed.

    Like

  193. Patricia permalink
    February 9, 2012 2:57 am

    Something happened with mj sometime in 1982 or 83 before the pepsi incident in 1984 because I saw red rashes on mj’s cheeks wearing his beat-it red jacket which as in 1982 or 83. So I’m wondering when did mj first get Lupus? Some say mj got Lupus in 1984 after the pepsi commercial incident but I saw red blotches on his cheeks back in 1982 or 83. Does anyone know when mj first got lupus?

    Like

  194. MJ Fan-Chris permalink
    February 7, 2012 5:18 pm

    Michael Jackson is one of the Most Precious,Rare Human Being that one could find in this World! His love for Childhood Days,Water Gun-Water Balloon Games,Friends,Kids, Parents,Siblings,Animals=Pets and Sincere-Passion of What He is Good At=Dance, Singing,Composing Music & Lyrics.. He’s A Genius! He was very interested in Arts & Books! He is The Most Mis-understood Darling! The Most Caring,Cautious Dad Ever! God Bless You,MJ! He has Done Lot Of Charity!

    Like

  195. MJ Fan-Divya permalink
    February 7, 2012 5:02 pm

    God Bless You For Defending This Wonderful,Dedicated And Passionate Man,MJ!

    Like

  196. Truth Prevail permalink
    December 25, 2011 12:05 am

    Is Lupus and Vitiligo Connected?

    I mean if someone has Lupus does that mean they will have Vitiligo in the future?

    Like

  197. December 3, 2011 12:24 pm

    “people also forget mj being on propofol isnt what killed him but the dose that was given to him by murray”

    The major thing that killed Michael Jackson was Murray’s NEGLECT for him. If he had paid just some attention to his patient Michael would be alive now.

    And the excessive dose Murray gave to Michael was part of that neglect. Murray was pouring Michael with propofol.

    David Walgren said that one of the main questions he would have asked if Murray had testified would be about those “near-miss” situations. Near-miss means “near-death” occasions, which should have been numerous considering the manner in which Murray was administering propofol.

    I hear Murray said in the documentary that he always talked on the phone while administering propofol and it was nothing unusual for him – so it means he always left Michael unattended while streaming the drug into him in a totally uncontrollable way.

    How many times did Michael stop breathing on those occasions? How many times did he fall into a coma before Murray noticed it? How many times did he return from that coma when Murray restored his breathing by oxygen tank or whatever? Murray had an ambu bag lying near the bed – so he did use it this time but it didn’t work just because he noticed it too late. But what if it was common for him to use it to revive Michael back to life?

    It means that Michael was dying not just once – but many times. And this is why his body was half cold, half hot. His body tissues were not only excessively saturated with propofol metabolites but his whole system was totally unbalanced due to comas he was occasionally experiencing.

    NO OTHER DOCTOR WOULD HAVE ALLOWED THAT – propofol or not. If it hadn’t been propofol Murray would have done the same with any other drug – benzodiazepines or whatever.

    So it wasn’t actually propofol which is to blame for Michael’s death – it was Murray’s TOTALLY CRIMINAL NEGLECT.

    Propofol was only a means to this end.

    Propofol is like a knife. In the hands of a surgeon it helps and in the hands of a killer it kills.

    And this, by the way, is true for almost all medications.

    Like

  198. Truth Prevail permalink
    December 3, 2011 4:37 am

    relation to my previous post this is what exactly i was talking about like i jus read the sun article with jermain despite what jermain said they are still haters saying mj was a drug addict and trying to protray murray as a innocent lamb and trying to say jackson fame enabled him to get what he wanted i mean it was proven in court that murray was recklous yet idiots still want to make excuses saying pastor was not a good judge i mean any1 who was actually paying attention to the court knows pastor chose the right verdict people also forget mj being on propofol isnt what killed him but the dose that was given to him by murray and thats what killed him! i mean its the sun tabloid website so i expected Ignorant Comments!!!

    Like

  199. Truth Prevail permalink
    December 2, 2011 9:05 pm

    pfff imdb dont even bother with those people there just as stupid as the guys from Topix! you can show mj haters proof it could be in front of their face they will still deny it these people are mentally disturbed they have to be Because you show them proof yet they continue with what they thought before it either they know your right but continue with their sick imagination jus to have a reason to bash mj for them the thing is they want to believe they dont care if its true or false its what they want to belive like the someone once said michael’s Haters are just as obssed as his fans but it is okaii for a fan to be obsessed becuz their a fan but you know you have serious mental issues when your keeping looking into someone who you hate and believe is a CM (Haterz point of view)

    Like

  200. December 2, 2011 12:18 pm

    “Now which Doctor is going to get blamed for supplying him with Benoquin cream to bleach his entire body if he didn’t have vitiligo?”

    Klein.

    In Klein’s medical notes it was revealed in the depositions in 1994 that he had only started being prescribed Benoquin in 1990.

    Like

  201. December 2, 2011 6:30 am

    “Now which Doctor is going to get blamed for supplying him with Benoquin cream to bleach his entire body if he didn’t have vitiligo?”

    Klein.

    Like

  202. lynande51 permalink
    December 2, 2011 5:54 am

    Shelly just give them this when they say that he bleached his whole body. It is a prescription medication. Now which Doctor is going to get blamed for supplying him with Benoquin cream to bleach his entire body if he didn’t have vitiligo?Some of the stuff that is said lately is just plain stupid.
    http://www.drugs.com/pro/benoquin.html

    Like

  203. December 2, 2011 5:04 am

    @Shelly

    He knew all the medications in Michael’s home, including the creams, when he diagnosed vitiligo he did so knowing everything. Unlike the people on IMDB the coroner is a medical professional who understands what vitiligo is and he examined Michael’s body and his skin under a microscope, when he diagnosed it he likely didn’t think he’d have to formulate any explanation besides the obvious.

    Like

  204. December 2, 2011 4:46 am

    @rockferon,

    I know what you said but I was thinking maybe the coroner spoke about the bleaching creams and how it’s not possible to bleach the entire body.

    Like

  205. December 2, 2011 3:48 am

    Does someone know what the coroner said about the vitiligo? Did he spoke about the bleaching cream. I am just asking because on imdb they are still people who believed he didn’t have vitiligo but bleached his whole body.

    The coroner confirmed it, it’s in the autopsy report and he confirmed it on the stand. You can’t bleach your entire body, it’s not humanly possible. There’s no other person on the planet who has been capable of removing pigment using bleaching creams. Ask people for photos of other people who’ve successfully removed their entire pigment through bleaching agents, I’ve been googling for over 2 years, haven’t found one other victim. Bleaching agents contain Benzene – a carcinogen, excessive use is harmful. For example, try imagine using a cream like that on eyelids or on his penis, which we know was blotchy. Pigment always returns in healthy skin so he wouldn’t have been able to do it just once, he’d have to apply it constantly to those areas.

    The pharmacist who made up the bleaching cream for MJ to use was asked by Murray to do that, Murray asked him how much he’d be able to make and the pharmacist said 40 tubes worth, and Murray said he’d buy them all.

    People on IMDB don’t even believe Prince has vitiligo though, these are the people who will never change their opinion on anything about MJ and will always say the same uneducated opinion they had of him from 20 years ago.

    Like

  206. December 2, 2011 2:26 am

    “Does someone know what the coroner said about the vitiligo?”

    In his testimony at the trial the coroner Dr. Rogers just said that Michael Jackson had vitiligo while enumerating the few diseases Michael had. I understand that this is too plain a statement, but the truth is always less “flowery” than lies.

    Like

  207. December 2, 2011 2:21 am

    Does someone know what the coroner said about the vitiligo? Did he spoke about the bleaching cream. I am just asking because on imdb they are still people who believed he didn’t have vitiligo but bleached his whole body.

    Like

  208. Truth Prevail permalink
    December 1, 2011 10:10 pm

    thanks for clearing up the cancer story i also didnt think it was true because there was no mention of it in medical records etc. so that means only one thing he was wasnt suffering from it diamond and the dumb tabloids as usual making their own stories.Idiots

    Like

  209. monica permalink
    December 1, 2011 10:27 am

    Helena, Thanks for replying. I totally agree with you…we have discovered much information that we never imagined we might know about Michael’s medical conditions. And it is compulsory in examining it to find the truth so that we can help to refute lies that have been circulating since almost as long as we can remember! Sometimes I don’t convey my thoughts as well as I want to in writing so I think I neglected to specify to what I was referring when I asked you if you thought Michael did not want the info out there. My query was based on not understanding why Michael’s people didn’t ever try to disseminate publicity that would benefit him years and years ago. For example, no one believed him when he said he had Vitiligo, but I can’t help but think that his PR team could have helped with that prior to the Oprah interview or even after. There are other things like the burn and how much it effected/affected (long term pain from the accident and the treatment itself) him that, to me, seemed like they could have at least attempted some damage control. So my question basically answered itself…I guess Michael did not want that info to get out. But who would ever have thought that people could have gotten so much more cruel to him than they already were way back when these issues originated? Anyway, what’s done is done and no one knew then what they know now. We will fix the damage as we learn and research. Again, thanks for your insight:)

    Like

  210. Suzy permalink
    December 1, 2011 9:26 am

    There is no evidence he had skin cancer, not in his autopsy, nowhere. It was just a tabloid fabrication because they saw him visiting his dermatologist so often so they speculated he must have skin cancer.Typical tabloid.

    Like

  211. lynande51 permalink
    December 1, 2011 4:29 am

    There are several different kinds of “Skin cancer”. He could have had simple prebasal cell which look like white heads until they are biopsied. What I think is rich is that Diane Dimond mentions it when Michael himself said that the reason he could not go in the sun too much is because people with vitiligo have a much greater chance of developing a skin cancer. Has anyone ever noticed that when a hater makes a statement or voices a question the answer is usually right in the question or statement?
    Take for example a comment I read where a hater asked how could the legal system in California allow him to use a surrogate service for Blanket without an investigation? They do it to everyone else that uses one. That is right, just like adoption services do, they investigate potential parents if those parents are using donated sperm or eggs because that would make it an adoption. Well they just answered their own question. It must have been that they found nothing wrong or the sperm was his.
    That is why it is so important to really look at or listen to what a person is asking. Sometimes it is just easier to point out that they have already answered thier own question with the question.

    Like

  212. Teva permalink
    December 1, 2011 3:19 am

    Diane Dimond also said he was suffering from skin cancer, but no mention of it is made in the autopsy.

    Like

  213. jm51 permalink
    November 30, 2011 6:23 pm

    @truth prevail – no that was just a tabloid rumor.

    Like

  214. Truth Prevail permalink
    November 30, 2011 4:46 pm

    before mj passed was mj suffering from skin cancer? i dont think he was since i read it from the sun website a shitty tabloid! but if someone can answer it would be appreciated 🙂

    Like

  215. Tahlia permalink
    November 30, 2011 2:26 am

    Thank you David and Helena, the man that runs that blog is a kind man and he practises what he preaches which helps to restore some of my faith in Christians, I’ve had some very bad experiences with them unfortunately. I’m looking forward to the post about the religious people and would be honoured if you included the comment I put on Joseph’s blog.

    Like

  216. sanemjfan permalink
    November 29, 2011 6:49 pm

    @ Tahlia

    Thanks for that link! It’s refreshing to hear, and I will use that story in a future post that I am working on that will refute the lies said about MJ from the religious community.

    @ Helena
    Since I am going to use that story in my upcoming series, I think it’s more efficient if I also incorporate Tahlia’s comment into my series, instead of turning it into an individual post. It may seem redundant having both us post on the same topic.

    Like

  217. November 29, 2011 6:04 pm

    “I put some info about this and the allegations of a blog by a man I used to attend church with. It was refreshing to read something nice coming from a Christian, so many other blogs that are supposed to come from a Christian stand point are spewing out venom. I think my comment is the only one there so far. http://josephswan.com.au/its-amazing-who-you-meet-in-a-cemetery#comment-49

    Tahlia, your comment is great and deserves to be turned into a post here if you do not mind.

    Like

  218. November 29, 2011 2:21 pm

    “Helena, do you think Michael didn’t want that info out there regarding his health? (ie, that he truly had medical issues beyond vitiligo). I just don’t understand.”

    Monica, I think that Michael would never want any information about his health or intimate issues to be ever, ever discussed in public. However reality has been very much different from his hopes. Due to the molestation nonsense everyone, including us, had to go into such things as his uncircumcised penis and its color which is a totally outrageous and unheard of thing to discuss in normal circumstances.

    But Michael found himself in a totally abnormal situation and all these issues were practically imposed on us as a subject for discussion. Not to speak about it was like leaving a huge and extremely damaging lie non-refuted – which none of us could afford.

    Now the same thing is happening with Propofol and Demerol. Demerol was raised not by Michael’s supporters – it was thrown at us by the media and Murray’s defense. First TMZ got hold of Klein’s records and made them public, then Murray’s defense posted every single page from Klein’s records on the screen for everyone to see them during the trial.

    So the Demerol issue is back and again imposed on us like a must. Whether we like it or not we have to discuss it and need people who can be trusted to tell us the truth.

    How did Demerol start?

    The explanation we had from Michael was that it started with the burn and post-burn treatment (evidently that “balloon” thing). From Karen Faye we also know that it was very much controlled until after the 1993 allegations broke out – this is when the emotional pain became so huge that Michael could cope with it only with the help of the drug. Frank Cascio does not remember it – most probably because he was too small at that time.

    Whatever is the case it is important to understand that Demerol was not the drug of Michael’s choice, was never taken by him for recreation, was imposed on him by doctors (not yet clear who – Hoefflin or Klein) and turned into a problem only when false allegations and the world’s hate broke his spirit.

    But even despite the hell he was living in he managed to eventually beat the habit for which I respect him immensely – very few strong and determined people, as far as I know, managed to do that. So if technically you can probably call Michael an addict (a recovered one), factually he was not one – he never did it voluntarily and went on taking it only after he had been thrown into its vicious circle.

    Do we need to discuss all these issues? I think we do.

    Do we need doctors to explain what really happened? I think we do, because we are now at a stage which is far beyond any “doctor-patient confidentiality” in the usual meaning of this word. Michael’s detractors have their hey day claiming that Michael was a “junkie” and we cannot say a word as all we have is scraps of information here and there?

    This is the reason why I am grateful to Klein that he at least mentioned that “balloon” treatment – now we know why Michael was in so much pain in the post-burn period of time. Now we also know from Karen Faye that he had to go on a tour with the scar from the operation still unhealed and had to take Demerol as a painkiller.

    It explains many things and if all these people had kept silence we would have never learned the truth.

    In Michael’s case the truth about him cannot hurt – he was so pure a person that whatever truth is told about him can only heal. So if there were a vote for or against it I would vote for the truth.

    Like

  219. monica permalink
    November 29, 2011 8:46 am

    “I wish the world could see threw the lies of the Chandlers but unless Jordy were to ever come clean about that he was forced to lie, he’ll never truly be vindicated except for in the hearts of loyal family, friends and fans”.

    @ @urmylovely1
    Reading your words I feel your pain. I so wish for that too…the crucial aspect is that people need to listen and BELIEVE the truth to see through all those lies, because when you think about it, there are truths out there about Michael…we hear, listen and believe them all the time. It’s just a matter the general public taking notice and getting past the fact that they have been brain washed all these years by tabloids and that they should take an interest in Michael and look deeper. This takes a special person, I think.

    Another thing is along the topic of Michael’s medical treatments. Helena was asking why it is that certain information is not getting out regarding the truth of what he was going through medically? What strikes me is the fact that there are many well known people whose publicists (I am only assuming) put out the truth in the form of articles or some sort of press with the sole purpose being to protect his/her client (the high profile person). It seems like celebrities now reveal every little, stupid detail. Why didn’t Raymone Bain (sp?) or Michael’s other “people” ever try to divert at least some of this crap? He had true medical needs and it seems to me not one of his people ever stepped up (except to plant some sensationalized information). It makes me mad. Please don’t get me wrong. I have heard Raymone Bain speak up for Michael but I think that was only since his passing. I do think she has her heart in the right place. Michael’s PR people were not doing their jobs way back then when they could have put a stop to some of the ridiculousness, or at least shed some light on the true medical necessity of what was going on with Michael. I just don’t ever remember there being any true damage control. Perhaps this is one reason this junk is still out there in the public consciousness. Helena, do you think Michael didn’t want that info out there regarding his health? (ie, that he truly had medical issues beyond vitiligo). I just don’t understand.

    Like

  220. Tahlia permalink
    November 29, 2011 4:24 am

    I put some info about this and the allegations of a blog by a man I used to attend church with. It was refreshing to read something nice coming from a Christian, so many other blogs that are supposed to come from a Christian stand point are spewing out venom. I think my comment is the only one there so far.

    http://josephswan.com.au/its-amazing-who-you-meet-in-a-cemetery#comment-49

    Like

  221. November 28, 2011 12:42 pm

    “It is suspect to me that no one is speaking except for Klein.”

    It is indeed suspicious but not because “no one else is speaking except for Klein”. David Nordahl speaks about the same balloon on Michael’s scalp. And in the article cited in this post Hoefflin himself says that he is treating Michael’s burn by lazer operations. These are the operations to stitch together the stretched skin.

    But what IS really suspicious is that everyone else is blocking this information from the public. It is quite a sensation, so why does no one talk?

    Over here Klein is telling the truth (as Nordahl confirms it), but someone wants to terribly discredit him so that the truth never surfaces or – if ever told – is never believed.

    Like

  222. @urmylovely1 permalink
    November 28, 2011 5:57 am

    Yes I believe the media basically had it in for Michael…1st they wanted to make him seem like a weirdo. He was very eccentric but many geniuses are and with the ammo fueled by the Chandlers they could destroy him and they did. They broke him, Tom Sneddon broke him and I know he tried to stay strong in the midst of it but he settled instead of fighting not out of guilt I ever thought that but just to end the pain as a quick fix. Demerol another quick fix to numb himself. They had what they needed to kill the brightest star on earth. I don’t blame Michael for wanting to end the madness with money but I wish he would have fought. Then in 05″ here it goes again and I can imagine the late appearances to court had to do with him being unable to wake up on time from a sedative or plain depression. I hurt for him. I know many fans did while others enjoyed his pain. The media thrived from it. All the while he had many other battles going on..I know it wasn’t easy being Michael Jackson. I don’t condone the drug use but I do understand he needed something. He was a human being. And everyone seems to forget that. He was someone’s baby..someone’s brother..someone’s father. Despite the change in his appearance he was still flesh and blood and soul. I heard MJ quote Christ before and I have to quote him here. If the world hates u remember that it 1st hated me. No servant is greater than his master. He wanted to change the world and that’s how the world reacts to people who want to change it and the media is the voice of the world.

    Like

  223. jm51 permalink
    November 28, 2011 4:39 am

    It is suspect to me that no one is speaking except for Klein. What we don’t really know is anything about why Hoefflin treated Michael’s burns the way he did. All we hear about is Klein who was unsuccessful in suing Hoefflin after Hoefflin came out and stated Klein had Michael hooked on demoral. I’m not of the impression that Hoefflin was doing what he was supposed to be doing but it’s amazing to me that whenever someone speaks out about Klein, Klein suddenly tries to throw them under the bus in a big way. He is now claiming Hoefflin was the one who addicted Michael to propofol when there is absolutely no evidence to support that statement.

    I truly wonder how Michael would feel about his “good friend” Klein if he knew all of the things Klein has said since MJ passed away?

    Like

  224. November 27, 2011 9:52 pm

    “I knew the demerol addiction probably started during the burn treatments by enabling physicians. I had no idea of the extreme skin stretching procedures that was just crazy.”

    @Urmylovely, isn’t it extremely strange that tabloids which are ready to pay any price for a sensation about Michael Jackson never touched upon the issue of skin stretching? Isn’t it proof that only negative sensations are welcome to the media when it comes to Michael Jackson? All they wanted was portraying him as “weird” and “a freak”, and explaining Michael’s behavior was never the media’s goal?

    The information about skin stretching is very limited. I’ve learned about it from two sources only – David Nordahl, the artist who saw the ball on Michael’s head with his own eyes and said it was giving him excruciating pain, and from Arnold Klein who spoke about it as a reason why he quarreled with surgeon Hoefflin and why he “fired him” (or rather convinced Michael to fire him).

    Hoefflin answered to that by accusing Klein and Debby Rowe of giving Michael too much Demerol. I don’t know which of them started that Demerol thing – Hoefflin or Klein, and think it could very well be Klein as he said he preferred this drug and administered it to Michael even in the 2009 procedures.

    But though Klein does admit he administered Michael Demerol, to me more blame for the addiction which eventually developed still rests with Hoefflin – he was the one who inflicted that pain and did not think how his patient would live with it day and night. It was also done with total disregard for Michael’s lupus and possible complications that could (and did) arise. It was a totally useless method which didn’t (and couldn’t) work and all it did was giving Michael unbearable pain.

    What most probably happened is that Michael asked Klein to help him cope with the pain, and Klein probably gave in and administered to him Demerol as the drug of his (Klein’s) choice. It was a wrong thing to do now that we know how much more suffering it brought into Michael’s life – but the reason for all that nightmare was still Hoefflin with made those experiments on Michael’s scalp!

    And though Klein is a persona non grata in some fan communities I do understand Klein when he gets angry with Hoefflin – it was Hoefflin’s harmful, risky and painful experiments which were the root of the problem.

    Like

  225. @urmylovely1 permalink
    November 27, 2011 7:48 pm

    I never fed into the hype about MJ hating being black & wanting to change into a white person. It was just far fetched of an idea of a man who was so soulful. This article did give me a greater understanding about the plastic surgery aspect of his life. I never understood why he kept up with changing his nose but now to be aware that it was reconstructive but self defeating due to the lupus it makes sense. To me his appearance was irrelavant because he gave to much love and he did so much charity he was simply beautiful for that alone. I knew the demerol addiction probably started during the burn treatments by enabling physicians. I had no idea of the extreme skin stretching procedures that was just crazy. He placed too much trust in quack doctors. I never doubted his innocence, I guess it was hard for people to understand a person with such fame not being a sexual whoremonger so the pedophilia smear made since to them. Michael was a real misunderstood person. and misguided as well it led to him dying far too soon. I love Michael regardless of his flaws . I pray that his children live a less complicated life as he would want them to. I wish the world could see threw the lies of the Chandlers but unless Jordy were to ever come clean about that he was forced to lie, he’ll never truly be vindicated except for in the hearts of loyal family, friends and fans. God has a special place for him now with no more judgement and riducule..his legacy still lives on in music and healing the world and may he rest in peace

    Like

  226. November 27, 2011 2:21 pm

    “A quick search on vitiligo tells you that you can’t be ‘infected’ with it, but it seems that people won’t even take 30 seconds to check that and just believe what this video says without question. I really don’t understand why people do that!”

    Tahlia, I don’t understand it either. The only explanation I see is that many people are ignorant and too lazy to get rid of their ignorance. They do not make a quick search for vitiligo because they are not used to checking up any information at all. It is much easier for them to take what they are given and swallow it as it is. They will spend hours gossiping about petty things but cannot spend a minute to do their own research.

    Watching some “dark secrets” disclosed in some “sensational” videos is much easier and more thrilling than doing a routine check up on the internet for the word “vitiligo”. Over there you have to read boring texts about some medical issue and this requires time and a bit of effort, and they are simply unable to do a small thing like that.

    I think that what we have to deal with is the result of many years of tabloid brainwashing of the public and consequent degradation of natural human mental abilities. People don’t want to think or know the truth – they want to be entertained, and offering them sensations with some crazy ideas is a way to do it.

    It is the same phenomenon you faced when you tried to talk about Michael to his detractors. It is much easier and much more comfortable for them to adhere to some old lies than start reconsidering their past fallacies by looking into some truthful facts – no, they always have “something more important to do” than looking for the truth.

    They are much more comfortable the way they are – they think they know what they need to know about Michael and regard our arguments of his innocence as a way to shatter the easy make-belief world they are living in.

    Why do they need to think on their own? They have all the three sources they need – The Daily Mirror to tell them what to know, their pastor who teaches them how to hate and sensational TV programs imitating the process of thinking or searching for the truth.

    Like

  227. Tahlia permalink
    November 27, 2011 12:22 pm

    The funny thing is, they think that anyone who doesn’t believe in all their Illuminati crap is under their ‘mind control’. Sometimes I don’t want to live on this planet lol.

    Like

  228. Teva permalink
    November 27, 2011 6:28 am

    ” Yes, people can’t be “infected” with vitiligo but they sure can with stupidity. ” – ARES

    . . . and stupidity is contagious. How can you reason with someone who thinks like that? They are certifiable.

    Like

  229. ares permalink
    November 27, 2011 3:34 am

    Yes, people can’t be “infected” with vitiligo but they sure can with stupidity. That video and some of the comments on it just proved it to me. I might do a video on it. It would be interesting.

    Like

  230. November 27, 2011 3:22 am

    What a stupid video.

    Like

  231. Tahlia permalink
    November 27, 2011 2:37 am

    It is funny, but it’s sad at the same time. The fact that people actually believe this garbage is sad, and I don’t understand how they ‘interpreted’ Michael’s dance moves into what they did, it’s utterly ridiculous! A quick search on vitiligo tells you that you can’t be ‘infected’ with it, but it seems that people won’t even take 30 seconds to check that and just believe what this video says without question. I really don’t understand why people do that!

    Like

  232. Teva permalink
    November 26, 2011 5:40 pm

    That video was priceless. The scene from the Black or White video where they were interpreting Michael’s dancing was beyond halarious. The only time I laughed this hard when when I read yesterday that a British minister is writing a foreward to the Bilble. Priceless.

    Like

  233. Tahlia permalink
    November 26, 2011 4:53 am

    What really gets on my nerves is people who now believe that the Illuminati ‘infected’ Michael with vitiligo because they don’t like influential black people. Why do people believe these things so easily??? I just had a short conversation with someone on facebook about who posted a moronic video:

    I questioned the person who put up the video:

    What do you mean ‘infected him with vitiligo?’

    it means that the desease -vitiligo- did not develop naturally in Michael’s body but rather that it was introduced in his system somehow (it is explained in the video).

    Tahlia Hotchin I don’t believe that for a second. The cause for vitiligo isn’t known, but it can be genetic. It comes from his father’s side of the family, you can’t be ‘infected’ with it.

    There is no such thing as medication that gives you vitiligo, that’s beyond stupid. This illuminati stuff is plain ridiculous, and so is the commentary of Michael’s music video. This is all poorly researched garbage conspiracy theory crap w…hich is used to manipulate gullible people. Didn’t you notice that the person who made this video says a lot of things but they actually don’t offer ANY evidence to actually PROVE what they say? None of this is convincing at all, they’ve just twisted everything that was said to fit their theories.

    Like

  234. ares permalink
    November 17, 2011 12:13 am

    I think you should add this picture of MJ to the post. It’s from Frank Cascio’s book and you can clearly see the marks of vitiligo on Mike’s hands. The haters and those who continue to believe that he wanted to go white can go and drown themselfs.

    Like

  235. sanemjfan permalink
    November 10, 2011 3:29 pm

    Here is an interview MJ did in 1996. He answers multiple questions from fans, and at 1:25 he answers why he wears surgical masks when he’s out in public: it’s because of his vitiligo, and his desire to keep as much of his skin covered as possible.

    I had always questioned why he did that, but it makes perfect sense now, and now we as fans can articulately and accurately answer that question whenever others ask why he wore the mask.

    Like

  236. Kyle permalink
    October 20, 2011 8:51 am

    Tears swelled up in my eyes when I got to the explanation of Michael’s fashions being prompted by his diseases. I saw it all before me how this man turned his pain into history, and then it clicked that this is analogous to his life story as a whole…

    Very well-written article. Thank you so much for the effort.

    Like

  237. Suzy permalink
    September 24, 2011 10:21 am

    Part 3

    Like

  238. Suzy permalink
    September 24, 2011 10:01 am

    Here’s the second part of Lee Thomas’s interview:

    Like

  239. Suzy permalink
    September 24, 2011 9:49 am

    @ David

    That’s a great interview with Lee Thomas! I’m glad the media finally talks about these things in connection with MJ.

    Like

  240. lcpledwards permalink
    September 23, 2011 8:05 am

    This is a new interview today with Lee Thomas, the reporter who has Vitiligo. His disease has progressed and gotten worse over the years, as you can see in his face. He gave a great interview! Here is part 1 of 3 (it starts towards the end)

    Like

  241. September 4, 2011 5:11 pm

    This is very reasonable

    Like

  242. sandyhouston permalink
    September 3, 2011 8:34 am

    A very informative article.

    Like

  243. September 2, 2011 11:51 pm

    “It is much needed information. I will definitely be using this article as reference for some upcoming projects I am working on”

    Debbie, thank you. Please take the information further! If we don’t do it, who will? It is unimaginable how many misfortunes fell on poor Michael’s head and with how much dignity he took them. So much suffering is simply impossible for one human being, but he took it so stoically that we could not even guess what hell he was going through. He was always smiling!

    And they say that he “was not interested in girls”. He was! Only I wonder how he could form a relationship with a girl if first he had that terrible acne and then developed a butterfly rash on his face, lupus lesions on his skin and a crust on his head? What an embarrassment it must have been for a young man! And in addition to that he suddenly went bald after the burn and had to wear an expanding balloon under his scalp! No wonder that girls were not a priority in that period of time…

    As JC Agajanian JR. said everything in Michael’s behavior had a reason for it. He wasn’t “weird” – he simply didn’t share his pain with the world around him. He kept silent about it, so it looks like it is our job to speak up for him. You, Debbie, are doing it in an excellent way. Please go on.

    Helena

    Like

  244. September 2, 2011 4:07 pm

    This is a wonderful piece! Thank you so much Vindicate MJ for doing this blog post. I am not sure which of you did this project? But, bravo! It is much needed information and is just so thorough. Wonderful! My paternal grandmother had lupus, and my maternal grandmother, vitiligo. So I have personally witnessed the kind of suffering that can take place with these. I will definitely be using this article as reference for some upcoming projects I am working on. Keep up the great work! Debbie Kunesh, Reflections on the Dance.com

    Like

  245. August 31, 2011 8:11 am

    “Karen, i don’t understand, sorry. what do you mean?”

    This is what Kaaren meant by Paris’s answer to the comment: U SOUND STUPID. MJ DIDN’T EVEN LIKE HIMSELF SO HOW CAN YOU DEFEND HIM. EXPLAIN HIS PLASTIC SURGERY.

    Paris answered:

    Poor girl. Look how mad she was and to what extremes she was driven.

    Like

  246. Alison permalink
    August 31, 2011 2:20 am

    “If not, what Paris did was take a photo of her Dad from the Scream video where he seems to be ‘flipping the bird” I thought it was a great response from our sassy little princess!”

    Karen, i don’t understand, sorry. what do you mean?

    Like

  247. August 30, 2011 2:35 pm

    “It never ceases to amaze me how people think fans are in denial when in reality it’s the other way around! The non-fans (and some fans!) know very little and believe the mythology and folklore. The fans (and supporters) are the ones who do in-depth research and have much greater understanding.”

    Carm, well-said! All this hate is based on extreme ignorance and laziness of mind, lack of desire to look into anything at all and a habit for gossip and hearsay – all of which replaces research, analysis and the process of learning and even thinking as such.

    Like

  248. August 30, 2011 1:45 pm

    @ Suzy – sorry I did not know how to post the photo – which is why I inserted the link. I did not think my photo was closed to the public so I thought you should be able to view it, even if you weren’t on Facebook.

    Perhaps one of the vindicatemj admin can help?

    If not, what Paris did was take a photo of her Dad from the Scream video where he seems to be ‘flipping the bird” I thought it was a great response from our sassy little princess!

    Like

  249. Carm permalink
    August 30, 2011 7:07 am

    Anne said “People should not judge him for his choices, but fans should stop denying the truth.”
    It never ceases to amaze me how people (including some fans, aparantly) think fans are in denial when in reality it’s the other way around! The non-fans (and some fans!) know very little and believe the mythology and folklore. The fans (and supporters) are the ones who do in-depth research and have much greater understanding.
    The fact that Michael Jadkson did not fit the mold of what society expects is what made him so unique and fascinating. It’s not necessarily a bad thing. He very clearly stated on numerous occasions that he was proud of being a black American. Also he had a very severe form of vitiligo.

    Like

  250. August 30, 2011 3:54 am

    I saw something I wouldn´t believe had I not seen it with my own eyes.
    Once I spent some vacationtime in the Bahamas. Not the main island Nassau,but one of the s,c, outer islands.The story there was that sometime in the past Swedish sailor or sailors had settled there to live.They were no longer alive,but I think some of their children or more likely grandchildren were.The sand was white and the sun was strong so everybody was pretty tanned,but there were kids with hair that was totally blond on parts and dark on other parts. And there were several kids like that.Imagine having both blonde and black hair on the same scalp.It was not an even mixture,like some kind of brown.
    I would not believe it had I not seen it.

    Like

  251. August 30, 2011 2:40 am

    There are at least three women I can think of, possibly four, who Michael loved and would’ve wanted kids with. None of them are white, three of them aren’t public. Blanket’s mother seems unlikely to be white either.

    If Michael wanted white children why did he specifically divorce Lisa Marie who had two white children so that he could have children with Debbie? What purpose would it serve if he just wanted to have the privilege of white children? Lisa already had two beautiful white Elvis kids – why would Mike go for Debbie Rowe/Klein kids as if this was a better fare?

    Paris says she is mixed raced and 100% Jackson blood in her twitter, are people really so racist they feel they can tell her what race she is?

    I also find it bizarre that he would seek out white children and yet specifically raise them with pride about being black and about Africa, people were surprised about how much they knew about black culture, their tutors specifically gave them classes on it (and they were raised by an African nanny) – something else you can also see in Paris’ tweets (“I’m black and I’m proud of it.”)

    Michael never thinned his lips – in fact the only thing he did in the last 10 years was use filler around them, making them plumper!

    Beyonce also wears lacefronts, does that mean she hates her race too? Michael was suffering from a receding hairline (as Randy Jackson and Jermaine also do) and loss of hair from the Pepsi burn/lupus, something in his autopsy report. In the last month Mike went back to using a curly haired wig because his fans had told him to bring it back, but it was still a wig. Is it less wanting to be white when he used a curly one?

    Prince Jackson has vitiligo, as evidenced in photos and as confirmed by his sister Paris and by Prince himself in AIM chats with fans.

    “Real” fans would not speak about things they are completely completely uninformed about, it makes you sound as ignorant.

    Like

  252. August 30, 2011 2:28 am

    Michael was not entirely depigmented:

    Autopsy report:

    “The decedent’s overall skin has patches of light and dark pigmented areas.

    There is focal depigmentation of the skin, particularly over the anterior chest and abdomen, face and arms.”

    Spotting on his wrists were visible around 2006-2008

    The rest of him as always was covered.

    Like

  253. ares permalink
    August 30, 2011 1:49 am

    I wonder Anna, had you ever seen Michael Jackson’s body up close, with no make up on it? You say that MJ went and completely depigment his body. How do you know that? Had you ever seen him naked? I presume no. Those TDCAUS photos that you see MJ is wearing make up on his body. Like in the “You are not alone” music video. So, you don’t know how his body was and you certainly don’t know the extent that Vitiligo affected his body skin color. You presume that he chose to completely depigment his whole body probably because you are trying to implying other things.I think you should read Again what Vitiligo is and how it can affect the people that have it.

    You speak about his personal choices. But Vitiligo was not and i believe that he handle it and the unfair attacks that he got and is still getting because of it pretty amazingly and with great dignity.

    You speak about white kids. So according to you black man should only marry black women and have only black kids? Wow Anna. That reminds me of a certain fellow who was against race mixing and massacred million of people in order to prevent it. Quite a racist implication you did there. Or is it that Michael Jackson specifically didn’t have the right to have kids of a lighter shade or different ethnicity? Or better yet he shouldn’t have children at all? Did it ever crossed your mind that Jackson might have actually loved his wife ( both of them ) and his children where product of love? And even if his two first kids were not biologically his, did it ever crossed your mind that Jackson might have wanted kids of different races because the man wasn’t obsessed with races, colour, ethnicities etc? That he could love white , black, Mexican, Chinese children equally? But no, that it would be very hard for some people to conceive. So it must have been that Jackson just didn’t want to be black.

    === He also choose to wear black wigs with straight black hair when not on stage not curly African hair like he was born with. === Are you serious with this??
    -He had a right to do whatever he wanted.-
    Did he? Really Anna? Because your comment to me look like he didn’t.

    -Real fans would not let his choices affect their opinion of him.-

    Real fans would not make so ignorant and borderline racist comments like you did. I think that you should take a look at this post again because I have the feeling that you didn’t read it.

    Like

  254. August 30, 2011 1:42 am

    “Are you kidding. I think Michael would have married her and had children with her in an absolute heartbeat if she would have accepted.”

    Julie, no doubt about it. And this makes all this discussion about him ‘preferring white children’ absolutely pointless. Given Michael’s skin problems Debbie Rowe was the obvious and best choice for him – she knew all his drawbacks, and he didn’t have to be ashamed of his speckled skin and partial baldness in her presence. He was relaxed with her and knew her to be a friend. Many successful marriages are based on this type of friendship.

    Sorry for having to go now. It is 1.30am here.

    Like

  255. Julie permalink
    August 30, 2011 1:10 am

    Are you kidding. I think Michael would have married her and had children with her in an absolute heartbeat if she would have accepted.

    Like

  256. August 30, 2011 12:39 am

    “MJ had vitiligo but he did not have to completely depigment his entire body”

    Anne, what makes you think so? Have you seen Michael without the make up? Do you know how bad his vitiligo was? He was so ashamed of it that when he was living with Lisa Marie Presley he would pop out of bed in the morning asking her not to look at him and would run away into the bathroom to put the make up there (see Taraborrelli’s book). And this before he showed himself to his wife!

    How can you judge whether he should or shouldn’t have done depigmentation it if you never saw it?

    Yes, he chose Debbie Rowe to give birth to his children, but most probably not because she was white but because he was desperate to have children and she accidentally was the best choice. If there had been another – black – woman in her place the same could have happened to her.

    And even if he wanted “white children” – so what of it? Is it a crime? Why do people speak about it with such an air of superiority?

    Even within the white race some men like blondes and some prefer brunettes. Natural blondes are rare because their genes are not dominant (weaker so to say) and when some quality is rare it is valued more. Do white men have to answer to anyone for their preference of blondes? Why are they not restricted in their choices? So why is a black man obliged to prefer only black women? What if he has a preference for blondes too? Especially if blondes offer themselves by a hundred to him?

    P.S. Do you think Michael would have hesitated if Diana Ross had agreed to give him children?

    Like

  257. anne82958 permalink
    August 29, 2011 11:57 pm

    I have been a fan of MJ since his childhood. I always regarded the change in his appearance as his evolving and his personal choice. Lady Ga Ga changes her appearance all the time. It is part of being an entertainer always trying to top yourself and get attention to promote your celebrity.

    MJ had vitiligo but he did not have to completely depigment his entire body. He choose to do this with Dr. Klein’s help. The TDRCAU video photos show the effects of his depigmenting himself not vitiligo. The other photo is damaged. His skin was perfectly brown in color under his right eye in photos after that time.

    He also choose to de emphasize his African features (nose. lips) with plastic surgery.

    He also choose to wear black wigs with straight black hair when not on stage not curly African hair like he was born with.

    He also choose to have white children not black.

    Only he knows why he did this.

    People should not judge him for his choices, but fans should stop denying the truth.

    It has never affected my opinion of him. He had a right to do whatever he wanted.

    Real fans would not let his choices affect their opinion of him.

    Like

  258. Suzy permalink
    August 29, 2011 11:43 am

    @ Karen

    I’m not on Facebook. Could you copy it here?

    Like

  259. August 29, 2011 9:33 am

    Have you seen Paris response to a haters question about her Daddy’s appearance on Twitter? If not enjoy (I certainly did!)

    Like

  260. August 24, 2011 11:50 pm

    It has a historical meaning in G.B.-but in this context it meant they
    and they were the ones who ordered Michael around, he was not to skip any rehearsals, not take Dr.Kleins injections (he was having his face touched up for the concerts).Michael had been sent home by Kenny O.
    and that was not to happen again.There are 2 dates for this event given:18/6 and 20/6 2009. Look it up on TMZ.

    Like

  261. appleh permalink
    August 24, 2011 11:27 pm

    @kaarin 22
    What is a Riot Act ?

    Like

  262. August 24, 2011 11:18 pm

    Thruth Prevail, a conspiracy is hard to prove. I think of it in this way;Were there is a prey vultures will gather, by instinct (or smell in animals) .Once a crowd of vultures have gathered it will be noticed
    and more will come.There is some subconcious common undertanding.
    Formal metings may not be held as they are not important. There is a
    more informal type of communication, such as having drinks or lunch together. Phonecalls.Many calls were made btween Thome-Thome and Randy Phillips,later typed out to be pages in the conntract.No good will existed when it came to Michael. Please look up The Riot Act on TMZ.
    They were condescending,rude and threatening towards Michael.

    Like

  263. Alison permalink
    August 24, 2011 10:33 pm

    you’re right Kaarin, its largely in the public eye seen as legal for illness = medicine and illiegal for recreation/ addiction = drug but as you say there’s an overlap esp within healthcare eg nurses don’t do a ‘medicine round’, they do the ‘drug round’, well in UK anyway and when conversing about medications you normally refer to them as drugs not medicines. eg, what drug is that / what does that drug do not ‘what medicine is that’.

    they have just reported with shock that Amy Winehouse didn’t have any illegal substances in her body and they don’t know why she died but the tv reporter – and BBC at that! – said “but that doesn’t erase all the years of…(something about drugs)… and self destructive behaviour” – why do that, saying it like she deserved to die as well. when they report on topics about ordinary people on the street they don’t imply they are bad and deserve to die because of their behaviour and addictions and problems, they report with concern and kindness generally, but if someone is a celebrity its all this crap. its just cruel.

    and a report say about a clinic doesn’t refer to ‘the drug addicts’ they would say ‘people with addictions/ drug addictions’ et.c.

    Like

  264. Truth Prevail permalink
    August 24, 2011 10:10 pm

    btw the last picture the one in the middle is jus a remake of the 1 where mj has dark skin is that how its supposed 2 be?

    Like

  265. Truth Prevail permalink
    August 24, 2011 10:01 pm

    i was reading charles thompsons blog and i read the blog the one about a crazy girl pushing him for evidence i know its old news u guys probaly have seen it already but in the blog he was tryin 2 say any fan or any1 who believes there is a conspiracy against mj 2 kill him or its sony is deluded but i highly disagree any1 who has done there research and has good reason 2 belive has every right 2 i mean the cops only watching 4mins of the mj in his room and disposing the rest! murray keeps delaying his trial and the fact numerous individuals have spoken about people out to get mj and his wealth and his catalog are all good reasons to believe mj was murdered and murray was jus the face of it while really there are alot more involved.

    Like

  266. August 24, 2011 1:05 pm

    Sorry a mistake crept in. Usually MEDICINE is for legal use And DRUG
    for illegal use.But thre is overlap.In Scientology is any drug or medicine unorthodox in that belief system?

    Like

  267. August 24, 2011 12:59 pm

    Some linguistics re drug v. medicine.
    Under medicine I found;remedy,help antidote anti-toxin,narcotic,cure,sovereign remedy.
    Under drug;to drug somebody,,remedy, bane,drug in the market (often used in purely medical contexts.)
    In many a contexts they are interchangable.And in different languages the use varies. In one of my native languages one would call someone an alcoholic when abusing al cohol.But using alcohol medically, for example to disinfect(diluted in this case) There is the expression : To drug somebody ,not meant to sedate somebody for medical reasons though this was common in the past for lack of modern means.
    The use of DRUG when it comes to illegal use and MEDICINE for ill legal use is colloqually based For example it would be perfectly OK to say that the best drug for hyper tension,ie high bloodpressure is…..

    Like

  268. Julie permalink
    August 24, 2011 8:16 am

    @Suzy – that’s exactly right. Had he been a habitual anything it would have shown up in the autopsy and it didn’t. Why on earth that never gets mentioned and the other keeps on being perpetuated is beyond me.

    Like

  269. Suzy permalink
    August 24, 2011 7:50 am

    As far as I remember from the autopsy Michael’s liver was healthy. That too refutes the claim he was a long time drug addict (or alcoholist – I have seen such claims as well). Sure he had his problems from time to time: in 1993 and I thing at the beginning of the 2000s but if he had been such a long time drug abuser/alcoholist as he is portrayed, it would have certainly left its marks on his liver.

    Like

  270. Julie permalink
    August 24, 2011 4:15 am

    @vindicatemj – a drug addict in the United States used to mean someone who was addicted to hardcore drugs. Sadly, more people are dying in this country from prescription drug overdoses so they get lumped in as drug addicts. What gets me is that Michael admitted in 1993 that he was addicted to pain medication and he sought treatment for that problem. He apparently would have problems from time to time with that issue, but he was not someone who was continuously hooked on medications to the point that he could not function from 1984 (after the Pepsi fiasco) until 2009. Further, the man had legitimate issues to be on medication. Not just for his health issues, but after watching the fall he took in 1999 that damaged his back, I can see where he would be in definite need of pain medication. As I stated in previous posts, I read in LaToya’s book that they suspected he had a problem back in 2002 but nothing came of the “intervention,” as Michael appeared to be ok. Janet, to Oprah, spoke of more than one intervention so who knows? On youtube there is a taped deposition from the lawsuit he was in against Dieter Weisner (I think) and the attorney is showing him documents and asking him if her remembers signing said documents and Michael said repeatedly that he did not because of being on prescription medication. In my opinion, Michael Jackson was not a drug addict, at least not in the sense that I would consider to label someone as. I look at Ozzy Osbourne (just an example) and the man can barely put a coherent sentence together and it’s been that way for decades, but I don’t hear people constantly referring to him as a drug addict like they do Michael. I truly believe Michael was given that label just to further sully his name and reputation and people such as Harvey Levin and now Dr. Drew are attempting to solidify that in people’s minds. It further feels as though Harvey Levin, through TMZ, is working with Conrad Murray’s PR team when it posts stories and that’s extremely sad to me.

    To quote Matt Druge, “where does Michael Jackson go to get his day in court, to get his reputation back?”

    Like

  271. shelly permalink
    August 24, 2011 1:20 am

    “The majority of the population falls into this category and all these people have big pharmacies at home, with all sorts of medicines left over from previous or current ailments. As people get older their pharmacies tend to increase. So having a “pharmacy” at home is nothing unusual and is absolutely no matter for jokes.”

    It’s precisely what I find funny when people calls MJ a drug addict, I have more medicines in my pharmacy than he had when he died and I am not a drug addict.

    Like

  272. August 24, 2011 12:36 am

    – “Oprah asked Lisa about Michael and drugs and Lisa told her that she didn’t suspect drugs until he collapsed in 1995” -Julie
    – “Scientology are very anti-medicine, so even if the medicine MJ took at the time was needed to treat his condition, she probably thought of it as “drug abuse” even if it wasn’t and overblew that aspect” – Suzy

    Can anyone explain to me what the word “drug” means in the US? And what is drug “abuse”? The reason why I am asking is that I feel a very big cultural difference in the way these words (and phenomena as such) are treated in the US and my country.

    For us “drugs” are narcotics only and those who take them are “drug addicts”. Only those people who use narcotics for recreation purposes are called “drug addicts”, because those who receive them as pain-killers (for example in case of cancer) are not considered drug-addicts – everyone understands that drugs are indispensable to them, are a forced measure, not the matter of their choice, and relieving pain is the last mercy which can be done to these people by their doctors.

    Those who take medicines prescribed or recommended by doctors are never called drug addicts – no, these people are usually hailed by doctors as exemplary patients who follow their instructions and do not deviate from the chosen treatment. The majority of the population falls into this category and all these people have big pharmacies at home, with all sorts of medicines left over from previous or current ailments. As people get older their pharmacies tend to increase. So having a “pharmacy” at home is nothing unusual and is absolutely no matter for sensations.

    Some patients take medicines on a regular basis because their diseases are chronic and are called chronic patients. Even if they have to take some medicine until the end of their life and are dependent on them they will never be called drug-addicts (no matter how many medications they take) because drug-addiction is something totally different and implies only narcotics taken for recreation.

    Now here is what the English-language dictionary says about drugs:

    A drug, broadly speaking, is any substance that, when absorbed into the body of a living organism, alters normal bodily function. In pharmacology, a drug is “a chemical substance used in the treatment, cure, prevention, or diagnosis of disease or used to otherwise enhance physical or mental well-being. Drugs may be prescribed for a limited duration, or on a regular basis for chronic disorders.
    Recreational drugs are chemical substances that affect the central nervous system, such as opioids or hallucinogens. They may be used for perceived beneficial effects on perception, consciousness, personality, and behavior. Some drugs can cause addiction and habituation

    Medication by the same dictionary is put into a different category:

    A medication or medicine is a drug taken to cure and/or ameliorate any symptoms of an illness or medical condition, or may be used as preventive medicine that has future benefits but does not treat any existing or pre-existing diseases or symptoms.

    But a drug is also used for treatment, cure and prevention! So when people say that someone takes drugs, does it mean that this person is a narcotic drug-addict or a good patient who diligently follows the advice of his doctor?

    Could anyone explain what the word drug really means in the US? I am not joking and really need to understand that.

    Speaking from my cultural background I interpret Lisa Marie Presley’s words this way. When she said she started suspecting drugs during Michael’s collapse in 1995 she meant narcotic drugs. However she was wrong because that Israeli doctor said it point blank that there were no narcotics in his system. The doctor said it then and thought it necessary to repeat this fact now –when the article was published after Michael’s death .

    As to the reason for his near death collapse (as a result of which he stayed in hospital for two weeks) we can only make guesses. It could be an extraordinary form of a stomach flu and dehydration (as Lynette supposed) or a systemic but undiagnosed lupus (as I supposed). Whatever it is, it shows that Michael was battling a really serious condition, which necessitated lots of medications and which with normal people should evoke sympathy but not laugh and ridicule – especially when the doctor says that it was absolutely no joke.

    Like

  273. Julie permalink
    August 23, 2011 11:01 pm

    Suzy – you are probably right. I forgot how scientology might have affected her thought process. I just thought she was side-stepping the issue of why the marriage collapsed and that was her excuse. She did admit that she followed him around for another 4 years after the divorce, which I was glad she at least admitted that.

    Like

  274. Suzy permalink
    August 23, 2011 10:02 pm

    I suspect Lisa is pushing the “drugs agenda” because of her cult. Scientology are very anti-medicine, so even if the medicine MJ took at the time was needed to treat his condition, she probably thought of it as “drug abuse” even if it wasn’t and overblew that aspect.

    I think in her mind it boils down to her cult being “right” about medicine.

    Like

  275. Julie permalink
    August 23, 2011 6:03 pm

    I just wanted to add that in Lisa’s interview with Oprah in 2010, Oprah asked Lisa about Michael and drugs and Lisa told her that she didn’t suspect drugs until he collapsed in 1995 and no one could tell her what was wrong. I’m not sure why she said that when the doctors clearly said something else — but Oprah being Oprah was going to push the drug issue and that’s what came out of Lisa’s mouth.

    Like

  276. August 23, 2011 5:04 pm

    @Kaarin

    Another note on “Hydroxychloroquine”

    JRT actually gave an interview in 1995 where he said Michael had spoken to him after the Diane Sawyer interview and had told him that he’d actually wanted to bring up his lupus more and explain that taking that medication for his lupus had actually increased the rate at which his vitiligo worked. A doctor backs up that what Michael is saying is true, though of course they too make it sound like they can’t be sure, because it’s Mike of course.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/gossip/1995/06/16/1995-06-16__apollo_13_s__tom_hankerin__.html

    JRT sound skeptical about this, I know he didn’t speak much about any of that in his books – but it’s true what Michael told him. That is what hydroxy does and when he was diagnosed officially in 1986 is when you can see the big difference in the skin colour in his face, so I’d assume it was when he began treatment.

    Stacy Brown and Bob Jones I think actually say that Michael had lupus in their book, at least Stacy mentioned it online when he was trash talking MJ during the trial tribulations and threw scorn at Mike saying that was actually the reason he lost his pigment, not because he’d really had vitiligo, but because he’d “overused” the lupus treatment. Just ignorance but it makes me laugh when the liars think they’re catching Mike out and they’re really just helping Michael’s case.

    Like

  277. August 23, 2011 4:51 pm

    Dr Wallace said SLE didn’t have a role in Michael’s death, which it didn’t.

    But pleurisy and other ailments as well as his having a rheumatologist who was so close to him suggest his lupus did affect more than just Michael’s skin.

    Metzger was also there when Michael collapsed in 1995. I think he was also on tour with Michael for a bit during HIStory. I mean, on the one hand it would be good for Michael for a legitimate doctor to talk about the effects his lupus had on him, but on the other hand part of me is grateful that at least one person who actually did seem to treat Michael for his illness properly has decided not to hurl himself at the media for all his worth.

    Like

  278. kaarin22 permalink
    August 23, 2011 4:13 pm

    Re lupus; 5-10% of patients with Discoid lupus go on to develop SLE.Dr. All Metzger is the one who knows Michaels history re this illness..However it is not important in the murray trial .I recall that Michael was given a medication;Hydroxychloroquine,This is used for both kinds of lupus and PROTECTS against SLE. I don´t know if he was on it in June 2009..

    Like

  279. August 23, 2011 3:21 pm

    This is a great article and a great discussion. We know that Michael suffered from vitiligo and lupus – serious conditions which Michael would have absolutely needed professional help and medication to deal with. The exact form of these conditions, while important, is not something we, as lay people, are able to define with absolute accuracy for a number of reasons. Perhaps testimony by Michael’s doctors during Conrad Murray’s trial will delve further into Michael health issues, perhaps not. Perhaps they should. In the meantime, the main thrust of this article and the discussion is doing a great service in pointing out the very real and difficult medical problems Michael faced and managed well (some creatively!) over many years. It is a great reference for people wanting to know the truth rather than being force-fed the usual media misinformation and propaganda.

    Like

  280. August 23, 2011 11:59 am

    “What did Lisa say exactly? I don’t remember. Did she say she knew MJ passed out because of drugs or did she just say she thought so?”

    Suzy, LMP didn’t say anything about drugs, all she said was that she couldn’t figure out what was wrong with him. Everyone told a different story:

    “He was in the hospital, and I couldn’t figure out what was wrong with him. I started asking questions, and it was always a different story. He said I was “causing trouble” and “stirring up problems.” He told me, “you’re making my heart rate go up,” and asked me to go home, and I said, “Good. I want out.”

    Like

  281. August 23, 2011 11:03 am

    “but Michael did not have SLE”

    Lynande, I am totally amazed that you – though you are not a lupus specialist – are so definitive in making a diagnosis and are absolutely ruling out the possibility that Michael could have systemic lupus. I don’t insist that Michael had it. What I am saying that he could have it. However your insistence that it should be only “your way” is astonishing.

    In fact it is only the opinion of MIchael’s lupus doctor Allan Metzger which can more or less clear up the picture here, but this doctor evidently is not used to discussing his patients’ problems in public as others do.

    Like

  282. August 23, 2011 10:54 am

    “Geoff Thomas who has a site called “the wide world of lupus” posted an email he received on July 1, 2009 from lupus expert Daniel Wallace. It appears Dr Wallace was responding to comments that child abuse (verbal, mental or otherwise) can cause lupus. (Refer to other comments on the site about this.) The email from Dr Wallace reads:
    Dear Colleagues:
    I can confirm that Michael Jackson had vitiligo and discoid (chronic cutaneous lupus) and never had systemic disease that played any role in his passing.
    I am concerned that commentators are relating that a background of abuse has anything to do with lupus. There has never been a peer review published article that specifically has shown this in lupus.”

    BG, I’ve seen that information before but am absolutely not convinced. The opinion of one doctor who has never treated Michael is not the final diagnosis. In difficult cases doctors even confer with each other and arrange a concilium. Doctors are no gods and there is always a difference of opinion. And not all doctors are good at diagnostics. Besides Dr. Wallace is making a factual mistake here – what he actually says is that stress has nothing to do with lupus (while all other doctors says it does).

    In addition to that we see that his statement is focused on Michael not having systemic lupus “that played any role in his passing”. Lupus did not indeed have any role in his passing, but it doesn’t mean that Michael didn’t have it. As Rockforever rightfully says if Michael was monitored all his life by a lupus specialist rheumatologist as his primary doctor, Dr Allan Metzger and this means that Michael had these problems. Discoid lupus has nothing to do with rheumatism as it is “skin only”, so if we put two and two together we come to a different conclusion than Dr. Wallace – Michael could have systemic lypus.

    We’ve heard numerous other opinions from doctors about Michael and are absolutely not obliged to believe all of them. Some are fake, some have an agenda, some are Michael’s haters, some are simply non-professional, some belong to different “schools of thought” (which is common in science) – the list can go on.

    Like

  283. Anna permalink
    August 23, 2011 10:17 am

    @lcpledwards Interesing update from the bodyguards! I take it there will be two books then, the one the “writer” will be releasing the one “they themselves” will be releasing. Hopefully they take this info public like GMA interivew since that was were most of us first heard of this project. Otherwise the public will be mislead as well.

    Like

  284. Suzy permalink
    August 23, 2011 10:07 am

    What did Lisa say exactly? I don’t remember. Did she say she knew MJ passed out because of drugs or did she just say she thought so?

    Like

  285. lynande51 permalink
    August 23, 2011 8:32 am

    @ BG thank you. Yes stress does play a role in the exacerbation of Auto immune disorders of any kind but Michael did not have SLE.He had discoid lesions from time to time, some of the scars mentioned on his autopsy could probably confirm that. When he was treated at Beth Israel Hospital in New York City he was taken to the hospital because passed out on stage during a rehearsal for an HBO special that he was going to do. He had been rehearsing all day. The two days before that he had a bout of gastro enteritis, the stomach flu with diarrhea. When you loose a significant amount of body fluid like you would from sweating and having the diarrhea you lose potassium. When you lose potassium it causes irregular heart rhythms. That is probably what happened when Lisa went to the hospital and she was told to leave because she was upsetting Michael and was causiing his heart rate to go up. I don’t know why Lisa says the things she says. I could only guess and my guess would be is that she wanted something to be wrong with Michael instead of her.

    Like

  286. August 23, 2011 7:11 am

    @ vmj Geoff Thomas who has a site called “the wide world of lupus” posted an email he received on July 1, 2009 from lupus expert Daniel Wallace. It appears Dr Wallace was responding to comments that child abuse (verbal, mental or otherwise) can cause lupus. (Refer to other comments on the site about this.) The email from Dr Wallace reads:

    Dear Colleagues:

    I can confirm that Michael Jackson had vitiligo and discoid (chronic cutaneous lupus) and never had systemic disease that played any role in his passing.

    I am concerned that commentators are relating that a background of abuse has anything to do with lupus. There has never been a peer review published article that specifically has shown this in lupus.

    Thanks
    Dan Wallace MD
    Clinical Professor of Medicine
    Cedars-Sinai Medical Center/David Geffen School of Medicine at UCLA

    http://thewideworldoflupus.blogspot.com/2009/06/michael-jackson-lupus.html

    Like

  287. lcpledwards permalink
    August 23, 2011 4:04 am

    Speaking of MJ’s bodyguards, here is a message that they posted on Facebook last week:

    My FBMJ Family;
    A few months ago we took on the services of a writer; we disclosed confidential information pertaining to our time with MJ. Unknown to us this writer had ulterior motives and mislead us. They took our information and now they intend on publishing a book based on the information we disclosed to them. This is the same Devilish trash MJ had to endure. We will post the writers information soon.

    Some things will never change! Here is a reply they gave to someone regarding legal action against the writer:

    ‎@Mickie, that’s not necessarily true, when you chose a writer to help finalize your book you must disclose all your information as you should have established a trust as we did. We do have a Non-Disclosure agreement however they have take actions that question their integrity.

    We are neither worried or concerned, this project is now done, soon All of those that continued to pray and stand by us will have what they deserve and will appreciate.

    It’s too bad this had to happen, but let’s hope that writer’s slanderous book is stopped in it’s tracks!

    Like

  288. August 23, 2011 2:28 am

    Here’s the quote from the BG:

    Q: why was mj seen in wheelchairs?

    MJ’s Bodyguards: We can say this, it was not always a disguise.

    Like

  289. August 23, 2011 2:27 am

    One more note for today.
    When police investigated those crazy allegations from Michael’s family that they had found heroin in Michael’s home, law enforcement bodies not only refuted those allegations but specially noted that there was NO heroin, marijuana or cocaine in his system:

    “Family members told coroner’s officials that they found “tar heroin” in the Holmby Hills home’s master bedroom. Only Jackson and his children had access to the room, according to court records unsealed Thursday. The discovery prompted authorities to obtain a search warrant for Jackson’s house for heroin, hypodermic needles, cutting agents, scales, balloons, condoms, razor blades, buyer lists, and seller lists, among other items, documents show.
    But within days, police had ruled out heroin as a factor in the singer’s death, sources close to the investigation said. Lab tests showed that the purported heroin was actually moldy marijuana, sources said. And, according to court records, a lengthy police interview with Jackson’s personal physician, Dr. Conrad Murray, placed another drug, the powerful anesthetic propofol, at the center of the investigation.

    Law enforcement sources said that neither marijuana, cocaine nor heroin were found in Jackson’s system.”

    http://articles.latimes.com/2009/aug/28/local/me-jackson28

    Arnold Klein stressed it several times in his interview with Harley Levin that La Toya stayed in Michael’s home for two days after his death. So it must have been this crazy woman who thought she found something there. Michael’s family seemed to be always thinking the worst about him.

    Like

  290. August 23, 2011 2:21 am

    Shelly, it was on their facebook wall, they might mention it in their book. I’ll try and find the quote but I don’t know if I saved it.

    On that too, MJ had a big DLE flare up in 1986 and that was when he first went out in public in a wheelchair.

    Klein said in one interview that MJ had SLE, I think on one of the TMZ shows.

    @Vindicate

    Michael actually had a lupus specialist rheumatologist as his primary doctor, Dr Allan Metzger. He videotaped MJ’s wedding to Debbie and he and MJ both gave a speech at a lupus fundraiser together in 2003. I’ve been told only people affected by SLE would have a rheumatologist.

    I guess on one hand we should be thankful that at least Metzger has had the grace to not appear on every talkshow available to talk about MJ.

    Like

  291. August 23, 2011 1:56 am

    Here is a story from that doctor in Israel:

    Published: Wednesday, Jul. 08, 2009
    Rock Hill doctor helped saved Michael Jackson’s life after 1995 rehearsal collapse

    By Andrew Dys, Columnist – adys@heradonline.com

    When Dr. William Alleyne II heard about Michael Jackson’s death last week while on vacation, this doctor who specializes in lung ailments in Rock Hill turned young again.

    In his mind, he was just Bill Alleyne, the young guy who spent money out of his pocket to buy Michael Jackson albums. The guy who became a doctor and took his new bride to Michael Jackson concerts.
    “It was an overwhelming sense of sadness, Alleyne said.
    Sure, Bill Alleyne is a Michael Jackson fan like millions. But Dr. William Alleyne had more reason to be sad than most fans. Alleyne said Tuesday, for the first time in 14 years, I was the doctor who saved Michael Jackson’s life.
    In December 1995, Alleyne was the critical care director at Beth Israel North Hospital, on the Upper East Side in New York City across the way from the mayor’s Gracie Mansion. He was the guy in charge when one of the nurses told him, We have Michael Jackson coming here.
    Alleyne didn’t believe it then.
    “I said, ‘Ha, ha, very funny,’ Alleyne recalled.
    He had seen patients who were stars, or spouses of stars, but this was different. Thousands of people started clamoring outside the hospital. The place was turning into bedlam.
    “Ten minutes later, they rolled Michael Jackson in on a stretcher, Alleyne said Tuesday from his Rock Hill office where he’s one of the partners at Carolina Pulmonary Physicians. But in 1995, Alleyne was the doctor to the King of Pop. Jackson had collapsed after a rehearsal for an upcoming HBO special at the nearby Beacon Theater.
    Alleyne and his wife had seen Jackson before in concert, on television, and now, in 1995, Jackson was waiting, unconscious, for Bill Alleyne to save his life.

    “Mr. Jackson was in critical condition, Alleyne said. He was dehydrated. He had low blood pressure. He had a rapid heart rate. He was near death.”

    Alleyne went from doctor to a star to doctor of a man who could die. Alleyne, an acquaintance of Jackson’s doctor at the time who had seen some of that doctor’s patients, had been picked personally by that doctor to be the attending physician for Jackson’s emergency care. Alleyne gave the order to have the defibrillator ready if needed to treat the abnormal heart rhythm of the most famous entertainer with the best rhythm on Earth.

    After about an hour or so that December dusk, Alleyne said he had Jackson stabilized with intravenous fluids and other treatment, and transferred Jackson to intensive care. But in the meantime, the crowd outside had become massive, a mob scene.
    “I looked outside the window, and the crowd was shoulder to shoulder, huge, far more than when the mayor’s mansion across the street had hosted the pope, the president, even Nelson Mandela, Alleyne recalled.
    And inside the hospital, Alleyne said, it was absolute pandemonium.
    Jackson’s entourage had muscled into intensive care. Alleyne had a brief showdown with one bodyguard who did not want to let Alleyne in the room again after Alleyne had left briefly. Alleyne recalled he said to the bodyguard, Your boss is dying in there, and I am going in there to save his life. You can be the one who has to say you wouldn’t let me in.
    Bill Alleyne walked in and saved Michael Jackson.
    But the crush of people inside wasn’t over. The entourage of Jackson’s then-wife, Lisa Marie Presley, came in. Presley came in, too. Then through the middle of the crowd, another entourage, and Janet Jackson, Michael’s sister.

    “Here is Janet, drop-dead, stop-the clock gorgeous, and she said, ‘Thank you for taking care of my brother,’ Alleyne recalled.
    Alleyne found time to call home. His wife, Cheryl Courtlandt, a physician herself who now is a pediatrician at Levine’s Children’s Hospital in Charlotte, was home with two small kids.
    “I’m gonna be a little late honey, Alleyne told his wife. Turn on the news.
    He told his wife Michael Jackson was his patient, and she said to her husband, verbatim, in words Alleyne will never forget: Well, you take care of Mr. Jackson and hurry home, because I have two kids here and you need to take out the garbage.

    Jackson soon was stable, and Alleyne and Jackson started a doctor/patient relationship similar to all in theory but unlike any relationship Alleyne had ever had in practice. As people were climbing trees to get pictures of inside the hospital, as Jackson’s fans sang his songs outside and the world press invaded the sidewalks and street for information about the condition of this most-famous man, Bill Alleyne tried to keep Michael Jackson alive with intravenous food and care.

    Michael Jackson was the most soft-spoken, least demanding guy you would ever want to meet, Alleyne said. Everything he said was a whisper. His biggest concern was could he perform.
    Alleyne told Jackson no way could he perform anytime soon.
    Alleyne had to get permission to release information to Jackson’s family. Jackson gave it. Alleyne had to deal with other doctors who came to watch his every move, and a world that wanted information that Alleyne would not give to anybody but those Jackson said to give it to.
    After about 72 hours, Alleyne and Jackson’s publicists and others realized they had to give a press conference. So Alleyne worked with Jackson’s people to go over what could be said, what to stay away from but still tell the truth.

    Alleyne was blunt with the world, saying Jackson did not have any immune system problems because rumors about AIDS were swirling. He was blunt that Jackson had no drugs in his system.

    News accounts from 1995 show Alleyne and his then-partner, Dr. Bob Glennon, talking about Jackson’s condition to convince the world that Jackson was, in fact, critically ill.
    “Michael Jackson was unconscious when he arrived, Alleyne said. I had to make that clear.
    Through the next few days, Alleyne was Jackson’s doctor. Other doctors came to watch behind him, but Alleyne said he was not affronted. Having others sets of eyes look at his care and treatment of Jackson was understandable.

    Jackson had to do what other patients who are recovering must do, Alleyne said. Walk around, be monitored. Except he had an entourage in the next room.
    “After a couple of days, Mr. Jackson told me he needed to get his hair done, Alleyne remembered. I told him we had a barber at the hospital.
    Jackson’s entourage laughed: A stylist traveled around the world with Jackson and would style those locks right there in intensive care. The makeup crew came in, too.
    Near the end of Jackson’s hospital stay, he asked Alleyne if he could visit other patients in intensive care. Jackson met one lady, gave her an autographed picture after he prayed with her, and the lady told Alleyne, I can die now; I prayed with Michael Jackson.
    Alleyne recalled, laughing: I told Mr. Jackson maybe visiting with people who had suffered heart attacks or other serious problems wasn’t such a good idea.

    When Jackson was discharged, Alleyne stayed in the background as the cameras went off and the video was shot. But Jackson asked Alleyne to make house calls for the next three days. Blood pressure checks, pulse, all that stuff. Alleyne was the director of critical care house calls were not his bag. But Michael Jackson had asked, so Alleyne said yes.
    “House calls, to the penthouse of the Four Seasons hotel, Alleyne said. He had rented out the entire top two floors.
    In one moment of weakness, Alleyne said he almost asked Jackson to teach him how to moonwalk Jackson’s famous trademark dance.
    But Alleyne kept it professional with Michael Jackson, as the entourages and the world watched Alleyne’s every move.

    Finally, about two weeks into this whirlwind relationship, Alleyne told Jackson, Mr. Jackson, you are stable. I can stop being your doctor and return to being your fan.
    All humble Alleyne asked for was an autographed picture for his kids to have years down the road.
    Before Alleyne left the hotel that day, Alleyne recalled Jackson telling him: Thank you for saving my life.
    Then Jackson told Alleyne he understood how difficult it had been for a black man to get to such a distinguished position within the medical world, that Alleyne’s accomplishments were inspiring to Jackson.
    “It was very touching, Alleyne said. I will never forget that.
    Alleyne never gave an interview since then, never signed any book deals or made a nickel off being Michael Jackson’s doctor of almost two weeks. He never spoke to Michael Jackson again.
    Alleyne, other than casual conversation with friends, or associates in medicine, or among the people at his medical practice, never told anyone of his time as doctor to the most famous entertainer in the world.

    Alleyne’s own children, son Douglas and daughter Courtney, only learned of his role when a documentary came out a few years ago that had some of the footage of the news conferences from 1995 in it. There was Bill Alleyne.
    “Daddy, are you Michael Jackson’s doctor?” his daughter asked.
    “I said yes, because I was his doctor, Alleyne said. I looked at it as always being his doctor, that I had a professional relationship with Mr. Jackson and would honor that.
    This man with Carolina roots in his family came to Charlotte in 1996, then began practicing medicine in Rock Hill in 1999. He’s done what humble doctors do: give some time to reading at schools, volunteered, raised his kids.

    The sign outside his Rock Hill medical practice only has his name. There is no mention of Michael Jackson anywhere in the building.
    Only now, after Jackson’s death, did Alleyne agree to share his remembrances of those days.
    Alleyne said that he told his wife, only half-jokingly, that the world spotlight would be on the doctors who had recently been caring for Jackson before his death. Alleyne said he would be remembered as: I was the doctor who saved Michael Jackson’s life.
    Alleyne has, at night the past few days after seeing patients, watched some coverage of the aftermath of Michael Jackson’s death.
    That to this day he is so loved comes as no surprise to me, Alleyne said. He was very gracious and kind.
    He understands that there were accusations against Jackson after 1995, but that was not the Michael Jackson Bill Alleyne knew in 1995.

    And Tuesday afternoon, as tens of millions, maybe more, watched the memorial service for Jackson from Los Angeles, here’s what Bill Alleyne, doctor, did: He saw other patients. He did not watch TV.
    He helped a lady with a little bit of cardiopulmonary trouble. Another with asthma. More. Each received Bill Alleyne’s full attention, as he had given Michael Jackson his full attention in 1995.
    Alleyne saw them all, gave this interview about that two weeks 14 years ago, then went home.
    Just like he did for those crazy days in December 1995, when Bill Alleyne was Michael Jackson’s doctor.

    http://www.lipstickalley.com/f227/doctor-who-helped-saved-michael-jacksons-life-after-1995-rehearsal-collapse-201778/

    P.S. This was the time when Lisa Marie Presley asked what was wrong with him and nobody could answer. She resented it very much (possibly thinking that it was drugs).
    However the doctor said it flatly that there were no drugs in his system. It was something different – and no one knows what it was.

    Could it be lupus?

    When the doctor said Michael didn’t have any immune diseases he spoke about AIDS and not vitiligo or lupus which are autoimmune diseases. Treatment of immune diseases involves strengthening one’s immune system, while in lupus the immune system is supressed as it is too active against its owner.

    And the final note – Michael didn’t take care of children only. He went to see an old lady in the intensive care unit and they prayed together.

    Like

  292. shelly permalink
    August 23, 2011 1:29 am

    “His bodyguards did say that the wheelchairs he’d use sometimes weren’t just there as a disguise.”

    Do you have a link?

    Like

  293. August 23, 2011 1:06 am

    “Michael had DLE. Discoid Lupus effects the skin.”

    Lynande, why are so sure? Because Klein said so? But Klein is a dermatologist and simply doesn’t have the necessary qualification to diagnose systemic lupus which affects the whole body and its internal organs. From what I’ve read about systemic lypus people go undiagnosed for years and may be never correctly diagnosed at all. All Michael needed was a top qualified doctor who could monitor his condition on a daily basis – but it seems that despite Michael’s wealth he never had proper medical treatment. One of our readers was probably right – the rich seem to get the worst treatment.

    Michael often complained about pains in his body and people just never believed him – I clearly remember Shmuley laughing when he said that Michael seemed to be constantly in pain, but this is exactly how SLE lupus patients feel! Shmuley’s reaction was typical – all of them shrugged off his complaints as non-important. The only thing they were to do was to believe Michael, but this is what they never did.

    Here is information on how difficult it is to diagnose systemic lupus – even blood tests (even when a person is alive) are not definitive:

    How to Diagnose Systemic Lupus
    By Mary Duffy, eHow Contributor

    Lupus is difficult to diagnose. Because the symptoms of the disease vary so widely, doctors have been known to call it “the great imitator.”
    Lupus primarily affects women and can take several forms, either affecting only the skin or many different parts of the body and internal systems. This kind of lupus is called systemic lupus erythematosis (SLE) and in the following steps we’ll examine how to diagnose the condition.

    Instructions

    1
    Check your symptoms. Systemic lupus means that more than one organ or organ system is affected by disease. But often, the first place to show signs of lupus is the skin. Skin-related symptoms of lupus include sunlight exposure that causes a rash, either a malar rash or a discoid rash. A malar rash affects the cheeks, nose and forehead. Discoid rash can appear almost anywhere on the body, but is circular in shape. Both of these rashes worsen with exposure to the sun or UV rays. The next most common symptom of lupus is arthritis, pain and swelling in the joints. Joint pain is a common symptom of many systemic diseases, so additional symptoms will be required for a diagnosis of lupus.

    2
    Get tested. Lupus is difficult to diagnose because it takes on many forms. However, there are blood tests which can help diagnose lupus when other symptoms are also present. While there is no definitive, single test for lupus, the following ones are commonly used to help make a diagnosis.’
    1. The anti-nuclear antibody test (ANA) will be positive if your immune system is creating antibodies which react to cell nuclei. It is estimated that 95 percent of lupus patients have a positive ANA test. A positive ANA is sometimes present even if you do not have lupus, so the result must be taken into consideration along with other symptoms.
    2. The anti-Sm antibody test will be positive if your immune system is creating antibodies which react to a protein called the Smith protein. Around 30 percent of people with lupus have a positive anti-Sm test; a positive anti-Sm is a strong indication of lupus. However, a negative anti-Sm test does not mean you do not have lupus.
    3. The anti-DNA test checks for antibodies that react to DNA. Like the anti-Sm test, a positive result usually confirms the presence of lupus, but a negative result does not necessarily rule lupus out.

    3
    Be informed. Because the symptoms of lupus are common symptoms of many other diseases, a diagnosis can only be made when certain diagnostic criteria are met. The American College of Rheumatology issued 11 diagnostic criteria for lupus. Generally, people suffering from 4 of the 11 symptoms can be diagnosed with lupus. We have already covered 6 of these:PhotosensitivityMalar rashDiscoid rashPositive ANA testPositive anti-Sm or positive anti-DNA testArthritis. The last five symptoms are: Oral ulcers–Small, painless blisters in your mouth or nose. Kidney disorder–A urine test shows protein or other abnormalities.Blood disorder–A blood test shows low counts of platelets or a low white blood count.Inflammation–Pleuritis is the inflammation of the lining of the lungs, and pericarditis is the inflammation of the outer membrane of the heart. Neurological problems–Seizures and psychosis when no drugs which cause these symptoms have been taken.”

    http://www.ehow.com/how_2300030_diagnose-systemic-lupus.html

    Michael definitely had more than 4 symptoms, so saying that it “affected his skin only” is a grave underestimation. When once Michael was suddenly taken ill the Israeli doctor who treated him said that Michael nearly died, but apart from that he couldn’t say why! This is exactly the unpredictable and uncanny way lupus behaves.

    Like

  294. August 23, 2011 1:04 am

    His discoid was in remission, if they’d done an autopsy on him in 1983 or 1986 then they would’ve made note about the malar rash.

    They did find the blisters in his lungs – pleurisy, which is strongly associated with lupus SLE.

    http://lupus.about.com/od/relatedconditions/p/LupPleur.htm

    His bodyguards did say that the wheelchairs he’d use sometimes weren’t just there as a disguise.

    Like

  295. August 22, 2011 9:03 pm

    The forensic consult did mention;Depletion of structural functional reserves of lungs.This means that he couldn´t take a really deep breath.
    No cause for death.

    Like

  296. August 22, 2011 8:58 pm

    I only first wrote what was written in a forensic consultation. They listed the findings,but did not give a clinical diagnosis.The findings in the lungs did not play a part in cause of death. Discoid lupus can
    become systemic in about 10% of cases.Compared to the very high level of Propofol found, the lung findings are relatively insignificant. For the diagnosis of systemic lupus one looks for certain antibodies in the blood
    When he had that pleurisy it would be important to know whether it was from an infectious agent, germ or virus or aseptic which would pont to lupus.Stress plays a role on lupus too.

    Like

  297. lynande51 permalink
    August 22, 2011 8:01 pm

    @ Shelly, look up discoid lupus and hyperpigmentation google it then google discoid lups photos and you can see. That is the best way for you to do it then you can see for yourself and you will have a better understading of it.

    Like

  298. Chris permalink
    August 22, 2011 7:50 pm

    @ Lynande

    Yes and we saw how supportive Quincy Jones was to Michael’s conditions after his death didn’t we.
    What did Michael do too ever deserve being treated so badly?

    Like

  299. shelly permalink
    August 22, 2011 7:13 pm

    “Because they did not have the medical records when they were examinng the body.”

    Yes, but they examined his skin.

    “The hyper pigmentation mentioned on his lower leg is probaly a scar from one of the discoid lesions.”

    What is exactly discoid lupus? Does it create pigmentation of the skin even though you have vitiligo.

    Like

  300. lynande51 permalink
    August 22, 2011 7:06 pm

    Because they did not have the medical records when they were examinng the body. Because it effects the skin you have a report that says he has pigmentation indicative of a skin disorder. The hyper pigmentation mentioned on his lower leg is probaly a scar from one of the discoid lesions.

    Like

  301. shelly permalink
    August 22, 2011 6:43 pm

    My last post is more a question. If he had Discoid, why it’s not written in the autopsy report.

    Like

  302. shelly permalink
    August 22, 2011 6:30 pm

    “Michael had DLE. Discoid Lupus effects the skin.”

    Yes, but it’s not written in the autposy report.

    Like

  303. lynande51 permalink
    August 22, 2011 6:20 pm

    Sometime in the mid eighties Michael had a partially collapsed lung. It was when he was working with Quincy Jones. It happened because of pleursy. He was taken to the hospital by Jermaine because it happened at his house. The scarring on the lung is due to that. The swellin gin his brain following death is from his brain being without oxygen. It was mild swelling which is a common finding in hypoxic death.
    There is no evidence in the autopsy report that Michael had SLE. That would involve entire organ systems and he wouldn not have been 50 years old without somedegenration of his heart, liver or kidneys and all of these were found to be normal healthy tissue found in an adult male. He had a couple of colon polyps and an enlarged prostate gland just like every other 50 year old Black American Male.For whatever reason those are the demographics of an enlarged prostate and colon polyos. It might be dietary or environment or genetic no one knows.
    Michael had DLE. Discoid Lupus effects the skin.

    Like

  304. August 22, 2011 3:59 pm

    But then murray´s specialty seems to be weak pulses and iv solutions. He did have a bloodpressure meter, found in the closet. Demerol, or as it was called here Pethidine is no longer in use.But I remember when it was used in general anaesthesia and for kidney or gallbadder stones,very painful attacks.

    Like

  305. August 22, 2011 3:25 pm

    VMJ, forgot to mention;there was also mild swelling of the brain. Don´t know why, but ,makes me think of overhydration.That is why the weights are important.I do know that murray had not ordred that much saline solutions.Then those are easy to get anywhere, nobody gets addicted to them!In modern medicine if the dehydration is not that grave you should give oral electrolyte drinks. Anyway weighing your patient and at least having a clue how much liquid he needs in a must, and he had no lab. that could have been useful in many ways.

    Like

  306. August 22, 2011 3:13 pm

    VMJ,the masses were rather smsll 0.7 cm- 0.5 cm and were next to the pleura.The pleura envelopes the lungs and lobes, if you get a puncture the lung collapses.Also scars on lungs were mentioned. Pathologist offered no diagnosis, but these findings fit lupus.The bronciolitis was not caused by any infection.The histiolytic desqamation and the eosinophiles most likely related to systemic lupus.There was also pulmonary congestion and lungs subcrepitant.This I don´t know what it could be, usually found in cardiac insufficiency (which Michael did not have),maybe occured perimortem, about time of death or he was over hydrated It is because of this last fact I have wanted verified weight
    prior to death and last hydration. AND HIS WEIGHT AT AUTOPSY BEFORE ANY ORGANS WERE REMOVED. The first autopsy result gave wight 136 lb.Then some people have said he was 108 lb during rehearsals.Did murray overhydrate him?That can be lifethraetening.Murray as far as I know did not even weigh him.And not check lung capacity;the most easy thing to do.
    .

    Like

  307. August 22, 2011 2:28 pm

    We also learn from Klein that Demerol has its effect for 48 hours after it is administered as it is metabolizes slowly. So if Michael was given Demerol for his cosmetic procedures the drug would still be working on him for two days. It probably wouldn’t tell on his behavior or probably would (and this is why some people say he was a little ‘disoriented’):

    KLEIN: And also it’s active in the body over forty-eight hours, it’s about forty-eight hours it remains in the body so it takes a long time for the body to metabolise.

    Though Klein says that Michael WAS an addict he makes it a point that he WASN”T addicted to narcotic drugs. This discrepancy shouldn’t confuse us in the least – Michael could not sleep and was dependent on Propofol, but he wasn’t dependent on narcotics and most probably didn’t take any – even Demerol to which he was addicted at some moment of his life. Klein is experienced in drugs (he wrote a book about heroin addicts) and says he never noticed in Michael any “withdrawal symptoms” which are typical of narcotic drugs.

    Below is this seeming discrepancy in Klein’s words which is actually not a discrepancy at all. Everything depends on what you call a “drug” – any prescription medicine is a “drug” but not every drug is a narcotic! As to simple drugs every 50-year old has a whole shelf of them (at least in my country):

    1) KLEIN: I think there’s a whole host of drug addicts but I think that he was, yes, a drug addict.

    2) KLEIN: I don’t know if he was addicted because I never saw withdrawal symptoms whatsoever from narcotics, ever, and narcotics have set withdrawal symptoms. So if I would have saw addiction to narcotics, which is what I was using, he wasn’t addicted to narcotics.

    HE WASN’T ADDICTED TO NARCOTICS – this is what’s most important! And no one has the right to call Michael names – especially if these idiots don’t know the first thing about him and simply repeat the nasty lies of screamy tabloids.

    Like

  308. August 22, 2011 1:49 pm

    Guys, our reader BG has provided me with the transcript of Klein’s 96min. conversation with Harvey Levin. It is an AWESOME gift numbering 46 pages and I don’t know how to express my deepest gratitude for it except promising that I will try to put this transcript to a good use.

    BG, A VERY BIG THANK YOU AND FROM THE VERY BOTTOM OF MY HEART TOO!

    I am currently reading it and this is what Klein said about the need to give Michael Demerol while making cosmetic procedures on his face. It seems that Demerol was indeed a must as doing these procedures without a painkiller (even if the patient agreed to it) is impossible – a patient involuntarily squirms hindering the doctor during his treatment:

    Klein : I think we met in 1984.

    Levin …and you saw that he was a drug addict during periods of his life yet you prescribed Demerol numerous times…

    Klein I never prescribed Demerol.

    Levin You administered.

    Klein I administered Demerol because you have to understand that the procedures I do are painful injections and I would give him…I would say I would take an hour-and-a-half to inject him and I would do somewhere around… oh, well over a hundred facial injections on him and unless I sedated him… He was very, believe it or not, needle-phobic when you got to needles on his face, and I mean, did you ever have injections in your face?

    Levin Not really.

    Klein Okay. It’s really a painful procedure, so, I mean, you had to stop him from squirming. You had to go to his eyes. The scalp injections were very, very painful, which I had to do because also I had to reduce a great deal of scarring on him. So what I used drugs for, it was not to give him drugs. I mean, I used drugs to relieve the pain when I did a procedure. So we have to make a big difference. If you’re having a surgical procedure, and these are really minor surgical procedures, with my length of time it takes for me to do it, it’s not minor, you have to use some amount of drug but when you look at how much I used, it’s not anything compared to the amount that some other doctors give. I didn’t give him bags of it to take home as some doctors do.

    Levin But repeated dosage of Demerol over a period of time.

    Klein Yeah, but you have to take the total dose of Demerol that I used over the period of time I used it on him and it was not an immense dose because we went down finally.

    Like

  309. August 22, 2011 12:26 am

    “Pulmonary pathology:there were several masses, relat. small( but probably what Michael had referred to as “blisters on my lungs.”) Base of L lower lobe-3 masses,L upper lobe 1,base of L upper lobe 1 mass.Widespread bronchio-alveolar histiolytic infiltration &patchy histiolytic desquamation.Depletion of structural, functual reserves of lung capacity.”

    Kaarin, since the majority of us don’t understand anything of what you’ve written above my question will be simple to you – is it anything like the symptoms of lupus desribed in this lupus bulletin below?

    The Lungs and Pulmonary System

    Inflammation caused by lupus may affect the lungs in many ways, and can involve the membrane lining of the lungs, the lungs themselves, the blood vessels within the lungs, land the diaphragm.

    Pleuritis

    The most common way that lupus can affect your lungs is through inflammation of the pleura, the lining that covers the outside of the lungs. The symptom of pleuritis that you may experience is severe, often sharp, stabbing pain in a specific area or areas of your chest. The pain, which is called pleurisy, is made worse when you take a deep breath, cough, sneeze, or laugh. You may also experience shortness of breath. Sometimes an abnormal amount of fluid will build up in the space between your lungs and your chest wall; when it leaks out it is called a pleural effusion. Pain from pleurisy, with or without effusions, is found in 40 to 60 percent of people with lupus.

    Pneumonitis

    The term for inflammation within the lung tissue is pneumonitis. The symptoms of pneumonitis that you may experience are fever, chest pain, shortness of breath, and cough. An infection caused by bacteria, virus, or fungi is the most common cause of pneumonitis.

    Chronic Diffuse Interstitial Lung Disease

    When inflammation in the lungs is chronic, it can cause scarring. This scar tissue can prevent oxygen from moving easily from your lungs into your blood and may cause diffuse (widespread) interstitial lung disease. The symptoms that you may experience include a chronic dry cough, chest pain, and difficulty breathing during physical activity.

    Pulmonary Emboli

    Blood clots that block the arteries leading to the lungs are called pulmonary emboli. These blood clots will cause chest pain and shortness of breath, but can also lead to a decrease in oxygen flow in your lungs. You are at increased risk for pulmonary emboli if you have antiphospholipid antibodies, vascular damage, and/or an inactive lifestyle.

    http://www.lupus.org/webmodules/webarticlesnet/templates/new_learnaffects.aspx?articleid=2301&zoneid=526

    Like

  310. August 22, 2011 12:09 am

    ” Its amazing all the health problems he had.. and still he wanted to give us all his best.. despite surely sometimes not feeling well . I posted a link to this article in my own wordpresss blog.. as I want to keep spreading the word…”

    Giselamj, thank you and please go on spreading the word of truth about Michael. If we don’t do it for him no one else will.
    It is the job and even duty of every honest person on this planet.

    Like

  311. August 20, 2011 8:53 pm

    I happened to find what I wrote down on 7/19 2009,a forensic consult; Pulmonary pathology:there were several masses, relat. small( but probably what Michael had referred to as “blisters on my lungs.”) Base of L lower lobe-3 masses,L upper lobe 1,base of L upper lobe 1 mass.Widespread bronchio-alveolar histiolytic infiltration &patchy histiolytic desquamation.Depletion of structural, functual reserves of lung capacity.-These did not play a role in cause of death,but shame on murray, any clinician should know about things like this.But not grossly negligent murray.

    Like

  312. August 20, 2011 8:00 pm

    VMJ : thanks a LOT for this complete and deep study about Michael’s health condition.. Its amazing all the health problems he had.. and still he wanted to give us all his best.. despite surely sometimes not feeling well . he never stoped to smile…
    I just wish more people could read all this .. maybe… maybe.. they will now understand many things about him..as people was blinded by the media ….
    I posted a link to this article in my own wordpresss blog.. as I want to keep spreading the word…
    Hope you are doing good .. and THANK you for all the interesting information you share here .. and so well documented..
    Best regards from Venezuela
    Gisela

    Like

  313. August 20, 2011 5:59 pm

    @vmj The long Klein interview took place on November 5, 2009, so I agree chronology is important. Like you, I find it hard to believe that Levin appears not to know the descriptions didn’t match. Klein’s effort to explain that was sensationalized and headlined at some point but the story he used for an explanation wasn’t a big deal to him – he accepted Michael’s reasons for it and those reasons make perfect sense. But to some sections of ‘the media’ sensationalism is more important than putting things in perspective or context, which is why a ‘big deal’ was made of it. Headlines without context can be shocking – it’s a ploy that’s used all the time, and generally a headline is what most people remember. That people like Levin, who must be aware of details yet are only interested in passing on a headline, is a real problem – not for them because that’s how they make their money, but it’s a problem for us because we’re not being told a whole story. It’s the same with the ‘drug addiction’ theory – another headline that needs to be put into perspective and that’s why Klein’s interview is interesting and also why this discussion (and this site) is important – it is shedding a heck of a lot more light. It is not fair or correct to headline ‘ drug addiction’ and disregard or discount the fact that Michael had very real health issues which needed managing, and people like Dr Drew, for example, would do more good if they followed your example and spoke publicly about the problems and available assistance for such things as lupus and vitiligo.

    Like

  314. August 19, 2011 9:32 pm

    Try to find out on TMZ; The Riot Act.There are 2 iffrent dates for this 18/6 and 20/6 2009. They were awful to Michael. Murray was rude and condescending.No good will there.

    Like

  315. August 19, 2011 9:23 pm

    I don´t think the doses Klein gave were as big as those addicts need.
    Still in every use of a drug that can cause addiction there is a psychological component. As far as I know all the Demerol was given in Kleins office abd under his supervision.

    Like

  316. August 19, 2011 9:09 pm

    As I described in a post below in the past it was common to use Demerol as one, 1, ingredient in the iv solution for general anaesthesia .You cannot use Demerol alone for anaesthesia, the amount would have to be dangerously high and in hign doses it also supreses breathing.
    When you have to do really fine, i.e. small area work it is not advisable to inject a local anaesthetic into the site as it will cause some swelling,i.e. the volume does that. Another thing is you can do nerve blockade with a local anaesthetic. I really don´t know if that can be done when operating on the face, I would guess not.

    Like

  317. August 19, 2011 8:54 pm

    Klein is not guilty of malpractice if he gave small amounts of Demerol for sedation (not anaesthesia) and as a painkiller.
    Murray did everything wrong, has tried to make Klein guilty too, unsuccessfully.What murray did can be compared to somebody playing with fire in their house,perhaps trying out fireworks and all goes without incident until one day the curtains catch fire and the house burns down.
    Lloyds wanted all medical info on Michael. Murray´s notes starting from 2006. Also other medical info, which has not been sent to them on time. This request was made to AEG and included all medical info and I think history as well.
    I now understand that AEG is suing the insurer. The isnsurer just has to not pay out anything.They have the gall to sue Lloyds of London.That is why I think the outcome of the trial will be: ACCIDENT.
    The judge, prosecution, choice of witnesses will see to that.

    Like

  318. August 19, 2011 7:18 pm

    “vmj, no not guilty of malpractice.But the insurer had asked for all info an medical notes from murray ever since 2006”

    Kaarin, are you talking about Murray or Klein? I was wondering whether Klein was guilty of malpractice for giving Michael Demerol anesthesia during those cosmetic procedures. If he did everything according to standard medical practice (which I assume he did or otherwise he would be sitting on the court bench too) and there was no danger of Michael developing a new addiction for Demerol, then Randy Phillips did not have the right to demand that Michael should stop seeing him and be attended by Murray only.

    And since Phillips demanded it, it means that he did something which was far beyond the scope of his business. The end result is that he forced Michael into being monitored by one doctor only and this doctor was directly answerable to Randy Phillips. You can draw your own conclusions from that.

    Like

  319. August 19, 2011 3:59 pm

    vmj, no not guilty of malpractice.But the insurer had asked for all info an medical notes from murray ever since 2006.Michael was not in the US 2006, yes, he reutned 12/23 2006. And ofcourse murray has no notes unless he has now manufactured ones post treatment.During the last week of 2006 Michael also attended a funeral.And murray is blatantly lying about 2006.As about much else.
    I suspect that somehow the court in concert with prosecution, chosen witnesses etc. will turn the out come to ACCIDENT:.This depite the fact that murray had poured gallons of propofol over 2 months.And acted with the grossest negligence imaginable.

    Like

  320. August 19, 2011 12:45 pm

    “It makes sense to use demerol as sedative and painkiller for minor cosmetic surgery.”

    Kaarin, the question is – can Arnold Klein be found fault with for giving Michael Demerol during that minor cosmetic surgery? And how is it different from what the plastic surgeon did to him after the burn on his head? He also gave him Demerol to dull the pain from stretching his skin on the bald spot and this eventually resulted in Michael’s addiction, right?

    Or is it the matter of a dosage only? The dosage for the burn scar must have been huge as it was meant to last the whole day and Michael evidently had to take those pills round the clock – while in case of Klein it could indeed be minimal to last only during the minor surgery itself. Klein said he never gave Michael any drugs which could be taken home.

    All of us receive minimal dosages of some drugs when we go through painful medical procedures but none get addicted because of that. So I am really wondering whether the scar-removal Klein was doing to Michael’s face could (or couldn’t) be detrimental to him in terms of a possible addiction. And whether all that talk from Randy Phillips does (or doesn’t) have some grounds for it.

    Essentially the question about Klein is a question about Randy Phillips – was Phillips right in making Michael stop seeing Klein or was it none of his business as the cosmetic procedures were not doing harm to Michael and were only improving his looks (and this was a necessity)?

    When you listen to Klein’s interview it seems that giving Michael Demerol as a short-term anesthesia was a usual, standard and universally accepted medical procedure. He charged $60 for each “IM injection” which doesn’t sound to me like a huge dose.

    P.S.
    I’ve learned about those IM injections from the TMZ information spread in the usual scandalous style: http://www.tmz.com/2009/10/28/michael-jackson-affection-for-injection/

    They claim that I.M.injections stand for Demerol and when Harvey Levin asked Klein about them (in that 96min interview) Klein didn’t refute the point, so we can assume that he was indeed giving Michael Demerol for medical procedures. But he kept saying that small dosages of Demerol were needed as anesthesia for de-scarring Michael’s skin:

    KLEIN: He had really severe acne scarring and he had lost all the volume from his cheeks, so he had these very big shadows on his cheek, and sure I filled lots of acne scars but I also filled lupus scars. I also filled the scars around his nose. I also filled the scars around his scalp from having discoid lupus. So am I going to start talking about discoid lupus scars in a record like this that it’s going to…liable end up in someone else’s hands? No. So I called all scars acne scars because they’re scars.”

    He talks about it in detail with Harvey Levin and in his interview with Larry King mentions it only in passing:

    KING: “Well, what — what about pain killing medications? Did you prescribe any?
    KLEIN: I mean I’ve some sedatives for, you know, when he had surgical procedures that were immense (ph), because, don’t forget, he had a lot of — he had the burn — the serious burn when he was burnt on the Pepsi commercial and the severe hair loss when he, you know, contracted lupus, also.
    So when you have to fix all these areas, you have to sedate him a little bit. But if you took all the pills I had given him in the last year at once, it wouldn’t do anything to you”.
    ….
    KING: “Now, you helped him rebuild it
    [his nose]?
    KLEIN: I rebuilt it, yes.
    KING: How?
    KLEIN: Using fillers. I used Rezulin*
    [Restylane?]. I used hydronic acids because — and they worked very well. And it’s not — it’s an arduous procedure, because you don’t want to put too much in. And you have to do it exactly, so you can flow the material so it’s perfectly smooth.
    So we rebuilt them. And I’m telling you that he was beginning to look like the nose was normal again. And that’s all I wanted — and regain the breathing, you know, passages of his nose, because there was a total collapse of the cartilage.
    KING: In the last photos that we’ve seen, his nose has been built up, right? He’s looking better?
    KLEIN: Yes.
    KING: Was he still working at that?
    KLEIN: No, because I think we got to the point where he was very happy with the way he looked and he filled in the cheeks a little bit and did a lot of little things.
    But I mean what I do to an individual patient is what I do. And what I do is just restoration work, because I don’t think people should look, again, like anything has been altered.
    KING: Well, you’re — you’re not a plastic surgeon.
    KLEIN: No, but…
    KING: So are you extending yourself when you’re doing a nose like that?
    KLEIN: No, I invented all this. I mean it’s — I’m not a — I invented injectable esthetics, I mean, for better or for worse, it’s what I’ve been doing since 1979. So I’m not extending myself whatsoever. But if you ask a plastic surgeon, he’ll say he invented everything, including the wheel”.

    *Note: Reaulin could be a mistake in the transcript – it is an anti-diabetic and anti-inflammatory drug which is no longer sold in the US due to its grave side-effects for liver. And Restalyne is indeed a cosmetic filler:

    “Restalyne is the latest filler, a synthetic hyaluronic acid gel which is injected into the skin in tiny amounts with a very fine needle. A similar product has been injected into the joints of osteoarthritis patients. Restalyne is a natural substance, so theoretically there should be minimal or no allergic reaction.
    However, since patients with lupus have increased levels of hyaluronic acid, or mucin (a characteristic of inflamed skin), we are proceeding carefully in treating such patients with Restalyne. So far in our practice we have treated six people with extremely low amounts of Restalyne to monitor their responses”. http://www.lupus.org/webmodules/webarticlesnet/templates/new_magazineexperts.aspx?articleid=3351&zoneid=554

    Like

  321. August 19, 2011 11:58 am

    “I think of this photo whenever I read that Michael wanted to be white. Here he is getting makeup for Thriller – his most successful short film, the makeup being removed is darker than what is underneath!” http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=333076&l=43b7de1baa&id=100001581051452

    Karen, the photo is great! I always thought that Michael was an unnatural color on Thriller. Now I see why.

    Like

  322. August 19, 2011 9:15 am

    In my Facebook album I have this photo with these comments that I think is relevant to this topic:

    “I think of this photo whenever I read that Michael wanted to be white. Here he is getting makeup for Thriller – his most successful short film, the makeup being removed is darker than what is underneath!”

    I think maybe some people have trouble believing the vitiligo because Michael didn’t complain enough about it. That is so short sighted on their part. 1. Why cry publicly about something you can’t do all that much about? 2. Imagine if he had complained…How would America deal with that? A black man daring to complain about becoming white! Those people should really think about things – Michael handled it at best he could.

    Some people just don’t try hard enough to put themselves in some one else’s shoes.

    Like

  323. Alison permalink
    August 19, 2011 1:13 am

    In relation to his fingers and what does look like arthritis, i also wondered after seeing some pics of the palm side of his hands eg i think it was pics from the 02 announcements in London, if he had had some surgery or even joint replacements in some of his fingers. some joints as i remember there seemed to be a very definite white scar or something along the crease line of the joints – not all but some. if he did this must have been because he was getting a lot of pain in the joints. however the autopsy didn’t say anything about prosthetic finger joints.
    i think tho that he always did have biggish joints in his fingers, but they could always have been inflamed maybe? having said that i thought his fingers seemed longer when he was younger.

    i also think that in footage of late 90’s onwards the way he claps has changed, it became much gentler and more just using his palms as opposed to his whole hands, it gives the impression his hands are painful. is that my imagination?

    also – if lupus affects healing, perhaps this was one reason the spider bite got so bad and looked as if it wasn’t healing??

    Like

  324. August 19, 2011 12:01 am

    “It makes sense to use demerol as sedative and painkiller for minor cosmetic surgery.”

    Kaarin, then it explains why Michael went to Klein’s office so often – Klein was rebuilding his face and was giving him sedation while working on his scars. BG quoted Klein’s interview:

    “He had really severe acne scarring and he had lost all the volume from his cheeks, so he had these very big shadows on his cheek, and sure I filled lots of acne scars but I also filled lupus scars. I also filled the scars around his nose. I also filled the scars around his scalp from having discoid lupus. So am I going to start talking about discoid lupus scars in a record like this that it’s going to…liable end up in someone else’s hands? No. So I called all scars acne scars because they’re scars.”

    And if the procedures were painful and Michael was given sedation on a daily basis it explains why he sometimes looked “odd” to fans who accompanied him everywhere. It is like having your teeth pulled out every day and leaving the office half-dazed with the painkiller they gave you.

    And again it is Randy Phillips who makes me angry in this situation. It was his claim that Klein’s druggingMichael which was the reason why they wanted another doctor for Michael. On the other hand I don’t know whether we can believe Klein when he says that the dosage he gave Michael was minimal and not dangerous (considering his previous addiction to Demerol).

    What is clear though is that Michael had a good reason for having that painkiller – it was not just for fun that Klein administered it to him. However it is up to doctors to decide whether Klein’s treatment was correct and whether the choice of Demerol was the right one.

    This is where the word “tolerance” should be mentioned – people who are given drugs on a regular basis require a bigger dosage to have the same effect. It doesn’t mean that they are addicted to it (as they don’t ask for it and can live without it) but when the drug is being used for them, the old dosage no longer works and doctors have to increase it. It is the first step to making a person an addict.

    Like

  325. August 18, 2011 11:29 pm

    “Both Dr. Klein and Harvey Levin are Jewish. They don’t have foreskin. Dr.Klein had never seen Michael’s genitalia because well, Michael’s concern with the vitiligo did not extend any further than the parts of his body that were always uncovered i.e his face and hands.”

    Lynette, since many Americans (not only of Jewish origin) are circumcised this ignorance seems to be common for most of them. They simply don’t know the difference and cannot imagine that it can be a crucial matter here.

    But in Harvey Levin’s case I am surprised he doesn’t know because he has access to all sources of information and should have learned the truth long ago (and should have spread it instead of spreading lies). And Klein seems to be of a very high opinion about Michael anyway and doesn’t go into any details about who said what and why. He just seemed to believe Levin’s word that there was a match and started speculating “how the boy could have seen it”. He simply doesn’t know that the boy never saw it and there is a lot of proof of it! Just like many others he believed in that “match” myth and was trying to find a plausible explanation for it.

    Someone should tell him that there was no match and no need to find any justifications for Michael (even if Michael did have to pee in a cup to avoid going to a public bathroom). If I remember it right in an interview with Barbara Walters Michael said that paparazzi went as far as taking pictures of him even when he was using a toilet. He said something like – imagine you standing there and suddenly hearing clicks of a camera going from somewhere beneath you. Imagine the horror of it.

    So peeing in a cup might have indeed been a better alternative for him in some cases.

    Like

  326. August 18, 2011 11:22 pm

    VMJ, you asked if demerol is used for anaesthesia.I think nowadays propofol is prefered. When used right it can even be given to babies.
    In the past Demerol has been used for anaesthesia combined with sodium amythal and a muscle relaxant iv.The pt will need artificial breathing as result of the muscle relaxant.Giving Demerol only is good for painful proceedures and is sedating.It makes sense to use demerol as sedative and painkiller for minor cosmetic surgery.

    Like

  327. August 18, 2011 11:11 pm

    “Unfortunately for Michael the truth is he needed medication. The media doesn’t appear to want to delve into this side of things, they only want to sensationalize, which, of course, Murray’s defense is immensely grateful for I’m sure”.

    Yes, the truth is that Michael’s lupus alone needed constant monitoring and medical interventions. Considering how tricky the disease is it constantly baffles the doctors and what worked yesterday doesn’t work today. And every day for lupus patients is a battle. Here is an example:

    “As you all know, Michael suffered in silence with Lupus for over two decades. It was one of the contributing factors to his skin problems and was the reason for his gradual finger joint deformation… It was why he had to constantly be sheltered from the sun by a huge parasol… It was one of the reasons why he often wore a face mask when traveling… It was also a big reason for his continual pain.

    Lupus is an auto-immune disorder where the body attacks itself and/or causes a disruption in the body’s ability to fight off infection and other disease. It is very painful, causing inflammation of the joints, skin, and other organs, and the sun is often a contributing factor to worsening of conditions.

    A friend of mine was diagnosed with Lupus when she was in high school in the ’70s and almost died. She went to the Mayo Clinic and thankfully, was saved. Treatment involved lifelong consumption of daily cortisone and anti-inflammatory drugs and pain killers, which, in themselves, cause OTHER health problems… Two decades later, she almost died from a blister on her heel from wearing new shoes! The blister got infected and she almost had to have her leg amputated! After three weeks in intensive care, with the aid of intense medication and skin grafts, her body finally “re-booted” itself regarding the infection-fighting, but then she developed water in the lungs instead. Again, she almost died.

    These kinds of things happen to Lupus sufferers all their lives… The simplest things we take for granted as nothing, like a blister on your foot, can become life-threatening for someone with Lupus.

    While therapies have improved somewhat over the years, people with Lupus continue to be in a lot of pain most of their lives… and there is still no cure”.
    http://www.michaeljackson.com/us/node/1114048

    Like

  328. August 18, 2011 11:10 pm

    Alison,I have not forgotten your question re possible Raynaud´s on your post Aug.15 at 3.09am.I have looked at some pics where Michaels fingers show.I think he has some degree of arthritis in some finger joints. This is common with age,but not yet at 50. Most likely it is part of lupus in his case.The whiteness a likely result of lighting when the photo was taken, and the slight swelling a result of the arthritis.

    Like

  329. August 18, 2011 10:54 pm

    But when it comes to medical issues, because he was Michael’s doctor for many years, he does have firsthand knowledge in that regard and as he said himself, he’s not ‘just a dermatologist’. The interview covers a variety of issues but the questions posed always brings the subject back to ‘drugs’, which seems to be what the media prefers to discuss, albeit with it’s own particular spin. But to be fair, the questions put to him are questions we all might ask. Whether or not Dr Klein should be discussing Michael’s health issues or not is debatable but I believe there are reasons why he did, not the least of which might be his attempt to combat the idea that Michael took all the medications under the sun just for the hell of it.

    BG, in fact Klein repeatedly said that Michael NEVER asked him for any narcotics. The only drugs he got from Klein was the shots received in the office while he was filling his scars. Levin asked him about those 51 IM injections (possibly of Demerol?) which Klein supposedly gave to Michael in the three months before Michael’s death.

    But Klein said that all the procedures he was making on his face were very painful and needed sedation, and the doses he was giving Michael were minimal so that even their cumulative effect was not that big. He openly admits he was giving Michael Demerol – but as a form of anesthesia.

    This I don’t get and we will need to look into – is Demerol really used as an anesthetic? And wasn’t it dangerous to give it to Michael knowing that there was a time when he had an addiction to it? Or is Demerol not a big thing as a drug and the media is just exaggerating it? The article I’ve found about Demerol does say that it was extremely popular as a prescription pain-killer among doctors “in the 20th century”.

    Like

  330. Suzy permalink
    August 18, 2011 10:50 pm

    As far as I remember Klein was there when Michael was strip searched, however I doubt he knows anything about what was in Jordan’s description. So he is simply being suggestible here.

    Also, I have to say Klein generally seems to me very erratic, inconsistent and someone who is not 100% right in his mind.

    Like

  331. lynande51 permalink
    August 18, 2011 10:39 pm

    I can answer the question about their lack of knowldge about the description. Both Dr. Klein and Harvey Levin are Jewish. They don’t have foreskin. Dr.Klein had never seen Michael’s genitalia because well, Michael’s concern with the vitiligo did not extend any further than the parts of his body that were always uncovered i.e his face and hands.

    Like

  332. August 18, 2011 10:28 pm

    “There isn’t a direct link to the Dr Klein intv on TMZ. You have to go to the site, click on videos, wait till they load and then type Klein in the video search bar. There are quite a few videos of Dr Klein. The long interview has usually been the third one along on the top row (it’s about an hour and 45 minutes). Because I was interested I transcribed it [just for myself – I’m aware of copyright issues 🙂 ], so I’ve listened to it a lot and I’m glad I did.”

    BG, I’ve finally found that long Klein’s interview you’ve spoken about but understood no more than 80% of it because Klein’s speech is too difficult for me. YOU’VE TRANSCRIBED IT? THE WHOLE OF IT? Will it be too much of me to ask you to send it to us via mail or probably post it in the comments?

    The interview is extremely interesting but should be placed in the right chronology – do you happen to know when it took place?

    There are so many questions to ask about it and so many answers there too! So if you can send me the text I’ll be very grateful indeed. If you want we could make a joint post about it. And what does copyright has to do with it? Is putting down on paper what they broadcast on TV a violation? (I really don’t know, so please explain if you happen to know).

    Harvey Levin (is it the right name?) seemed to be asking reasonable questions and even seemed a nice guy to me. The only thing that surprised me is that he doesn’t know that Jordan’s description was totally inaccurate. It is impossible to believe that he could be that ignorant of the subject – so what is it? A superlative form of hypocrisy or what?

    On the other hand Klein doesn’t seem to know either that the description was wrong and made somewhat awkward moves to justify Michael by saying that he liked peeing in cups (and someone could have seen his genitalia that way). It is clear that he meant well but his statement was immediately picked up by the media and turned it into something awful.

    While watching the interview you can practically see nasty sensations in the making. You snatch one phrase out of the context and publish it with a leading comment and the rest of the damage takes care of itself.

    I would say that the interview is a good educational material. Very interesting.

    Like

  333. August 18, 2011 1:51 pm

    On VMJ,Hi sunny, re hairloss in lupus and psoriasis.I don´t know your name but read about your problems.Again, I think you should go along with what is best for your systemic illnesses .That will make you feel better in general. Ofcourse it it does not feel so good with bald spots.
    As I mentioned before the orhtodox jewish women had gorgeous wigs. Almost felt like converting!

    Like

  334. August 18, 2011 12:16 am

    On VMJ`s post there was someone complainimng on hairgrowth (under hi sunny)You need to know that Metrohexate is used in cancer as a cytostatic and also in severe rhemuatoid arthritis.In cancers the dose is high and causes hairloss. There is something relat effective for hair loss:Finasterin.AS you also have lupus and psoriasis you heve to discuss these matters with your physician.Some meds that are good for the lupus in general but cause hairloss as side effect may still be a good idea, and just go ahead with a wig. In NYC there were othodox jews and females had to cover theit hair.They used gorgeous wigs.

    Like

  335. Renee permalink
    August 17, 2011 8:02 pm

    This is excellent, investigative writing. Gratitude for what you are doing for MJ here at this site.

    It is the people who must defend the truth about Michael Jackson, as your subtitle correctly notes. We can’t allow history to remember this most incredible, courageous, talented and humane of men through the filter of lies. The record MUST be set straight by humanity. Sending appreciation your way for being dedicated to that mission.

    Like

  336. August 17, 2011 9:08 am

    @ vmj This relates to your last comment about people suffering from scalp lesions and hair loss. It’s from the Klein interview with Levin:

    “He had really severe acne scarring and he had lost all the volume from his cheeks, so he had these very big shadows on his cheek, and sure I filled lots of acne scars but I also filled lupus scars. I also filled the scars around his nose. I also filled the scars around his scalp from having discoid lupus. So am I going to start talking about discoid lupus scars in a record like this that it’s going to…liable end up in someone else’s hands? No. So I called all scars acne scars because they’re scars.”

    Like

  337. Taro Nuss permalink
    August 17, 2011 5:06 am

    One thing you didn’t mention about Michael’s appearance around the This Is It rehearsals is that if his face changed at all it was because he had lost so much weight. Even a few pounds will change a person’s features. If you imagine the face filled out, it looked exactly as before. He was in amazingly good shape right up to the end. He took good care of himself. The difference between his body structure and that of his brothers is quite noticeable. Unlike them, he refused to put on weight and watched what he put in his body. When they were part of the Jackson Five, all of them had awesome shapes, but the other brothers allowed themselves to get chunky. Not only did he continue to work out with his dancing, but he was mostly a vegetarian. A strict vegetarian has much less body fat than a meat- and dairy-eater.

    Like

  338. August 17, 2011 2:07 am

    I have read about all the awful,painful and in the end useless things they did to his scalp.The different ways they tried to stretch the healthy skin on the scalp to finally cover the scar or most of it.I just get a headache reading about it.

    Like

  339. August 17, 2011 1:21 am

    ” this discussion is very important because the truth is in the details and the truth is Michael did have health issues, serious ones, which needed addressing”. Unfortunately for Michael the truth is he needed medication. The media doesn’t appear to want to delve into this side of things”.

    BG, yes indeed, the media don’t want to talk about the reason for the various medications Michael had to take and are not saying that ALL lupus patients have to take tons of various medicine. It is a matter of survival for them. And painkillers are part of them too.

    “It would also be interesting to touch on the effect of stress on lupus and vice versa because I understand they are directly related.”

    OF COURSE! All lupus patients say one and the same thing – stress is a killing factor for them. We should naturally look into that.

    To give everyone some idea about how lupus patients feel, how much medicine they have to take here and how difficult it is to diagnose lupus (one of them went for 8 months without a diagnosis) here is some correspondence from their forum:

    * * * * *
    “Hi Guys

    I have read quite a few posts about hair loss and Lupus, however as I am still experiencing hair loss and my Rhemy appointment isn’t until another month I thought I would pick you brain, Or at least try calm my stress until then.

    Under the docs orders I have upped my Predniscilone to 10mg daily I take Aizathiprine and started taking Plaq 5 weeks ago to try and calm down this hair loss which I have not experienced so severe in the last 5 years of SLE diagnosis.

    I have about 5 bold patches not small at all however with regrowth coming through. The only thing is I am still loosing hair in other places even tho there is new hair forming. My scalp is itchy and tender. Anybody experience the same thing? Also how long does it take for the meds to kick in and calm it all down in your personal experiences.

    I am getting tired of seeing hair everywhere. Scared to comb it or wash it. I am contemplating hair extentions but think it may be too much pressure of the scalp, I also contemplating a wig but worried it will look to obvious and unflattering.

    Is 5 weeks too short to expect the hair loss to stop?

    Any advice/input?
    Oh I also have a Lupus speacialist Dermatologist appointment too in March…..

    * * * * *
    A: I expereinced alopecia about 8 years ago lost a third of my hair. I was trying to find a good wig when my hair started to grow back (no meds). Since then I would get a small spot from time to time – learn to live with it (losing one eyebrow was weired). But two years ago I was in a car accident and I lost a lot of hair at the nape of my neck and had sever headaches and other joint issues. Eighteen months of suffering a new doctor found the lupus. Have been on med 8 months – hair comes and goes on the nape of my neck.

    I know that this does not help much. I have keep checking out the most recent inovations in wigs and have chosen the type I like. Somedays I wish I had one of those wigs so that I would not worry about the grey.

    * * * * *
    01-26-2009, 07:58 PM
    A: Ok, so I already wear hats all the time when I go outside, but it hasn’t been to hide my head. But now my hair is coming out in fistfuls. It’s all over the house. And the doctor says yes, I may lose it all. I’m headed to a new rheumy in March, but by then I’ll be showing big spots of scalp. And no guarantees he’ll have anything for it.

    Any suggestions, beyond scarfs, hats and lots of hairspray? Are there products that will slow down the rate of loss or maybe help my poor head??

    Sunny
    (and I am NOT one who has a great looking head structure)

    * * * * *
    Hi Sunny

    My hair has also come out…..BIG TIME, so I can totally understand the fear, frustration and pain you are going through. I have had episodes of painfully slow regrowth only for it to come out again/break off as my hair is so brittle in places. It’s an absolute nightmare.

    I am getting through this phase (three long years now) by wearing lots of headbands (thank goodness they’re in fashion!). Previously I used coloured thickening sprays, ie. Mane/Good Looking Hair which gave me a bit of confidence once I got the hang of using them.

    Before my recent diagnosis of cutaneous lupus/psoriasis I tried every lotion, potion and pill to try and get my hair to come back but nothing really worked. I’m due to start Methotrexate and I’m hoping it will have some effect but I am wondering whether things have gone on too long now having been misdiagnosed and fobbed off for years. If this is the case I will probably look into semi permanent hair pieces/weaves…..if celebrities can wear them so can I! Have you though about this option?

    Regain (mainly used for AGA hair loss) is a nightmare because it requires continual application…..once you stop hair will begin to thin again. It doesn’t really fix the problem….not sure if it is really suitable for lupus hair loss anyway. The only thing that did seem to stabilise things a bit for me was Nizoral shampoo and also taking supplements as my ferritin level was low, ie. 11, when my hair started to fall. Ideally it needs to be about 70 for you to maintain your hair/have regrowth so it might be prudent to get this checked.

    Anyway, I hope things get better for you soon and that you find a solution suitable for you.
    http://www.thelupussite.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-73208.html

    * * * * *

    Michael was initially diagnosed with discoid lupus. This is a form of the disease which leaves scars by all means:

    – Discoid lupus is a type of lupus that tends to be confined to the skin and other organs in the body are not involved. Discoid lupus occurs in patches across the body. These patches tend to be well defined, thickened and scaly, they are slightly red in colour and can itch. The appearance can vary between people and also on different areas of the body on the same person. As the patches heal they tend to leave scars and on darker skins the pigment in the skin can be lost leaving white areas. If discoid lupus occurs on the scalp the hair will be lost as the patches heal leaving permanent bald areas.

    – There is a strong relationship between lupus and hair loss. About 50 percent of lupus patients experience hair loss. Many times, hair loss is one of the first symptoms that people who have lupus notice.

    – The second type of hair loss associated with lupus is hair loss that results from discoid skin lesions that occur on the scalp. Approximately 20 percent of lupus patients experience discoid skin lesions, which are round, raised, and scaly lesions that can appear all over the body.

    Discoid skin lesions can cause significant scarring, and when they form on the scalp, they can cause cicatricial alopecia or alopecia areata. Cicatricial alopecia and alopecia areata are permanent hair loss conditions that result from damage or injury to hair follicles. When discoid skin lesions develop on the scalp, they destroy the hair follicles, which results in spot-specific hair loss. This leads to permanent hair loss in the affected scalp area.

    http://www.uklupus.co.uk/fact8.html

    Like

  340. August 16, 2011 11:26 pm

    “There is a huge amount of information here. Information that can be used to answer the continual stream of nonsense that will now emerge as we enter trial proper.”

    Deborah, yes, the information is huge but even despite this, it is only an outline of Michael’s health issues. Now this outline needs to be provided with more substance, so there is still a lot to do here.

    I will probably post a few more things about how lupus patients feel – because healthy people are unable to understand what it’s like to be ill with this horrible disease. Once people learn about it they will (probably) realize that lupus patients should stay on medication every minute of their lives. And they have tons of prescription drugs in their homes – tons of them! – and not the very few Michael had.

    Like

  341. August 16, 2011 10:57 pm

    “Excellent post, Helena! I will spread it.”

    Susanne, thank you – please do! I’ll add a couple of things to it though (now that my computer is working).

    “I also tend to believe that Michael’s suffering from vitiligo must have a deeper meaning. Why he of all people – he who embraced all races – he whose “job” was to unite all races – seems to have gone through a metamorphosis of all races? For everybody who is open to believe in higher missions: This must be some kind of a lesson to the world. And yes, his strength came from God. It’s so obvious”.

    Both these points are obvious to lots of people – his strength did come from God and he was meant to be a lesson to the world! It is indeed so obvious that only the blind don’t see it.

    Like

  342. August 15, 2011 5:41 pm

    Alison,I could not find that pic. or clip.Also big parts of blogs were blotted out on my computer. I had a touch of Raynaud´s syndrome myself in my teens and early 20.ies, my father also had it. It would be difficult to judge from a picture if it not a very close one. I never heard Michael complaining of anything like that though.

    Like

  343. Susanne permalink*
    August 15, 2011 4:56 pm

    Excellent post, Helena! I will spread it.
    @ BG: I also tend to believe that Michael’s suffering from vitiligo must have a deeper meaning. Why he of all people – he who embraced all races – he whose “job” was to unite all races – seems to have gone through a metamorphosis of all races?
    For everybody who is open to believe in higher missions: This must be some kind of a lesson to the world.
    And yes, his strength came from God. It’s so obvious.

    Like

  344. August 15, 2011 1:55 pm

    Huge thanks to VMJ for such a wonderfully researched post. Far from being a distraction, an understanding of the facts behind the still prevalent misconceptions about Michael’s conditions and surgeries is vital.

    There is a huge amount of information here. Information that can be used to answer the continual stream of nonsense that will now emerge as we enter trial proper.

    Like

  345. August 15, 2011 1:33 pm

    @Helena There isn’t a direct link to the Dr Klein intv on TMZ. You have to go to the site, click on videos, wait till they load and then type Klein in the video search bar. There are quite a few videos of Dr Klein. The long interview has usually been the third one along on the top row (it’s about an hour and 45 minutes). Because I was interested I transcribed it [just for myself – I’m aware of copyright issues 🙂 ], so I’ve listened to it a lot and I’m glad I did.

    Dr Klein is a very controversial subject among fans – he hasn’t always come across well in interviews – sometimes he’s difficult to understand and sometimes it’s hard to know exactly where he’s coming from. He has said some things which are definitely questionable and he does seem to like promoting himself along the way. The media also loves to highlight any controversy associated with him if it concerns Michael Jackson. But when it comes to medical issues, because he was Michael’s doctor for many years, he does have firsthand knowledge in that regard and as he said himself, he’s not ‘just a dermatologist’. The interview covers a variety of issues but the questions posed always brings the subject back to ‘drugs’, which seems to be what the media prefers to discuss, albeit with it’s own particular spin. But to be fair, the questions put to him are questions we all might ask. Whether or not Dr Klein should be discussing Michael’s health issues or not is debatable but I believe there are reasons why he did, not the least of which might be his attempt to combat the idea that Michael took all the medications under the sun just for the hell of it.

    Dr Klein covers the subject of drugs at length, some things are not pleasant and may not always be what we want to hear but some may be important to this discussion. Your article and this discussion is very important because the truth is in the details and the truth is Michael did have health issues, serious ones, which needed addressing. Michael was not the sort of person to say, “Woe is me” or discuss his private health concerns in great detail with the media or the general population, nor should he have had to. He told people what they were (e.g. Oprah) – that he wasn’t believed or that his word was not accepted by some can again be put down to the media’s constant misinformation from questionable sources, if they even had sources. Unfortunately for Michael the truth is he needed medication. The media doesn’t appear to want to delve into this side of things, they only want to sensationalize, which, of course, Murray’s defense is immensely grateful for I’m sure.

    Thanks again for the article and for all the comments.

    PS: It would also be interesting to touch on the effect of stress on lupus and vice versa because I understand they are directly related.

    Like

  346. Patricia permalink
    August 15, 2011 1:29 pm

    Can I speak with you personally? I have some questions.

    Like

  347. Alison permalink
    August 15, 2011 3:09 am

    on the 2nd of the posts on Reflections of the Dance site,from sunday, way down, maybe half way down, the picture of Michael coming away from court with his hand on his chest – the hand does look swollen and i’m not sure if its my eyes or the light but are his fingers more white – could this be raynaud’s do you think kaarin?

    Like

  348. August 15, 2011 1:07 am

    Michael was right! Just read on a scientific medical post that”Indoor Tanning is an Addictive Behaviour” and causes brain activity similar to people who are addicted to drugs or alcohol.It was on Addiction Biology. Ultra Violet Radiation in moderation is good for you as it creates vitamin D.

    Like

  349. August 14, 2011 10:41 pm

    The fact that Michael had his face touched up in preparation for the
    concerts is an argument agaist the suicide theory put forward by the defence.

    Like

  350. Alison permalink
    August 14, 2011 10:13 pm

    Hey, I just saw something i never saw before. youtube, its a video uploaded by Larry Nimmer on 2nd Aug this year about a Conrad Murray hearing some time ago. Katherine has just come out of court and is speaking to people, she’s wearing blue. her side profile! I see Michael’s profile in her profile – AFTER his plastic surgery! have a look!

    Like

  351. monica permalink
    August 14, 2011 7:19 pm

    “And everything is indeed okay for them until someone tells them that they killed a live human being while enjoying themselves.”

    @helena1247 it’s just heartbreaking:(

    Like

  352. August 14, 2011 6:58 pm

    “I think one of the videos talks about how Mike would have cortisone (I think that’s it?) injected into his skin to try and help make his nose actually look more full”

    @Rockforeveron, this is what Klein said to Larry King about that filler:

    KING: “Now, you helped him rebuild it?
    KLEIN: I rebuilt it, yes.
    KING: How?
    KLEIN: Using fillers. I used Rezulin. I used hydronic acids because — and they worked very well. And it’s not — it’s an arduous procedure, because you don’t want to put too much in. And you have to do it exactly, so you can flow the material so it’s perfectly smooth.
    So we rebuilt them. And I’m telling you that he was beginning to look like the nose was normal again. And that’s all I wanted — and regain the breathing, you know, passages of his nose, because there was a total collapse of the cartilage”.

    As far as I understand it hydronic acids are used by doctors for getting lupus patients rid of their scars. Here is an answer of one of the doctors as to when and under what conditions they can recommend these cosmetic procedures for lupus patients. We see how extremely careful they should be when handling these patients:

    Q: “Is treatment with lasers, collagen, Restalyne, thermage okay for people with either cutaneous or systemic lupus?

    A: With the recent attention on plastic surgery and other cosmetic procedures, more people-including those with lupus – are questioning the safety of various skin treatments. Some may be considering dermatologic interventions for disease-related reasons, including side effects from lupus treatment (such as stretch marks) or from lupus itself (such as scars from discoid lupus).

    However, a distinction should be made between reconstructive or reparative treatments for damaged skin and purely cosmetic procedures. Lupus patients in remission who are left with permanent scarring may be treated the same way as a person who has been in a car accident or in a fire. Certainly we are cautious with these treatments, because any technique that manipulates the skin could reactivate the lupus.

    There are a number of criteria we establish before considering a person with lupus for these types of skin treatments. First, the person’s lupus must be in full remission. Also, his or her rheumatologist and dermatologist must agree with the planned treatment”.

    [I am afraid that Michael’s plastic surgeon was at war with his dermatologist instead of working together with him]

    “In the last three to four years laser treatments have been particularly helpful in reducing the blood vessels caused by the lupus malar, or “butterfly,” rash. Again, all patients considered for laser treatment are pre-screened as outlined above. We also make sure any drugs they are taking will not significantly delay healing.

    Stretch marks are a very troublesome problem subsequent to steroid treatment. No one technology works as well as we would like.

    The latest filler is Restalyne, a synthetic hyaluronic acid gel which is injected into the skin in tiny amounts with a very fine needle. A similar product has been injected into the joints of osteoarthritis patients. Restalyne is a natural substance, so theoretically there should be minimal or no allergic reaction.

    However, since patients with lupus have increased levels of hyaluronic acid, or mucin (a characteristic of inflamed skin), we are proceeding carefully in treating such patients with Restalyne. So far in our practice we have treated six people with extremely low amounts of Restalyne to monitor their responses”.

    http://www.lupus.org/webmodules/webarticlesnet/templates/new_magazineexperts.aspx?articleid=3351&zoneid=554

    SEE HOW EXTREMELY CAREFUL DOCTORS SHOULD BE WHEN IT COMES TO LUPUS PATIENTS?

    Like

  353. August 14, 2011 6:39 pm

    Okonuga made a good point.Now Dr.Klein is a witness
    for the defence.He has much to offer the prosecution if he be allowed to
    give Michaels medical history.

    Like

  354. August 14, 2011 6:27 pm

    “When Mike had the malar rash in 1983 and 1986 you can see in 1986 is when his skin colour and face shape changes – his face looks bloated and his skin on his face is lighter, the steroids for lupus often depigment the skin. Then in 2002 you can also see that he had the “moon face” that Prednisone is known to give so it would seem he likely had a relapse then.”

    @Rockforeveron, thank you for the details. I saw your post about Michael’s lupus – it is splendid.

    Like

  355. August 14, 2011 6:21 pm

    “i wanted it to be a 2 sided sheet only or people won’t read it and i’m already on 12 sides and i’m only just starting on the arvizos!!”

    @Alison, I know how it is and am also guilty of long posts. Unfortunately there is no way to make them shorter as lies are quick to tell and run, while dirt takes long to clean. Unless you provide a hundred arguments against their lies everyone will brush the truth off as our “crazy fanaticism”.

    This is totally unfair for course but cannot be helped. You can divide your article into several parts if it is really too long. If you are sure that referenced material won’t disappear in the future you can save up on that, but I personally prefer to keep everything in one post, as we’ve noticed a tendency for really good evidence to suddenly vanish.

    So please don’t be surprised if some documents are provided here in full. It is a precautionary measure.

    Like

  356. August 14, 2011 5:17 pm

    – “it was just easier and more salacious to believe the sh*t than seek truth and feel compassion for this lovely man, who, to them seemed weird. They need to reflect inwardly to learn why they so strongly needed to believe the sh*t”.

    @Monica, the way the public behaved towards Michael reminds me of those party-goers who get terribly drunk and wake up in the morning with a awful hang-over. They don’t remember what extremes they went to the previous night and when they are told they don’t believe it.

    Now they are a little bit shy to look into each other faces and to brace themselves say to each other: “Everything was okay, guys, we’ve had a little fun and now it is time to be normal again”.

    And everything is indeed okay for them until someone tells them that they killed a live human being while enjoying themselves.

    Like

  357. Alison permalink
    August 14, 2011 4:55 pm

    OK, thanks.

    since you are online, I am here working – still – on that leaflet i mentioned ages ago. i will send it you when its nearer completion for your comments and approval, as i am mentioning your site heavily. But i wanted it to be a 2 sided sheet only or people won’t read it and it would be expensive to print otherwise – i’m already on 12 sides and i’m only just starting on the arvizos!!
    i will just continue what i am doing then start cutting it down and laying it out as a 2 sided and folded A4 sheet (i don’t know how to do that yet tho!). it will have to be brief notes only as there is too much to fully explain things, and then with lots of references to the site for people to come and read more. i want it to be ready way before the trial starts so i can distribute it out well. maybe others will want to print and put it out too? maybe, if its any good that is!

    Like

  358. August 14, 2011 4:49 pm

    – “Michael also had fatigue, painful joints, a lack of energy/fatigue and possibly some fluid issues as sometimes hands looked swolen (even his ankles looked swollen in the “spider bite” photos).

    @Gigi, yes, it seems that Michael had much more symptoms out of the SLE lupus factors than I enumerated. Fatigue and painful joints are at least two more which should be added. Only I am no doctor and didn’t want to act on their behalf. But even the few symptoms listed made his condition awful.

    When I said I had more material on lupus I meant lots of evidence from people suffering from it which made me realize what a nightmare it is. See, for example, what the sun can do to lupus patients. The majority of us think that it will result in some rash and that’s it – no, it can lead to a patient’s death!

    “Exposure to excessive ultraviolet light can cause lupus skin lesions to appear, or make existing lupus skin lesions worse. Ultraviolet light can also activate the internal, or systemic, manifestations of lupus in some people. There have been many examples of lupus skin disease patients who were thought to have psoriasis instead, and were then treated for psoriasis in medical phototherapy cabinets that are similar to tanning beds. A number of these people almost died from severe activation of their systemic lupus following such mistaken treatment”.

    I also learned that once lupus is diagnosed it NEVER goes away.
    Only some 6% of patients may have achieved that goal (which wasn’t Michael’s case as his condition was aggravated by vitiligo too). And this means that he suffered from lupus till the end of his life. See this question and answer to it:

    Q. “Does lupus always eventually go into remission?
    A: The simple answer is no.
    The more complex answer is that, for the majority of patients, the disease is characterized by periods of flares (i.e., active disease) and periods where things are relatively quiescent (i.e., inactive disease). In the latter situation, quiescence is usually achieved with medication.

    Remission may be harder to define. One definition is that there are no symptoms, the patient is taking no medications, and all tests — including the antinuclear antibodies — become normal. In my study published 20 years ago, fewer than 6 percent of patients achieved that goal”.

    http://www.lupus.org/webmodules/webarticlesnet/templates/new_communityexperts.aspx?articleid=604&zoneid=96

    Like

  359. August 14, 2011 4:24 pm

    Alison, you don’t have to explain it! I know what you meant and also wanted to say something close to your idea – the operations were not always successful and had to be redone and corrected. The picture I referred to is different from what you spoke of but also shows some defect in the work of plastic surgeons.

    And if you couple it with the need to get rid of all that scarring due to lupus, once the first nasal job was done (which was a necessity) it was a never-ending road.

    Like

  360. Alison permalink
    August 14, 2011 3:49 pm

    @Helena “If I had posted everything I found in connection with lupus here this post would have been three times as long. Had to trim it at the expense of some very valuable material.”

    Helena, I wasn’t criticising your post, which is an excellent one as I said, i was just adding something else i had observed to back up your points. My whole comment was agreeing with you.

    but just to clarify what i said about his nose, I wasn’t referring to any kind of swelling on the tip, i was referring to the fact that the cartilage bit underneath from the inner edge of the nostrils that joins from nose to face, i don’t know what its called, wasn’t completely symmetrical during the Bad era. It is visible on most close up pictures of him, eg Bad concert photos, at that time and was clearly corrected by the time of the Dangerous Era. its hardly noticeable really and it doesn’t detract from his beauty and is nothing anyone need or would bother to mock about or attribute anything sinister to, it just shows the doctor who did it wasn’t that good and it would be a reason for having it corrected just like your information says they would do.
    I was just, again, corroborating your points because I thought this was about setting the record straight about his surgery – that he had less than the media wants to believe and the reasons for much of it were not the reasons they want people to think.

    Like

  361. August 14, 2011 3:32 pm

    I’m aware of something else that Dr Klein has said about Michael and narcotics (pain killers), including Demerol, which is a little contrary to what he is quoted as saying to Larry King. Dr Klein, in that long interview with Harvey Levin, attempted to describe the difference between tolerance and addiction. He said: He wasn’t addicted to narcotics.

    @BG, it would be very interesting to see that interview. Now the overall picture is more or less clear we can finally go into details. Could you post here a link to that interview with Levin so that we could analyze it?

    “destiny” is one word that comes to mind”.

    The amount of all those misfortunes brought on Michael’s poor head and the intensity of hatred poured on him are unprecedented. And the fortitude with which he fought it is unrivalled too. It is a phenomenon in the world history which has very few precedents in the past. So I don’t believe it to be a mere incident – his life is meant to teach us something really big.

    “This was not a weak person. Humble yes, but weak, never.”

    Absolutely. His life shows us what real strength is. Strength is definitely not in the muscles or bullying – it is in the spirit of the man.
    William Wagener said he heard the Holy Spirit opening to him that Michael was His, belonged to Him and told him to go to his church and declare to everyone that Michael would be acquitted on all counts. I have great respect for Wagener that he obeyed – it was heroic stuff in those days. Only two or three people clapped their hands in reply to his revelation, one of whom was his wife. And several days later the verdict was indeed Not guilty on all counts. Amazing, isn’t it?

    Like

  362. Maria permalink
    August 14, 2011 2:29 pm

    Michael’s illness has become for many an excuse to ridicule and jokes. He suffered in silence. People do not believe in his illness. Maybe something changed Muray process. It can be debated health Michael. This could finally open people’s eyes. Michael talked about his illness in the music video Thriller. Lupus- wolf in Latin. Michael turns into a werewolf there. His most famous conversion in the video turned out to be true in reality. That he does not itself change. This illness has changed him.

    Like

  363. August 14, 2011 2:02 pm

    “You are right when you say that if he had confirmed the condition earlier the paparazzi would have been falling over themselves trying to get photos of “the freak”. i never thought of it that way i wished he had said more about it before but yes, it would have been worse for him if he had.”

    @Alison, all of us wish he had said about it earlier as this is what simple logic suggests (if applied to ordinary people). But considering the media attitude to Michael it was hard to expect that if he had told his secret they would have suddenly sympathized with his condition.

    Most probably no one would have believed him – so it would have been a series of TV interviews with ‘medical experts’, public opinion polls whether it is true or not, a hunt for his medical records, even a demand to see him without his makeup to prove his words. “Let him prove it if he wants us to believe it!” – would have been the demand of each and everyone.

    I think that Michael’s problem was not actually his alone – it was the problem of the public at large. They didn’t look upon him as a human being but as everyone’s toy which they allowed themselves dressing, undressing and turning inside out in full view of others.

    Even if he wanted to share his secret with the public he most probably couldn’t even find a proper moment to do it as every new day brought him a new lie. He waited for the lies to subside one day but it only grew worse with each coming day.

    “You also mentioned that corrective surgery may often be done if the tip of the nose is not symmetrical – Michael’s wasn’t during the Bad era, you can see in pictures it was slightly over on one side.”

    Yes, I have photos of Michael having some kind of swelling closer to the tip of the nose but didn’t post them here as I don’t want them to be advertized.

    “On the list of the lupus symptoms it lists mouth and nose sores – on many pictures over the years he had an area of his lower lip, that looks to me like a recurrent or continous sore”.

    You are right. There are numerous photos of him with that spot on his lower lip. If I had posted everything I found in connection with lupus here this post would have been three times as long. Had to trim it at the expense of some very valuable material.

    Like

  364. August 14, 2011 1:31 pm

    Guys, I have problems with my computer (as usual) but so will write here as helena1247 for a couple of days.

    Like

  365. August 14, 2011 4:00 am

    Also Dr Richard Strick says Michael had the reconstructive nose jobs due to lupus damage – Michael had the second nose job in 1983, the same time as the first discoid lupus flare up. Discoid lupus or lupus in general can compromise skin healing so this seems consistent with how post that second operation the healing happened badly and he needed more work on it.

    I think one of the videos talks about how Mike would have cortisone (I think that’s it?) injected into his skin to try and help make his nose actually look more full, I think one of the side effects of that is that it thins the skin and so in the end makes the nose/skin look smaller/ages his skin…

    Like

  366. August 14, 2011 3:54 am

    Karen Faye was the one who said he weighed 108 because that was the weight she’d seen him post autopsy after certain things had been removed/done to the body.

    Michael had a pneumothorax in 1977 and later found this was related to pleurisy which is directly linked to lupus, he told Quincy he had “blisters” in his lungs, and that was confirmed in the autopsy report.

    When Mike had the malar rash in 1983 and 1986 you can see in 1986 is when his skin colour and face shape changes – his face looks bloated and his skin on his face is lighter, the steroids for lupus often depigment the skin. Then in 2002 you can also see that he had the “moon face” that Prednisone is known to give so it would seem he likely had a relapse then. Also Prednisone is known to alter moods and make some people anxious/almost manic, which might possibly explain some decisions he made in 2002 – the Blanket incident, letting himself get involved with Bashir at all.

    Like

  367. August 14, 2011 3:15 am

    GIGI, I agree with your observations. You can look up on the autopsy report, page 12 on some pathology listed there.Some how,maybe my memory is tricking me, but before there was mentioning of some densities on the lungs, but when I checked today nothing like that was noted.And there were certain cells, erythrocytes seen in allergy and auto immune diseases.So SLE of some degree could be possible.The coroner did not give any clinical dg`s for these findings.They apparently did not play a role in his death.The report is on The Smoking Gun.
    Before his weight was give:136 lb.This has puzzled me as there are statements of weight 108lb prior to death.Of course murray never bothered to weigh him, did he overhydrate him?

    Like

  368. monica permalink
    August 14, 2011 2:46 am

    The look on Michael’s face says so much as Diane Sawyer questions his appearance; yes vmj poor baby…I hope she educates herself someday and feels horrible for that (and whatever else she said/did). A long time ago I liked her…hag.

    Also, thanks for including the photos side by side to illustrate how much his appearance remained the same. I see it clearly without the photos because I remember his looks well from the different times in life, but I think it is something many people (haters) need to see since they need help visualizing. Hopefully, some may stumble upon these images and this post.

    One more thing this post brings up for me is that over the years non-supporters and the like have been zealous in pathologizing Michael’s behaviors/traits, yet when it comes to true medical conditions of which he deserved help, support, treatment and compassion…they didn’t seem to jump in with their so-called logic (labeling everything). It seems to me their predetermined opinions and the need to maintain them over ruled real logic and medical fact. Basically, it was just easier and more salacious to believe the sh*t than seek truth and feel compassion for this lovely man, who, to them seemed weird. This to me simply screams that there was/is fear associated with these people and that they need to reflect inwardly to learn why they so strongly needed to believe the sh*t.

    Again, thank you vmj

    Like

  369. August 14, 2011 2:08 am

    “Michael’s Love Lives forever.”

    June, thank you so much for your great words of love and support. I never really know what to say when people thank me. Probably because I take it as a sort of duty to tell the truth about Michael and I feel greatly honored by this sudden and incredible chance to be able to speak up for him.

    Whenever I remember who we are defending here I get awestruck that fate has chosen us to speak for Michael Jackson.

    I truly believe that all people who support Michael shouldn’t in any way feel shy about it. No matter what the others say, no matter what looks they give us, no matter how they shrug their shoulders we should remember that it is a great honor to be speaking up for Michael. A GREAT HONOR. I very much feel that way and want to pass this feeling over to my readers.

    Thank you again, June. I feel very much your warmth and would like to send you mine. It is totally amazing what bond Michael is establishing between people though they are very far away from each other. Totally amazing. This is probably why he came to this life at all – to bring all of us together.

    Like

  370. August 14, 2011 1:30 am

    “He had an amazing inner strength and I don’t care what anyone says that type of strength comes from no other place, but God.”

    Gigi, I fully agree – only from God. Only from God.

    Like

  371. August 14, 2011 1:25 am

    I hope to comment more later but, did you mention his lungs and the possibility of his lung damage being from SLE? His lungs had scar tissue and that is can easily be from auto-immune problems. I am not a doctor but just looking at MJ’s rash it looked more like the rash seen with SLE than the rash seen with discoid lupus. He also was on prednisone, at times 60 mg a day (though he did not always take it like he should have). That is a huge dose. Michael also had fatigue, painful joints, a lack of energy/fatigue and possibly some fluid issues as sometimes hands looked swolen (even his ankles looked swollen in the “spider bite” photos). People with SLE should be careful with the sun, too. I see discoid as being an only-skin lupus while SLE can affect everything, inside and out.

    MJ was taking pain medications and said he developed a dependence to them at the same time he was having the scalp surgeries that Nordahl described (maybe you covered this, I cannot see well on my netbook). Someone can become physically dependent on these types of medications in as little as a week. I do not think people realize such. He was also medications for his tooth days prior to going to London.

    Like

  372. Okunuga permalink
    August 13, 2011 8:05 pm

    VMJ,maybe you can send this info to the prosecutions in this case especially if the defence calls Arnold klien so that most if not all of MJ’s medical problems can finally be heard by the public since the trial will be televised so that we can kill two birds with one stone i.e VINDICATE MJ and finally put to rest all the myths surrounding MJ’s health issues just like Debbie Rowe in 2005.

    Like

  373. August 13, 2011 6:27 pm

    It makes sense that Michael wanted his face touched up for the upcoming
    concerts.As Karen Faye has said, it is not enough to make somebody look good,more important is to make them feel good about themselves.

    Like

  374. August 13, 2011 6:16 pm

    Thank you VMJ for this in depth article re Michaels medical history.
    Althogh I know it, it made me cringe in pain just reading through it,
    all this that Michael had to suffer and deal with.Not to mention various interviewers,DS,OW & others with their intrusive, offensive questioning.Just wonder how they would have reacted had they been subjected to this kind of insensitive questioning on TV.
    While in the US I was lucky to have a most qualified and highly regarded teacher who told her students that the very rich usually get the worst medical treatment.She was born in Hollywood and initially started on a career in films, but then switched.

    Like

  375. August 13, 2011 6:10 pm

    @vmj This is a stunner of a post. As you’ve pointed out, there have been various bits and pieces over the years, which have attempted to explain the health issues Michael had to deal with (to a non-accepting public), including one or two of Michael’s own admissions, but this is the fullest, the most well-researched and by far the best article I’ve ever read on the subject of Michael’s lupus and vitiligo. It’s excellent.

    This is no criticism of anything you’ve written, but I’m aware of something else that Dr Klein has said about Michael and narcotics (pain killers), including Demerol, which is a little contrary to what he is quoted as saying to Larry King. Dr Klein, in that long interview with Harvey Levin, attempted to describe the difference between tolerance and addiction. I think he actually gave up in the end but not before saying:

    “I don’t know if he was addicted because I never saw withdrawal symptoms whatsoever from narcotics, ever, and narcotics have set withdrawal symptoms. So if I would have saw (sic) addiction to narcotics, which is what I was using, he wasn’t addicted to narcotics.”

    Just wanted to mention that briefly, because I felt it was important. But on to other things…

    It is mind-boggling to me that he, being who he was and what his ‘job’ was, suffered from vitiligo. I won’t go into that any further, except to say that “destiny” is one word that comes to mind.

    But the most astounding thing of all is how Michael dealt with some of these problems, turning them into the most amazing positives, incorporating them into his performance and ‘the Michael Jackson phenomenon’.

    To know that he experienced the health issues he did, to know that he needed relief from the symptoms these issues caused, to know that he valued his privacy and kept these these things largely from the general public, and yet to also know how he ‘magically’ turned them into an advantage in order to entertain and amaze us with his brilliance is awe-inspiring and inspirational (and any other superlative you could think of). This was not a weak person. Humble yes, but weak, never.

    Those media detractors, or whoever, could not, in a million years hold a candle to Michael Jackson, and I think this is what sticks in their collective throat. I’d like to hold this article up to them, force them to read and understand just how terrible their accusations were and are.

    There are others on this site but this article demonstrates the meaning of ‘vindication’. Thanks vmj.

    Like

  376. Alison permalink
    August 13, 2011 1:44 pm

    Fabulous post Helena. Thank you.

    The media are crazy to talk of skin replacement! skin is a vital organ in its own right, you couldn’t take it off without killing him.! and if you could, who’s would you stick on instead??!! Hands up who would like to be skinned and die to give someone else your skin because he fancies being a different colour??!! Even for Michael –NO THANKS!
    not that mine would fit him anyway.
    like you say, they grow small sections but it takes ages and needs to be attached to a good blood supply the whole time.

    Michael is supposed to have refused his brothers permission to video the Victory Tour concerts but then video’d it himself – i suspect he may have wanted to control what images of his vitiligo were being put out, because to be sure it was bad by then and he would know the make up would run and come off with sweat and reveal it more.
    You are right when you say that if he had confirmed the condition earlier the paparazzi would have been falling over themselves trying to get photos of “the freak”. i never thought of it that way
    i wished he had said more about it before but yes, it would have been worse for him if he had.

    His nose – his family surely knew he was battling with vitiligo, Joe said it started on him at an early age, as can be seen on his fingers on pictures of him as a boy, how COULD they have teased him for his nose! thats just cruel. anyway Marlon’s nose was bigger!
    You also mentioned that corrective surgery may often be done if the tip of the nose is not symmetrical – Michael’s wasn’t during the Bad era, you can see in pictures it was slightly over on one side. Just like anybody, when you keep seeing something thats not straight i expect he wanted to straighten it, how much more when its your own nose you keep seeing in the mirror. theres nothing weird about that its natural and i would class it as a subsidiary corrective procedure for the previous operation rather than a separate surgery as such.

    Lupus – additionally, on the leg pictures of the spider bites, he has swollen ankles, including on the ‘non – bite’ leg.

    On the list of the lupus symptoms it lists mouth and nose sores – on many pictures over the years he had an area of his lower lip, on the right of the picture as you look at it and about a third in, that looks to me like a recurrent or continous sore area that stops the lipstick from forming an even line. i’ve had that sometimes if i’ve had a sore area or a spot or something. MJ’s is always in the same place.

    Also with burns the skin can keep contracting for years and can be very painful as it pulls in and it can need regular treatment. on joint areas, especially the hands the contractures can be so strong they pull the joints closer together and need to be regularly released. On black skin for some inherent reason scarring can be much more difficult to treat than on white skin, its a different type of scar that forms and can be very tight, harder in texture, and more difficult to treat.

    He was amazing to keep going, performing to his best and continually giving to others, with all he had against him.

    Like

  377. Lou permalink
    August 13, 2011 1:20 pm

    Michael’s mum could do with reading this article.

    Like

  378. shelly permalink
    August 13, 2011 11:17 am

    @suzy,

    Thank you it’s Dr Wallace Goodstein.

    Like

  379. Charles permalink
    August 13, 2011 10:12 am

    Once again the haters set the agenda for this site, and once again, another FAIL.

    🙂

    Like

  380. Suzy permalink
    August 13, 2011 7:46 am

    @ Shelly

    This is from Hoefflin’s Wikipedia page:

    “Allegations of professional misconduct

    In 1997, Hoefflin was accused of unprofessional conduct towards celebrity clients by four former colleagues. It was alleged that Hoefflin pulled the blanket off of a woman while she was unconscious on the operating table, and “spread and lifted her legs in a vulgar manner.” Hoefflin’s colleagues also claimed that Hoefflin once disrobed a male client, and upon exposing the patient’s genitals, stated, “you know, he has never used it.”[4]

    Additionally, it was alleged that Hoefflin tricked Michael Jackson into believing he had received a nose job by putting Jackson under anaesthetic, and then fast-forwarding the clocks.[5] It was also claimed that upon Elizabeth Taylor arriving for a face-lift, Hoefflin stripped her naked and described her as “the old stuff”.[5]

    Hoefflin has asserted that the charges were made by two doctors who were renting office space at his Santa Monica, California office — Dr. James Hurvitz – and Dr. Wallace Goodstein whom Hoefflin claimed were addicted to prescription drugs.[4][6] Hoefflin filed a lawsuit for $20 million dollars against the two doctors for defamation.[7] According to Hoefflin, in August 2001, the four former employees who originally made the allegations issued apology letters to Hoefflin and paid a cash settlement.[8]”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Hoefflin

    Like

  381. August 13, 2011 6:47 am

    Awesome post Helena! I wish more of the public would familiarize themselves with this information behind the diseases MJ suffered from. And you are absolutely right. All those people that make fun of all that MJ had to go through would be the same ones crying like a baby if they had to go through what MJ went through. Those people wouldn’t dare make fun of anyone else that may suffer from an illness out of their control, but when it comes to MJ its always a hypocritical double-standard. MJ was a lot stronger than people give him credit for. He had an amazing inner strength and I don’t care what anyone says that type of strength comes from no other place, but God.