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The Documented Evidence of MICHAEL JACKSON’S LAST ALBUM

December 11, 2012

To see the true worth of things it always helps to look back into the past and see the events with a fresh eye of today. It can teach us great lessons.

To my big surprise the talk we had about Ireland made me recall the events already long forgotten but seen in a different light – now that we know what Michael did in Ireland and how he felt among the Irish people.

This post will be an attempt to restore some of those past events and reevaluate them with the knowledge we have now. Hopefully it will help some people to look at themselves from afar and stop the insanity towards Michael Jackson which is still going on, and even with a renewed force considering the fact of recent release of Sullivan’s book.

THE INSANITY OF HATRED

You will understand what I am talking of if we look together at some articles published in the press at the time when Michael Jackson was staying in Ireland. While Michael Jackson was living there a simple life of a countryman, the insane and unkind of the rest of the world went on spreading about him the usual crazy stories. One of such stories was a fictional report in Ireland’s Daily Mirror, invented out of nothing with the sole idea to raise the sales of the paper at the expense of their victim.

The newspaper said that Michael Jackson was creating a leprechauns theme park in Ireland. This news was reproduced by some Celebuzz  site which amazed me by its incredibly insulting and arrogant attitude both to Michael and his hosts in Ireland – they used expressions like “insane idea” and hints at the Irish who “drink enough” to believe the insanity, and all of it ended in “gross generalizations about other cultures”.

If the people who wrote it knew that their remarks would later become reason for us to do exactly the same – I mean, make “gross generalizations about other cultures” –  they would have probably checked themselves and thought about the consequences of it. The most harm they are doing this way is to themselves first and foremost.

Their comments are indeed an eye-opening experience for other “cultures” reading their ugly responses – the arrogance and conceit of these people are incredible, and their silly but superior attitude towards others is amazing and laughable. Looking at all this one can’t help recalling sayings like “He laughs best who laughs last”.

Michael Jackson goes out of his mind Lucky Charms style

September 21st, 2006 // 127 Comments

According to Ireland’s Daily Mirror, Michael Jackson has been looking into buying an estate on the Emerald Isle, and is supposedly interested in opening up a – wait for it – leprechaun-inspired theme park.

“Michael is deadly serious about this idea,” a source told Ireland’s Daily Mirror. “He loves the whole idea of leprechauns and the magic and myths of Ireland. It would cost around 500 million Euros [about $635 million] to do. He’s always wanted to open his own theme park and he thinks Ireland is the perfect place and it will all be built around the leprechaun theme.” The cash-strapped singer reportedly is meeting with businessmen to raise money for the park. There are regular sightings of the reclusive singer in Ireland, and one newspaper there has set up a Wacko Watch Hotline for readers to phone in sightings.

Because if America won’t accept your insane ideas why not just ship ‘em over to Ireland? There they at least drink enough the idea might work. And here? Well here we just make gross generalizations about other cultures.

http://www.thesuperficial.com/michael_jackson_goes_out_of_hi-09-2006

This was followed by a good deal of responses – only the most decent of them were selected as samples of the commentators’s wit and intellect:

  • He’s way too creepy for the States..
  • So no he’s targeting drunken Irish children, I guess he figures he’ll get lucky
  • No way can he ruin that beautiful country-kick his ass out Ireland……
  • Leave Ireland alone, you freak!!
  • To the people of Ireland: Tell your young male children to hide their “Blarney stones”
  • His next big idea is to have a theme park in Atlantic City with the theme being casinos, the beach and the boardwalk, because it’s not like we don’t have the real things right IN Atlantic City. We need a theme park about it for people to experience these things. I can’t wait till he dies.
  •  “one newspaper there has set up a Wacko Watch Hotline for readers to phone in sightings.” Now THAT is funny. I wouldn’t be surprised if that “man” turned into a monkey. I mean more so than he already is. “Freak” is such an understatement, I just punched myself in the face for using that in reference to MJ. Please excuse all the Brit-Twit air-quotes, but in some cases, they simply must be used.
  • Wait….what happened to Dubai? Whatever. Look, the news must be really slow crossing the pond – he molests children guys! It’s ok to be mean to him. He is not the one gloved wonder anymore, much to all of our disappointment.   http://www.thesuperficial.com/michael_jackson_goes_out_of_hi-09-2006

It is okay to be mean to him? So this is what it is? The media and prosecutors whistled to the public their okay to hunt down an already mortally wounded human being, and the public readily goes for its victim as a medieval mob going after a so-called witch? Never mind that a year ago the man was fully acquitted after five long months of a thorough examination in court – they know better than the court…

Some superficial site told their superficial audience that Michael is not even a human being and they trash him like a “freak’ and “monkey” throwing the Irish people into the bucket too? And after all that these readers think themselves to be civilized citizens?

First these brainless were fed some nonsense by a gossip tabloid which even Sullivan says was pure fiction. However the brainless are used to believing tabloid papers and this is why they swallowed the lie hook, line and sinker same as they swallowed all other lies about Jackson for decades before that.

And then they do a totally inexcusable thing – they call Michael a molester despite his full acquittal in court. I suspect that these people never really looked into the trial details, never tried to think for themselves and never heard about “innocent until proven guilty” principle – their lazy minds simply pass judgment on things they have no idea of…

No, it is not okay to be mean to Michael Jackson. In fact it isn’t okay to be mean to anyone at all – there are many reasons for that, and one of the simplest is that one day all this nastiness will backfire and the mean and the brainless will turn into the laughing stock themselves as those who look at them from aside will be amazed by their ignorance, laziness and superficiality.

HOW COME MICHAEL’S CHILDREN SEEM NORMAL?

Almost a year after Michael left Ireland, in April 2007 the People magazine caught sight of Michael celebrating Paris’s birthday in Las Vegas and made a report exclaiming in half-belief that Michael’s children look “normal” after all. Such an attitude would be hilarious if only it didn’t reflect the seriousness of the world’s denial of the truth about Jackson. The People magazine article was at least beginning to doubt the system of lies the media first created about Michael Jackson and then fell victim to it themselves.

Their story is dated April 2007 –  four months after Michael’s arrival from Ireland on December 23, 2006. The magazine said that Michael was only getting ready to settle back in the country. Technically they may be right – it was the time Michael was indeed wandering about the US looking for a place to live in. Those who spoke to him privately, Jack Wishna for example, said that he would never return to Neverland – Michael could not even think of sleeping in that house again.

“In Ireland, when I spoke to Michael, I said, ‘Come back and go back to Neverland.'” And Jackson said, “I never, never, never want to go back to Neverland. Never.”

“My thought is if someone buries him in Neverland he will come up out of the ground like inThriller and strangle them,” Wishna said, referring to rumors that Jackson’s family is still considering a bid to inter Jackson on the grounds of his once-beloved ranch.

“I tried to get rid of Neverland for him. He would never set foot back on Neverland. He never wanted to go there, never wanted to sleep there— never, never.”

http://uk.eonline.com/news/133691/it-s-going-to-be-a-disaster-associate-says-jackson-was-too-weak-for-major-comeback

Michael Jackson is celebrating  Paris's birthday in Las Vegas. People Magazine, April 2007

Michael Jackson is celebrating Paris’s birthday in Las Vegas. April 2007

The People magazine made a picture of Michael with Paris on the day of her birthday in April 2007 and though the magazine says that “some sources” believe Michael “is seriously ill because of an addiction to prescription drugs”, their own picture tells the opposite story – Michael is in great shape and is very much at his best. His step is jaunty and the overall impression of him is that of confidence and being fully in charge of his life.

In fact we should make a note of it for future references –  judging by the way Michael looked in April 2007 any “addiction to prescription drugs” at the time was highly unlikely.

The rest of the article is non-stop noise over the masks the children wear in public, including some totally ridiculous statements from those who saw Michael with his children and reported back that “They acted like they love him”.

Acted like they loved him? Now that we know how much Michael’s children adored their father and what a doting parent he was for them, this incredulous attitude sounds like a damning verdict, shame and rebuke to those who said those words – how could it happen that the world  fell into so gross fallacies about Jackson?

The article also speaks of the fuss the Jackson family was making then about Michael’s alleged addiction to drugs. After not seeing Michael for more than a year and being in total oblivion of what kind of life he was actually living they seemed to follow in the steps of the general public’s insanity – same as others they thought of him only the worst, and even ventured some “interventions” though it is actually unclear whether there was any real ground for their worries.

Well, at least for half a year when Michael was in Ireland no one noticed anything of the kind, and now he was so bad that it required an intervention? Even though he looks the way  he does in the picture from the People magazine? Remenber the way he looked at the beginning of the 2000s when some prescription drugs were really an issue? See the difference?

Here are some excerpts from the People Magazine story:

 “They Wear Masks, Go Shopping at Midnight and Have a Mysterious Nanny. So How Come So Many People Say the Children Seem Normal?

It was just another ho-hum family outing for Dad and the kids. First they took a 40-minute tour of the Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum in Washington, D.C. “The children said ‘cool’ a lot, and they were calling their daddy’s attention to things and asking him questions,” says museum deputy director Don Lopez, who conducted the tour. After that it was on to the NationalMuseum of the American Indian, where the kids joined along in a Yupik tribal dance (even Dad did some hoofing). Next morning a stop at the National Zoo for a peek at the pandas, gorillas and tigers. “The kids were really happy and excited to see all the animals,” says spokesman John Gibbons, who accompanied Michael Jackson, 49, and his three children—who weren’t wearing veils or masks that day—on their two-hour visit July 19. “I was struck,” says Gibbons, “by how considerate and nice and normal they all were.”

Wait a minute—is this Michael Jackson we’re talking about? Is it possible the three children he is raising without their mothers around—son Prince I, 10; daughter Paris, 9; and 5-year-old Prince II, nicknamed Blanket—are having anything approaching a happy, healthy childhood? Could it be that the King of Pop is also the King of Pops? This is, after all, the man who was the subject of two major investigations into the possible sexual abuse of underaged boys (his first accuser declined to testify against him in a 1993 case but collected at least $20 million in a civil suit; Jackson’s 2005 child-molestation trial ended in his acquittal). What’s more, sources tell PEOPLE they believe Jackson is seriously ill because of an addiction to prescription drugs. But as Jackson shops for houses in Maryland’s tony St. Michaels community—getting ready to settle back in the U.S. after living in Ireland, Bahrain and England since 2005—several Jackson insiders, friends and associates interviewed by People say he and his children live far more ordinary lives than one might imagine.

By all accounts Jackson’s children are bright, well-behaved and seemingly well-adjusted. Prince and Paris—whose biological mother is Jackson’s ex-wife Debbie Rowe (see box); Blanket arrived via an unnamed surrogate mother in 2002—”think that they live a totally normal life, which is what Michael wants for them,” says Las Vegas dealmaker Jack Wishna, who has worked on several Jackson projects. In Westmeath, Ireland, where the family lived in 2006 while Jackson worked on a new album, the singer cooked porridge for the children every morning and took them out to the movies—with no masks. “The kids had popcorn and soda and acted like any normal kids,” says a patron at a showing of The Santa Clause 3 in Mullingar, Ireland, last December. At a bookstore in Dun Laoghaire that fall, Jackson “was just doing his thing and the kids”—again, with no masks on—”would run over and say, ‘Hey, Dad, look at this,’ or jump on him, and he would always give them his attention,” says Bert Wright, manager of Hughes & Hughes bookstore.

At birthday parties for Prince and Paris, “Michael bought lots of toys, balloons and big cakes and went all out for his kids, and they acted like they love him,” says someone who was there for both events. This source says the children adore their father because he acts like a child himself, singing songs, getting giddy on trips, making everything a game. Even the veils and ornate masks he has his children wear on most outings are, observers say, not a problem because “the kids think it’s just another game with Daddy.”

One longtime associate who recently spent time with Jackson and his children remembers Prince and Paris “were running in and out and Michael was always very attentive to them.” Another person who met with Jackson not long ago says the children “were all enjoying themselves and singing Beatles songs together.” And when it comes to teaching his kids manners, associates say Jackson is a stickler. At a party this May in England, “he made sure that when they left, all the children went around and said goodbye to everyone,” says a music producer.

But isn’t this the same guy who dangled Blanket out a fifth-floor Berlin hotel window in 2002, who awkwardly forced a bottle into Blanket’s mouth in the infamous ITV1’s documentary Living with Michael Jackson, who nicknamed his son Blanket? To others with insight into how he is raising his children, the image of Jackson as Ward Cleaver just doesn’t jibe. For starters some Jackson pals and family members take issue with the children’s nanny Grace Rwaramba, a former production-company office worker who is now taking care of and homeschooling the kids (see box). “She started out as this naive African girl, and now she is hell on wheels,” says one longtime Jackson associate. Says another: “Grace calls all the shots when it comes to Michael. She brought in the Nation of Islam and its security guards. Grace is the queen bee.”

According to several sources, Rwaramba is preventing some Jackson family members from seeing him—and from helping him with what many sources claim is an addiction to prescription drugs. Jermaine Jackson confirmed to PEOPLE on July 21 that he’s worried about his brother’s health. L.A. attorney Tom Mesereau Jr., who defended Jackson at his 2005 trial, says, “I was approached by the Jackson family” to stage an intervention for Jackson last year but did not participate. A source close to the family confirms the Jacksons did attempt an intervention in Las Vegas in 2006 [correction: 2007] ; three of Jackson’s brothers were there and sister Janet was on the phone. “Michael got pissed off and said he wasn’t on drugs,” says one family source. Several people interviewed also agree that because of Rwaramba most family members are “cut off—there is no communication with Michael,” says a source close to the family, who adds that Jackson’s brother Randy is afraid Michael will die just like Anna Nicole Smith.

Through his publicist Raymone Bain, Jackson denies taking drugs or being in poor health; Bain also says Jackson is fully in charge of his life. “Right now Michael is on the East Coast looking at houses and enjoying himself on vacation,” Bain told PEOPLE in July. “He’s talking on the phone every day. He is very engaged and active.” Adds the Rev. Jesse Jackson, a longtime friend and adviser: “I was with him [in July 2007] and he was healthy, spry, effervescent. After all the pressure of the trial, it weakened him to some extent, but he bounced back.”

… Their father’s money troubles aside, there’s also the issue of the veils and masks the Jackson children wear on most public outings—don’t they draw more attention than they deflect? “The primary reason for seeing the children all dressed up like that is for the attention that Michael will get for himself,” says Jackson family confidant and coauthor of Michael Jackson: The Man Behind the Mask Stacy Brown, voicing an opinion shared by others who know Jackson. What’s more, “the masks could send the message to the children that they need to be fearful of people,” says Dr. Dorian Traube, a University of Southern California social worker specializing in adolescent development. “They could end up feeling that there is something wrong with them and that nobody can see them.” And can it be good for the children to travel quite so much? Since abandoning Neverland in 2005, Jackson has hopped the globe, spending time on at least three continents. “The kids are always moving from place to place, and they don’t have any playmates,” says a source close to the Jackson family.

But even this source concedes the children seem to be doing extremely well so far: “They are so smart it’s incredible. Prince is a hilarious little boy, and Paris is a real girl who likes girly things.” Stacy Brown, who admits he is “no supporter of Jackson’s,” says, “I don’t believe he should have these children. I worry about them. But they seem to be pretty normal. And Grace genuinely loves them.”

A family unlike any other, perhaps, but still, it seems, a family. “What I like about his children is that they don’t act like privileged kids,” says Jamie Foster Brown, a journalist who accompanied Jackson and his children on a trip to Japan this March. “They’re just cordial and friendly and playful, and they like to play jokes on their daddy. Michael would say, ‘Blanket, don’t do that!’ and Blanket would say, ‘Okay, I won’t,’ and then would do it again to tease his dad. They are all very comfortable with him. He is raising his children well.”

Prince Michael Jackson I • Age: 10
“He’s very good at making people laugh,” says a Jackson friend

Paris Michael Katherine Jackson • Age: 9
Jackson’s fame “doesn’t even seem to faze her,” says a pal

Prince Michael Jackson II a.k.a. “Blanket” • Age: 5
At Disneyland, he “really liked Peter Pan,” says a friend. http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20060327,00.html

I hope the public has got now first-hand information about the credibility and clarity of mind of Stacy Brown – the poor guy is worried about the children, says that Michael “should not have them” and claims that they have to wear masks to draw attention to Michael (and not to hide their identity so they would go unrecognized when they were without their father, which was really the case). With that level of knowledge of Michael Jackson’s life how could anyone ever think that Stacy Brown was qualified enough to write a book about Michael at all?

And isn’t the opinion of that university pundit hilarious? I mean the one that the masks are “sending a message to the children that they should be fearful of people”? Oh, sometimes science does behave like a servant wondering in which way it may be helpful to its masters…

PADDY DUNNING’S HOUSE REVISITED

While all this crazy mess was revolving around Michael Jackson in his homeland, Paddy Dunning’s house in Ireland where Michael and his kids enjoyed comfort for five months in the summer-autumn of 2006, was visited by a guy named Pol O Conghaile who added some details to what we already know of the story. His site does not allow for copying the text, so I retyped some parts of it – I simply had to as I want you to also feel the warmth of coming almost back home with its help.

Actually it was only from Pol O Conghaile’s story that I realized how Paddy Dunning could have made an easy 1 million dollar (but never did). All he had to do was making one picture of Michael’s children – the media offered a $1 mln. “bounty” for a single photo of them! Now I understand why Michael Jackson specially thanked Paddy for never asking him for a photo of his family while they were at his house.

Pol O Conghaile spoke to Paddy Dunning, the owner of Grouse Lodge:

How did they keep his presence a secret?

We didn’t tell anyone,” he deadpans. “We’re used to doing it. I know he’s the biggest pop star in the world, but we weren’t smitten with that. Also, we live here. If we’d told anyone, the family would have been a mess.”

Occupying pride of place in the large, country kitchen is the framed page of the guest-book signed by the King of Pop.

“Occupying pride of place in the large, country kitchen is the framed page of the guest-book signed by the King of Pop”, says Pol O Conghaile

Roman Casey, General Manager at Grouse Lodge, chuckles at the “Father Ted-ish” memories from the time.

He recalls locals giving journalists misleading directions, regional papers inquiring about sightings of Jackson in Moate, even a farmer who confronted a paparazzo hiding up a tree outside Coolatore. If he didn’t vamoose, the farmer threatened, he’d be sprayed with slurry.

Jackson worked with producers Will I Am and Rodney Jenkins at Grouse Lodge, though Claire has fond memories of Big Chuck, an entourage member whose bling included a crushed Heineken can covered in diamonds. Big Chuck was nearly seven foot tall, she says, but afraid of cows.

The one memory everyone shares is that of Jackson beginning to relax.

The star arrived in a bad way – not long after his acquittal on charges of child molestation in 2005 – but the freedom afforded him in the Irish countryside seems to have worked wonders. He went for walks, took photographs, ate Claire’s home-cooking, enjoyed what Casey calls “the Westmeath way”. He read local folklore, was on first-name terms with the cleaner, and began to sing again.

He also got quality time with his kids. A school was set up for Paris, Prince Michael Junior and Blanket in one of the converted stables at Grouse Lodge, and they played in the gardens, fields and rolling hills around Coolatore.

In one of the rooms, I spot several planets they painted onto a slant in the ceiling just over the bed – they remain as bold and colorful as ever today.

Michael's children drew the pictures of planets on the slant over their beds

Michael’s children drew the pictures of planets on the slant in the ceiling over the door

“Most things end sadly,” Dunning muses. “But at least he had spent that time in Westmeath with his kids, which I think will stand to them.”

He is defensive of Jackson, having witnesses the awesome pressure that comes with such fame.

He talks of death threats, a $1 million “bounty” for pictures of the kids, the sense that any photo or phone call could end up online in seconds.

“If you were sitting here with Michael Jackson, you would be the odd one,” he explains. “Because you wouldn’t feel comfortable.”

But Dunning also remembers Jackson’s sense of humour (when the pair were stopped at traffic lights, he says, the pop star would make mischief by rolling down the window and waving to drivers alongside).

“He was starting to relax. If he hadn’t left, he wouldn’t have died.”

When I finally retire for the evening, I can’t quite believe I’m sleeping in the King of Pop’s four-poster. The rock-hard mattress Jackson favoured has thankfully been replaced, but other than that, the room remains as was. There are sash windows, a large mahogany wardrobe, an en-suite bathroom with a cast-iron tub.

Blanket, I’m told, slept on a camper bed in the corner…

La Chapelle casts Michael as the Archangel defeating Satan

In his (Dunning’s) office, there’s a supersized print of David La Chapelle’s photograph casting Jackson as the archangel defeating Satan. The star eventually left Westmeath to attend James Brown’s funeral, and there was talk of him using Ireland as a base during his planned run of 50 concerts at London’s O2 last year.

Sadly, he never returned.

He planned to, however, and that’s the final twist in this crazy tale. As well as Coolatore, the Dunning have restored a nearby Georgian farmhouse, Bishopstown House, as a luxury self-catering getaway.

The six-bedroom house was bought in trust for Jackson, Dunning says, who had asked the couple to seek out a suitable Irish residence for him.

We brought him to places all over the country, and he saw what we were doing in Bishopstown and that became an option,” Paddy says.

“So we decided to develop it with him in mind. We knew what he was looking for – a place way in off the road, with outbuildings for guests, with writing rooms. He could bounce between the houses and the studio. It just fitted in.”

Taking a stroll around Bishopstown, I find an ambitious work-in-progress.

Before restoration began in the derelict estate, Casey says, trees were literally taking root in the stairwell. Today, workers are rejuvenating the stables, planning permission has been secured for a pool, and the old farmhouse has been extended – in sympathy with Jackson’s ideas – to incorporate marble bathrooms and a timber roof garden with 360-degree views of the countryside.

Whether you stay at Coolatore or Bishopstown, there’s plenty to see and do. … I’m not surprised to hear, however, that most guests stay put, reveling in the manor houses.

And perhaps Dunning is right.  Maybe Jackson would still be around if he did too.

http://poloconghaile.com/michael-jacksons-irish-home/

For sure Michael would be alive now if he had stayed in Ireland! Even the man who persuaded Michael to return to the US regretted that he had done it. His name was mentioned here already – it is Jack Wishna and he was a dealer who took Michael Jackson to the US in December 2006 to arrange a permanent Las Vegas show for him there.  Jack Wishna committed suicide two weeks ago and this fact demands that we should cast a separate look at him, but now let us limit ourselves to his statement that he regretted moving Michael back to the US:

Las Vegas, NV (KTNV) — A friend and business partner of Michael Jackson says he regrets moving the King of Pop to Las Vegas several years ago, where he ultimately met Dr. Conrad Murray.

“Over the years I always thought that maybe if I didn’t move Michael from Ireland back to America, back to Las Vegas, that maybe Michael would be alive today,” says entertainment power broker Jack Wishna, president of Rockrena, Inc.

After noting the true sadness in these words let us turn to one more point in Michael Jackson’s Irish period of 2006 which has been totally overlooked by us as yet.

THE ALBUM

Billy Bush, Michael Jackson and Will.I.Am are walking to the recording studio

Billy Bush of Hollywood Access, Michael Jackson and Will.I.Am are on the way to the recording studio

It was due to the tranquility of Ireland and its people that Michael started creating music and singing again. He worked on his new album for full five months while he stayed in Paddy Dunning’s house.

In fact the recording studio was the reason why he moved into his premises at all – Michael had been in Ireland for some time already before he started looking for a house where he could record his music and Dunning’s house turned out to be just the right place.

To make his dream come true Michael flew in musicians from the US and we even witnessed an instance of their joint work when Billy Bush was making a report for Hollywood Access from Michael’s rehearsal with Will I Am.

Listening to the beat

Listening to the beat in the studio

Paddy Dunning says that Michael looked forward to releasing the new album and was about to come to Ireland to finish it off in a few weeks’ time after the 50 concerts in London.

Paddy heard the music in the making and thought it absolutely brilliant. When the article below was published they were sure that the album would become the top selling disc of all times as it was actually Michael’s last album, recorded for the first time since 2001.

They didn’t know what Michael’s fans would do to this precious piece of work so much cherished by Michael Jackson.

A reader found the story about the album published in the Irish Sunday Mirror after Michael’s death and posted it here : http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-66533.html

JACKSON’S IRISH TAPES HUNT
exclusive by Stephen Maguire
‘New album will be a global No.1’

A secret album recorded by Michael Jackson in Ireland could make MILLIONS for his estate. Jackson flew in musicians from America to make the album while living at Grouse Lodge, Co. Westmeath, and was planning to return to Ireland within weeks to finish it off after his planned 50-night run in London at the 02 arena.

The as-yet unnamed album includes tracks written by Akon, Ne-Yo and Will.i .am of the Black Eyed Peas and would certainly top the charts around the globe. Record industry insiders said the record had taken years to produce but was “a return to form” for the King of Pop.

Jackson had been dumped by Sony in 2001 and had not had a top 10 hit in the US since then. Last night, Grouse Lodge owner Paddy Dunning revealed,  “He was expected back in a few weeks time to finish off the album. It was produced by Will.i.am from the Black Eyed Peas and features all these fantastic musicians on it. He flew them all in from America to play on it. I don’t know what will happen to it now. I suppose that it will be released one way or the other. It sounds absolutely brilliant to me.”

“He had told me how much he was looking forward to coming back to finish it off. Now we’ll never see him again. He was in great form when he stayed with us and we got quite close. Before then I never knew what a brilliant musician he was. He could play piano, guitar and drums really well. I saw him performing and singing brilliantly in the studio.

“He was certainly on top form. He loved staying here and said it helped his creativity.”

Now the race is on to turn the lost Jackson tapes into a finished album ready for release. The reclusive singer spent five months making what was to be his new album at Grouse Lodge in 2007. The album could now become one of the biggest-selling discs of all time.

Tony Wadsworth, chairman of the British Phonographic Industry, said, “There would be a huge amount of interest in this album. The rapid sell-out of the live dates and the overwhelming reaction to his passing are sure signs that a release of new good-quality Michael Jackson music could see him back at the top of the charts.”

And a music industry source added,  “This album will be absolutley huge. It’s the last thing Michael ever did. It’s almost finished and now it will be brought out as a tribute to him in the coming months. Millions of fans worldwide are now snapping up all his old albums in tribute to him. Can you imagine how many will buy this album because they know it’s going to be the final orginal album?”

Last night, Grouse Lodge owner Paddy Dunning said he was heartbroken to hear of Jackson’s death. He recalled his time with the star and his children, Prince Michael, Paris and Blanket, and revealed how Jackson was a true musical genius. Jackson’s children even went to school in Rosemount village along with his own children.

“He seemed very happy here, they all did. And we enjoyed having them. He had no entourage at all with him, just his children and they were really well-mannered kids.

“He wasn’t a big drinker or anything, but he did like a glass of wine with his meals. However, he never went down to the local pub or that.”

Dunning also revealed how Michael was hugely interested in Irish legends and stories and was very knowledgeable about Irish mythology. And contrary to popular opinion, the singer was not a fussy eater, in particular enjoying the traditional Irish breakfast.

Several international stars have recorded at Grouse Lodge, with singer Shirley Bassey booked in at the moment. The studio has 15 acres of grounds where Jackson and his family often went for long walks.

Source: Irish Daily Mirror, June 28th 2009 http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-202499652.html

So Michael hoped the album to be a success and it could indeed make millions …. He flew in musicians from America to make it… The album included tracks written by Akon, Ne-Yo and Will.i .am …. It would certainly top the charts around the globe… Michael was looking forward to coming back to finish it off…. He was certainly on top form…  The album could become one of the biggest-selling discs of all time…. It’s the last thing Michael ever did…

Does anyone here recognize what album we are talking of?

Still remembering the viciousness of attacks and the boycott of the album, Sony, Estate and the musicians participating in the project, it was with some bewilderment that I finally realized that they were talking of what would eventually become the “Michael” album – stigmatized by the fans as fake and something unworthy of the good name of Michael Jackson! I wonder who was the first to start them on this road? Those who didn’t want Michael’s last album to be a thunderous success?

Yes, Michael had to leave the songs unfinished due to sad and irreversible circumstances and many fans were outraged that the unfinished material was released after Michael’s death (“Michael was a perfectionist, he could never have allowed this to happen”, “Profits is all they see”, “Keep the legacy intact”) and all of us could have our own opinions about these flashy ideas, but now I hope we do understand what unspeakable injustice would have been done to  Michael Jackson himself  if the songs he so laboriously worked on in Ireland and then US had not been released at all.  

Now we know how much effort he put into it, how enthusiastic he was about it and how many high expectations he had in connection with the new album …

THE CASCIO TRACKS

When Michael returned to the US the work on the album continued. He went on writing songs, only the environment and the mood in which he was writing them changed, so the new songs acquired a visibly dramatic touch. No wonder that they did – after the acquittal at the 2005 trial and the relaxed atmosphere of Ireland Michael most probably grew  quite optimistic about his future (which is why he came back to the US at all), only he never knew that upon arrival he would be faced with the same old hostility which acted like a cold shower on him wiping away any renewed hopes.

The ideas like a “freak”, “monkey”, “molester of boys”, “we can’t wait till he dies”, “it’s ok to be mean to him” were continuing on a regular basis and it was in this atmosphere that the Cascio tracks appeared approximately half a year after Michael’s return to the US.

Randall Sullivan explains Michael’s arrival at the home of the Cascios in August 2007 in a totally pathetic way – Michael was homeless and had to knock at their door one night as he simply had nowhere to go. The times were indeed hard for Michael but this Sullivan’s text is a huge exaggeration terribly oversimplifying things:

“He asked for help,” Wiesner recalled. “I could see that it was a very, very hard time for Michael. He had nowhere to go and he was afraid. He felt they might make him go on tour, but he didn’t want to do it. He didn’t know what to do.” The only plan Michael seemed to have for his immediate future, Wiesner remembered, was to seek out sanctuary and wait to see what came his way. The arrival of the Michael Jackson traveling party at the Cascio home in Franklin Lakes, New Jersey, during the first week of August 2007 startled not only the people next door, but also Grace Rwaramba. She had no idea where they were headed, Grace recalled, until they were almost there. The Cascios were used to it.

Michael Jackson had been showing up announced on their front porch for nearly a quarter century. More than once, he had awakened them by knocking on the door in the middle of the night. These people he called his “ second family” always welcomed him. In return, he had insisted that they fly out to California to be present for the births of each of his children; not a single Jackson family member was invited. Connie Cascio continued to be the only person other than Grace whom Michael trusted to take care of his kids. In recent years, he had spent many more holidays with them than with anyone from his birth family, including his mother Katherine.

… Eddie Cascio had already made a name for himself—“Angel Cascio” he was called—in the music business. An article touting the young man’s career had been published in the school newspaper at DrewUniversity, where Eddie had graduated in 2004 with a degree in sociology. With the help of “ a family friend with connections in the business,” as Eddie described Michael in the article, he had begun selling songs to Sony/ATV while still an undergraduate. Soon he was working as a producer for ’N Sync on their song “ Fallin’” and that landed him jobs working on the Luther Vandross album Dance with My Father and on Usher’s Here I Stand. Before his graduation, Eddie had formed his own company, Angelikson Music.

The parents who had started him off with piano lessons years earlier at Michael’s urging paid for the construction of a recording studio in their basement that, while not state of the art, was well enough equipped to convince Michael Jackson that he and his young friend should lay down some tracks together. They recorded twelve songs in all, the most memorable (if not the best) being “ Breaking News,” an antitabloid screed in which Michael vented his rage and hurt over what had been done to him during his criminal trial, referring to himself repeatedly by name. He and Eddie had written the song together, with help from James Porte, an arranger and engineer who had worked with Eddie on the Luther Vandross album.

Within a couple of weeks of landing at the Cascios, Michael began venturing out, most often with Frank, who had been helping him work up disguises for years.

… After September, Michael began demonstrating less concern about being recognized in public. On October 31, he showed up with Frank Cascio at the Halloween Store in the Boulder Run Mall wearing a disguise that consisted of only a baseball cap worn with sunglasses and a scarf that was wrapped around his neck and lower face. After picking out $200 worth of disguises that included a Mardi Gras mask and a king’s robe, Michael stepped up to the counter and let the scarf slip below his chin. When the young woman ringing up his order saw who it was, she gasped. Less than a minute after Michael and Frank stepped out of the store, she was on the phone with the New York Daily News. By the next morning, everyone in the metropolitan area knew that Michael Jackson had been staying for weeks with a family in FranklinLakes, New Jersey. It was time to find another hiding place.”

In his book “My friend Michael” Frank Cascio paints a different picture of the same events and says that Michael and kids came for the fiftieth birthday of Frank’s mother Connie celebrated on August 19, 2007 and arrived late in the evening when the party was over and all the guests had already gone:

We threw a surprise party for my mother’s fiftieth birthday in New Jersey on August 19, 2007. Later that evening, when the guests had gone, Michael appeared at the house. He had his three kids in tow, as well as his black Lab, Kenya, and a cat. My father called me in the city and said, “I think you should come home tonight, but make sure you come alone.” As soon as he said that, I knew Michael was at the house.

… I was working in Manhattan, but I was back and forth to New Jersey frequently to see Michael and the kids. We celebrated Michael’s forty-ninth birthday, which fell ten days after my mother’s fiftieth, with a big family dinner. My mother cooked, and we also ordered in some pizza because Michael loved pizza.
The time he’d spent in Bahrain after the trial had been a good break for him. He had needed time away, time for himself, and he seemed rejuvenated. He was alive and excited, getting back into being creative and free. He and Eddie were working in the studio during the day, and he was playing with an idea for an animated cartoon he hoped to produce. He was happy to be around my family, with whom he could be himself. There was no sign that he was on any sort of medicine. He was back to being Michael. One of the upstairs bedrooms had been turned into a classroom, and a tutor came to the house every day. Late as he went to sleep, Michael made it a point to wake up early every morning to help his kids get ready for school. My mother fed them, but Michael was the one who got them dressed—nicely, as if they were going to school outside the house—and made sure their teeth were brushed.

… Meanwhile, things were going well in the studio with Eddie. Just as Michael had groomed me to do business with him, he had mentored Eddie’s musical talents from a young age, always promising that if he worked hard, one day he would have his chance. Even though Eddie was my younger brother, I had always looked up to him in many ways. I was happy that they were working together, and happy that Michael was making music again. The two of them, along with our close friend James Porte, wrote twelve songs, three of which (“Breaking News,” “Keep Your Head Up,” and “Monster”) would appear on Michael’s last album, Michael.

So Frank thinks that it was Michael’s time in Bahrain that rejuvenated him. However Paddy Dunning tells us that Michael arrived from Bahrain “in a bad way” and it was only during the half a year spent in rural Ireland that he began to relax, enjoy life and create music again. This we can easily believe as Michael’s stay in Bahrain did not produce any music despite all the grandeur of the surrounding and pressure from the sheikh.

The place where Paddy Dunning initially accommodated Michael was a converted cowshed

This is the place where Paddy Dunning initially accommodated Michael  – it was a converted cowshed. Michael didn”t mind, all he needed was a studio

From what I’ve read about Michael’s habits he didn’t want luxury for the sake of it. He could make do with something much more modest – all he needed was a little comfort, real friendliness and no pressure.

What the media called his “lavish style” was simply a forced necessity required for the sake of security and the need to live up to the image of a successful superstar which the media itself imposes on celebrities and then expects them to keep up with. Staying in modest hotels for Michael Jackson could produce a much worse effect and end up in even more media ridicule than ever.

What was impossible in the palaces of Bahrain became possible in the warm comfort of Paddy Dunning’s studio and friendly atmosphere of the Cascios’ home where Michael wrote one of his best songs – Monster, giving vent to the anger at the way they kept insulting him and treating him like he was no human being.

The album remained unfinished alas and the tracks had to be processed. We can presume that the Cascio tracks were processed most, as Michael had less time for them than for the Irish tracks – according to Sullivan Michael stayed with the Cascios until October 31st which is less than two months and a half beginning with Connie’s birthday (August 19th).

In the Irish studio Michael worked for at least five months.

Let’s also make a mental note that in the summer/autumn of 2007, same as in April, there was no sign of Michael using any sort of medicine. We have Frank Cascio’s word for that and his word is simply impossible to doubt. Frank is very honest in what he says, even too honest in the opinion of some fans – you remember that when Michael did have problems with taking prescription medication in the early 2000s Frank made absolutely no bones about it. Some Michael’s fans could not forgive him for that honesty, but honesty actually works both ways – now that the same Frank says there was no sign of any drugs in Michael Jackson’s life in autumn 2007, we can be sure that this was indeed the case.

Some people do doubt Frank’s word though and think that Monster, Breaking News and the other Cascio songs were never recorded in Eddie Cascio’s studio. To these people I suggest that they listen to what Michael’s son Prince has to say about it.

According to TMZ the children said that they didn’t believe it was their father who was singing on the Cascio tracks. This sounds like a damning verdict proving the point of the naysayers, however no one paid attention to another revelation in the same text – Prince was present at those recording sessions and heard the songs (!) and it was only the comparison between what Prince heard in Cascio’s studio and in the finished tracks which made him doubt.

Well, the actual phrase was: “the recorded versions don’t match what he heard”. Let us put aside the point of no match as secondary for the moment and focus on the main news – Prince heard those songs in the studio, so they were recorded there and this is the only premise from which we should do any further discussion of this matter.

Now that you know what to look for you will easily find it:

New Michael Jackson Album Out December 14

11/04/2010 8:00 PM, Yahoo! Music

…According to a press release, Breaking News was recorded in New Jersey in 2007 and was “recently brought to completion.” That would seem to place it among the songs that Jackson recorded with producer Eddie Cascio—songs that have recently been the subject of many rumors.

Earlier this week, TMZ reported that Michael’s children believe that it is not their father singing on the Cascio tracks. Among other reported evidence, Jackson’s son Prince was reportedly in the house during the sessions and has said the recorded versions don’t match what he heard. However, Jackson’s estate says sound experts have deemed the voice on the recordings to be Jackson’s; people involved with the project reportedly have said the children are being “manipulated” by Jackson’s mother and others who don’t want the album released.

Full story: http://ca.launch.yahoo.com/read/news/62007073

So Michael Jackson did record his songs in the Cascios’ studio, and it is only the sound of his voice which still makes us wonder. It is true that in those three songs it sounds different, but when they asked Teddy Riley he explained that they had to process Michael’s voice. Various parts were recorded separately and to bring them in key with each other the voice had to be tampered with. They moved it up a little and this enhanced Michael’s vibrato (and made it sound like another singer). Each of us is familiar with the effect – when the record is sped up, even a bass voice sounds high-pitched with a funny vibrato appearing from nowhere.

Of course the question remains whether Michael’s friends had the right to treat Michael’s materials this way, but Teddy Riley apologized for what they had to do and said there was simply no other way out.

Voice on Michael Jackson album far from finished

12/14/2010 11:00 AM, Reuters
Mike Collett-White

Recordings of Michael Jackson’s voice on a new album being released this week were far from the finished article and required considerable digital enhancement, according to one of its main producers.

But Teddy Riley, who worked with the King of Pop on several records before his death, believed that “Michael” would go down as a classic, albeit short of the heights of Jackson’s heyday in the late 70s and early 80s.

“I had to do more processing to the voice, which is why people were asking about the authenticity of his voice,” Riley told Reuters of the first album of new Jackson material since the singer’s sudden death 18 months ago.

The project has been mired in controversy since members of Jackson’s family were quoted questioning the authenticity of the voice on some tracks and his father’s lawyer said the perfectionist would never have wanted the music released.

“We had to do what we had to do to make … his voice work with the actual music,” Riley added in an interview.

“He (Jackson) would never consider it being a final vocal. But because he’s not with us he cannot give us new vocals. What we did was utilize the Melodyne (technology) to get him in key.

“With the Melodyne we actually move the stuff up which is the reason why some of the vibrato sounds a little off or processed, over-processed. We truly apologize for that happening, but you are still hearing the true Michael Jackson.”

Riley worked on three of the 10 songs on the album — “Hollywood Tonight,” “Monster” and “Breaking News.”

The last two were recorded at the New Jersey home of the Cascio family in 2007, along with a third Cascio track “Keep Your Head Up.”

It was these recordings that led some to cast doubt over the authenticity of the songs, although Riley, and record label Sony, have been at pains to show they were genuine.

PRICE OF FAME

Riley said much of the negative publicity surrounding the album came from people within Jackson’s entourage who did not approve of the project.

“That don’t just happen like that, that has to come from somewhere and where it came from was not a great place. It was from a family member, and some family members … didn’t totally get the last say so they kind of hate the project.

“So there you have it, a chain reaction, a domino effect that makes the credibility of Michael go down,” he said.

“I am here to protect that, because I know it’s him, I know it’s great material, I know that it needs to be out, I know that the legacy needs to continue because he’s such a great person, and there’s more to come.”

“Michael” is the first album of new Jackson material since “Invincible” in 2001, and the first in a reported $250 million deal between Sony and the executors of Jackson’s estate to release 10 albums through 2017.

Author J. Randy Taraborrelli, who wrote a 1991 best-selling biography of Jackson, said on Monday that Jackson’s estate had another 60 songs but did not plan on releasing all of them.

“They’ve got 60 incomplete songs but they’ve only got about 20 left with vocals that they feel, that the estate feels, are worthwhile,” Taraborrelli said in a U.S. interview on the CBS TV network’s “The Early Show”.

“They’re not releasing everything. They’re releasing the things that they believe Michael would want released, and that’s about 17 to 20 more songs,” Taraborrelli said.

Asked if he would agree to produce future posthumous Jackson material, Riley replied:

“If it was my decision, yes, I would be involved in anything that Michael was involved with. If they will have me I will definitely be a part of it. I’m here, I came out here to be a servant to my friend.

Among the topics Jackson tackles on the new album is people’s thirst for fame and the high price of becoming a star.

In “Hollywood Tonight” he describes the real-life experiences of an unnamed friend who heads to Los Angeles aged 15 to make it in the movies, and in “Monster” he sings about the paparazzi.

“The Monsters are the ones who, when you’re up they come to get you and they beat you down and when they get you down they go to the next artist,” Riley said of “Monster.”

“That’s their job, to hit you while you’re up and step on you while you’re down, and that’s what he always said.”

Reviews of “Michael,” which hits British stores on Monday and U.S. stores on Tuesday, have been generally positive. http://ca.launch.yahoo.com/read/news/61995583

To finish with the subject I’ve heard that after a lot of pressure from Michael’s fans another singer finally gave in to it and agreed that it was him and not Michael Jackson who was singing those songs and even the Estate lawyers more or less admitted that the album was a mistake.

I am afraid I cannot agree with these statements.

First of all under so much pressure to “confess” almost any singer would say that it is him who sings instead of Michael Jackson as it is a big compliment to be considered a suitable replacement for someone of Michael Jackson’s magnitude. And second, Frank Cascio and the musicians who worked with Michael on that Irish/American album are a much bigger authority to me than a young singer who was simply flattered by all this attention to his personality.

The work of Michael’s friends should not be underestimated. Though their talents are no match to Michael’s genius they did a good job and fulfilled their duty towards the gone artist – they finished off what he had been doing over a long span of time, in a rather vagabond manner and in strained conditions too.

The album had a long and winding road. It started in the comfort and tranquility of Ireland and was continued with songs born in the pain and bitterness which Michael fully tasted when he returned to his homeland. Finally it had to be finished by Michael’s friends who simply could not drop like some unnecessary waste the material Michael had worked on for so long .  And we must be thankful to them that they did  –  at least they tried to do their best.

Songs like Breaking News and Monster could hardly originate in a place like Ireland where Michael relaxed and was treated with friendliness and understanding. These songs could be born only out of the pressure of hostility, nastiness and ridicule he faced when he returned to his country. The Cascio tracks are true and they are actually a powerful evidence of how Michael Jackson felt when he came back hoping for a little bit of understanding similar to the one he had found among the people of Ireland.

Instead they treated him like a Monster again. And they didn’t even allow people to hear what Michael was attempting to say in those last songs – they simply did their best to bury them. If it was really Michael’s family who started it, I congratulate them on the big favor they did to Michael’s detractors. They ridiculed the last work of Michael Jackson who put into it a lot of his strength, spirit and creativity, and finally managed to get the album stigmatized despite positive reaction even from the media.

The fans and detractors laughed at the album together questinioning Michael’s efforts to restart recording music, standing on his feet again and speaking about what was on his mind in the last years of his life. They strangled the album with their own hands and frankly, it feels like an insult to Michael now that we know how hopeful of it he was and have seen with our own eyes his work on the album in that Irish studio.

Unfortunately I myself am not too pleased with everything done by the musicians on Michael’s last songs. There are many drawbacks there, and the earlier version of Monster in my opinion sounded much better until 5o cent introduced his rap there (it’s long and I don’t understand a word). But even if we don’t want to listen to the over-processed songs we could at least read their lyrics out of simple respect for what Michael was trying to tell us in the last years of his life.

The Monster and Breaking News lyrics are actually a document to us. They are a sad look at how Michael felt when he returned home from his blissful stay in Ireland.  These lyrics will help us understand why Michael eventually grew afraid – yes, afraid – of doing concerts in Las Vegas and moved out of the project, though this project was actually the reason why Jack Wishna pursuaded Michael to leave Ireland at all.

But this will be another story to tell.

Just remember what Billy Bush of Hollywood Access told us about the pain he still saw in Michael. Even he felt that Michael could not take one more ounce of disappointment. However Michael’s last songs tell us that it wasn’t just one ounce – this is what he had to face when he came back:

MONSTER lyrics

You can look at them coming out the walls
You can look at them climbing out the bushes
You can find them when the letter’s bout to fall
He’ll be waiting with his camera on focus

Everywhere you seem to turn there’s a monster
When you look up in the air there’s a monster
Paparazzi got you scared like a monster, monster, monster
(Too bad)

Oh oh Hollywood it’s got you jumping like you should (Too bad)
It’s got you bouncing off the wall
It’s got you drunk enough to fall (Too bad)
Oh oh Hollywood just look in the mirror
And tell me you like
Don’t you, don’t you like it

Monster
He’s a monster
He’s an animal

He’s coming at ya Coming at ya rather too fast
Mama say mama got you in a zig zag

And you’re running
And you’re running just to escape it
But they are gunning for the money
So they fake it

Everywhere you seem to turn there’s a monster
When you look up in the air there’s a monster
When you see them in the street
that’s a monster, monster, monster (Too bad)

Oh oh Hollywood it’s got you jumping like you should
It’s got you bouncing off the wall
It’s got you drunk enough to fall (Too bad)
Oh oh Hollywood just look in the mirror
And tell me you like what you see

Monster (he’s like an animal)
He’s a monster (just like an animal)
He’s an animal (and he’s moving in the air)
Monster
He’s a monster
He’s an animal (everybody wanna be a star)

Why are they never satisfied with and all you give,  yeh, yeh, yeh, yeah
You gave them your all
They’re watching you fall
And they eat your soul like a vegetable

Monster (why are you haunting me)
He’s a monster (why are you stalking me)
He’s an animal (why did you do it, why did you, why are you stalking
me)

Monster (why are you haunting me)
He’s a monster (why are you haunting me)
He’s an animal

116 Comments leave one →
  1. December 25, 2012 12:54 am

    “While I do not agree with anyone trying to “complete” Michael’s work, I do feel they had the best intentions to present Michael’s work to the public, for that, I applaud the estate and the producers. I hope in the near future, we hear more of Michael’s final recordings from 2007-09 such as the classical compositions he was working on.” -Jay

    I would prefer to also hear new Michael’s finished songs, but if we can’t, we can’t. I still hope to hear more of whatever they have. The estate has probably chosen not the best ones for the “Michael” album, but hopefully they will be included in future albums. And then all Michael’s songs will divide into two histories – before and after. In those which are “after” we may find real gems because Michael could not release them earlier for various reasons – for example, “Do You Know Where Your Children Are”. It is a great song, but he was afraid even to touch upon this theme after all those accusations!

    The comment on this video says that it was written in 1990-91 and is on one of the CDs (?)

    DO YOU KNOW WHERE YOUR CHILDREN ARE (12 O’CLOCK):

    If the estates releases all these songs now we will see the deeper side of Michael, what he thought of and was worried about, but could not show to us before. “Abortion Papers” was also quite a revelation. And the sound of it and the beat ….. I’m speechless.

    ABORTION PAPERS

    “I truly believe if the world wanted to understand Michael, they should’ve taken the time and REALLY listened to his music

    And to his LYRICS too.

    “I hope one day, people will understand why so many love and miss him, and what we lost”

    Yes. And how lucky we were to have him at all. And what they did to us by stopping him and not giving him a chance to work and make his music. A crime not only against him. A crime against humanity.

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  2. Jay permalink
    December 24, 2012 7:36 am

    Helena, For several reasons, I do not acknowledge Breaking News, Keep Your Head Up, or Monster as songs with Michael’s complete vocals but I respect your opinion and reason

    The “Michael” album, is in fact a compilation as Michael, while having recorded and reworked several songs for an album during in the last 3 years of his life, didn’t leave behind a final tracklisting or sequence. The estate had several great songs and contacted people who either worked with Michael during his life or was influenced by him to complete or rework them.

    Mark Ronson talked about a song the estate gave him called “Lovely Ways”, Steve Lukather worked on the great song “Do You Know Where Your Children Are” from the Dangerous sessions, and Tricky (who produced Keep Your Head Up) also remixed the song “Slave To The Rhythm”. The song “Love Never Felt So Good” was also in consideration apparently. They also ran into opposition from certain producers who worked with Michael in his final years

    While I do not agree with anyone trying to “complete” Michael’s work, I do feel they had the best intentions to present Michael’s work to the public, for that, I applaud the estate and the producers. I hope in the near future, we hear more of Michael’s final recordings from 2007-09 such as the classical compositions he was working on. I truly believe if the world wanted to understand Michael, they should’ve taken the time and REALLY listened to his music

    I hope one day, people will understand why so many love and miss him, and what we lost

    Like

  3. December 24, 2012 2:26 am

    “it was not wise for him to ‘let his guard down’ 100% to relative strangers, including employees, given that he had not been oriented to the outside world properly (no true rehab). When I think of how the Chandlers got access and the Arvizos, and employees like Francia, etc., I feel so sad. He truly was unprepared for what could happen. He starts inviting the Chandlers to Las Vegas, Monaco, Paris, Neverland on short acquaintance. “

    It wasn’t his fault. With his trust and belief in good in each person it was very easy to deceive him. Michael knew what people are like better than anyone else – but he still hoped and believed that if he loved them they would answer him in the same way. But he underestimated things like jealousy and their unwillingness to leave Michael’s life once they entered it.

    A quote from Michael Jackson and Rabbi Shmuley:

    MJ: … Because with the pain, and the arrows that people have shot at me nobody else would have been able to take it. They would have probably committed suicide by now, they would have become a drunk. Because they have been very cruel and rude to me. And if they don’t think I hear it and see it. I do. I do. It’s been the children. I am holding on for them or else I wouldn’t have made it. I really wouldn’t have made it.

    SB: But you are still wary initially. . . you have to be.

    MJ: Yes, because they have really betrayed and deceived me in so many different ways and at so many different times. I have had adults with tears coming down their face, saying, “It’s a shame what you have been through and I would never ever ever ever hurt you or do anything. And they turn around and they hurt me. Honestly, that’s the kind of crap I have been through. . . tears rolling down and hugging me. And they end up a year later suing over some ridiculous. . . like a photographer over some pictures, or some person who gets terminated and I didn’t terminate them, but I get sued by them and I didn’t do it. This is the sort of silliness.

    People were so charming to him at the beginning that I am not in the least surprised that they caught him into their traps.

    For example, Evan Chandler said that June Chandler could be exceptionally charming if she wanted to and I don’t doubt for a second that she did. I think that Michael had an affair with her and the letter from one of Michael’s close employees published when Scott Thorson started telling lies about MJ (prior to the 2005 trial) confirmed that he did have an affair with June Chandler in the 90s. The source is anonymous though, so we can think whatever we like about it, but to me it sounds very much true – the author volunteered this information himself when not a single soul had any suspicions about June and Michael.

    And the letter to Jordan Chandler written by Michael ended with words: “Tell Mom I love her”. This letter seems to be more about June, her wonderful children and “people like them” in general than about Jordan:

    September 13, 2004

    In Sunday’s edition, Fox news writer Roger Friedman printed a letter allegedly written by Michael Jackson to his first accuser, Jordy Chandler. This comes from Friedman’s latest correspondences with uncle, Ray Chandler. Chandler’s book ‘All That Glitters’ is being heavily hawked all through the media. Friedman says that he “verified” the letter, yet the method of his validation is not told. Here is the contents:

    [“Boy’s name], you’re not only my cousin but also my best friend. I can’t stop loving your mother and sister. I have found true love in all of you. If more people were like us the world would change instantly. I have such golden dreams for you. I want you to be a giant in the industry. You are my new inspiration. I love you. Doo doo head. Applehead. Disneyland soon. Love, doo doo. Call soon, bye, doo doo head. Tell Mom I love her.”

    Friedman tells us to “draw our own conclusions.” Injecting an editorial comment, it could be Michael. Does it seem like a pedophile? No.

    Source: Fox News / MJFC http://www.mjfanclub.net/home/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&catid=167%3A2004&id=182%3A2004-september&Itemid=75

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  4. December 24, 2012 1:20 am

    “As far as his delight in using a vacuum cleaner in the 1993 rehab, do you have a link for that? I do recall that this was one of the requirements of the rehab–that the patients clean their own rooms. He also used to run the vacuum cleaner at the Cascios.”

    Aldebaran, I am afraid I won’t be able to find the link now. If I recalled who that visitor was I could try and look, but I don’t remember the name – all that was left in my memory was the impression this vacuum cleaner produced on this visitor (and me). Michael also showed him some picture or a figure made with his own hands (don’t remember what it was), and he did it in an absolutely same manner as a child who proudly shows his drawings to his parents! It was great fun to read that story.

    “I just received a copy of Gardener’s book ‘True and False Accusations of Child Sex Abuse’ (October, 1993)–it’s long, 700 pages. I read the 30 key ‘Differentiating Criteria’ Gardener posits on which to evaluate the children’s accounts as true or false. In terms of the account Jordan told, his account was clearly false by using Gardener’s criteria. (I will describe these more in detail later.) Gardener seems to have a good handle on the characteristics of the true and false accounts that children give, and from reading Jordan’s interview, I have no doubt that Gardener would have “smelled a rat.””

    Very interesting! I am sure that Gardner did smell a rat, as some things clearly showed that Jordan was lying. But the 30 criteria you mention will make it even more interesting. We’ll look forward to your analysis! You could even turn it into a post if you want to.

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  5. December 23, 2012 11:06 pm

    It’s quite inaccurate to call “Michael”, Michael’s last album. It is, instead, a compilation of unreleased material from over the years reworked.

    Jay, I used your own information and added some from Wiki, and this is what I came to:

    1. Hold My Hand-recorded in 2008
    2. Keep Your Head Up 2007
    3. Monster 2007
    4. Breaking News 2007
    5. Best Of Joy – originally recorded in 1990-91. Reworked in 2009 (Wiki says: The song “Best of Joy” is one of the last that Michael recorded during his lifetime, having written and recorded it in 2009).
    6. Hollywood Tonight was written by Michael Jackson during the time of the Invincible album. Michael pulled the track out of the archives in 2007 to work on the song with producer Theron “Neff-U” Feemster.

    The fact that Michael pulled some songs out of the archives does not make them old. If we didn’t hear them and he wanted to include them in the last album they are new for us. So out of the 10 tracks 6 are something we’ve never heard and Michael surely worked on them in those years prior to his AEG disaster.

    He was surely preparing many more as he usually did, but the rest of them must be half-finished only, so they could not be presented even in a processed way. I am happy that we have at least these 10.

    “Keep your head up” is my favorite even though the voice sounds processed. I would prefer it another way, but we can’t have it, alas. And please don’t tell me that it isn’t Michael’s – I will never believe you anyway. Who else could offer so much support to others, who else could write “Keep your head up to the sky” (meaning God) and offer to fly together by modestly saying “Give me your wings so we can fly”? He is sure that we have wings! And that he cannot fly without us!

    And who else could say: “I need your love”? I need your light? And that all we need is love?

    ONLY MICHAEL JACKSON!

    (some of the lyrics are wrong in this video, so please see the correct lyrics below)

    She’s looking for a job and to find a place to stay
    She’s looking for the hope in the empty promises
    She’s working two jobs keeping alive
    She works in a restaurant night and day
    She waits her life away, she wipes the tears away

    She cries inside
    Every time she feels this way
    And she’s dying inside
    Every time her baby cries, no

    Keeping your head up to the sky
    Keeping your mind up, stay alive
    Gimme your wings so we can fly
    Keep your head up tonight

    Keeping your head up to the sky
    We can just rise up tell me now
    Gimme your wings so we can fly

    We’re killing up the life in the birds and the trees
    And we’re sucking up the air in the earth from under me
    (It’s never too late, just lean on me)

    I can’t even breathe, I can’t even see
    Keep your head up, don’t give up today
    How long can we wait?
    I wish the love would come today

    All you need is love
    I tell you I know it’s coming soon
    And all you need is just a moment
    Won’t it do, keep your head up

    Keeping your head up to the sky
    Keeping your mind up stay alive
    Gimme your wings so we can fly
    Keep your head up tonight

    Keeping your head up to the sky
    We can just rise up tell me now
    Gimme your wings so we can fly, oh my

    Everybody say that time is borrowed
    And hanging down your head just ain’t no good
    And if you dare to rise above tomorrow
    Just give yourself a chance, fight the circumstance
    Rise and do it again

    Keeping your head up to the sky
    Keeping your mind up stay alive
    Gimme your wings so we can fly

    Keeping your head up to the sky
    We can just rise up tell me now
    Give me your wings so we can fly

    I need your love
    I need you now
    I need your light right here today
    I need you now

    I need your love
    I need you now
    I need your light right here today
    I need you now

    I need your love
    I need you now
    I need your light right here today
    I need you now

    Like

  6. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 23, 2012 10:54 pm

    Hi, MJ, thanks for your comments. Yes, you are right that ‘we have never known Michael’ and we have to ‘start from a new perspective’ to understand him. In light of your discoveries, isn’t it interesting that Michael himself was attracted to orphanges in particular, as well as hospitals, and visited them so many times? There is a link in that outward desire to visit the children in orphanages b/c he UNDERSTOOD them so well. Yes, it’s so true that most people cannot understand Michael and his song ‘Childhood.’ As you say, “I think this condition is actually very difficult to describe, especially for a child who doesn’t understand himself what happened to him. And this makes it all the more difficult for us to understand what he is trying to communicate.”

    Your point about money and being sometimes money-saving and sometimes a spendthrift is excellent in terms of the children in the orphanages (who did not have their own money to spend) and Michael, who only had a small allowance when he was young, and whose money was handled by others for many years, if not all years! When he wanted to buy Neverland, he had a lot of trouble getting his managers to ok the purchase (his real estate agent Gloria Rhodes Berlin talks about this in her book), even though he really wanted to buy it. I think his issues with money are closely tied up to the ideas you are investigating about life in the orphanage and the control factors involved, the institutional life.

    He spent a lot on Neverland, making it a children’s paradise where he could let his guard down, and yet it was not wise for him to ‘let his guard down’ 100% to relative strangers, including employees, given that he had not been oriented to the outside world properly (no true rehab). When I think of how the Chandlers got access and the Arvizos, and employees like Francia, etc., I feel so sad. He truly was unprepared for what could happen. He starts inviting the Chandlers to Las Vegas, Monaco, Paris, Neverland on short acquaintance. The Arvizos–if only he had just written them a check, but he got so personally involved, which was ok, but inviting them to Neverland was a mistake, unless it was just a day trip (no overnight visits). That whole family had been living in a one-bedroom apartment, all sleeping in one bed, and in no way prepared for Neverland and its freedoms and luxuries. Michael had such a good heart but was so unprepared and vulnerable.

    As far as his delight in using a vacuum cleaner in the 1993 rehab, do you have a link for that? I do recall that this was one of the requirements of the rehab–that the patients clean their own rooms. He also used to run the vacuum cleaner at the Cascios.

    I just received a copy of Gardener’s book ‘True and False Accusations of Child Sex Abuse’ (October, 1993)–it’s long, 700 pages. I read the 30 key ‘Differentiating Criteria’ Gardener posits on which to evaluate the children’s accounts as true or false. In terms of the account Jordan told, his account was clearly false by using Gardener’s criteria. (I will describe these more in detail later.) Gardener seems to have a good handle on the characteristics of the true and false accounts that children give, and from reading Jordan’s interview, I have no doubt that Gardener would have “smelled a rat.”

    Like

  7. December 23, 2012 10:19 pm

    “He’s tried to make contact with me. He has his own business, and is quite well off now. But I don’t want his time or his money. I won’t be bought or bribed. My principles are more important. Money can never compensate for lack of love.”

    Rodrigo, I don’t want to influence you and you have to decide for yourself of course, but people do change and he is probably now genuinely appalled by what he did. He must have been young and insecure and probably afraid at the time. This doesn’t justify his behavior but can at least explain it.

    Principles are not important. If he really needs you and you shut him out of your life, it will be almost the same situation, only in reverse. Speak to your conscience and do what it tells you, no matter what others with their “common sense” say.

    Again, I don’t want to influence you, but I always try to do my best – just to be able to say to myself one day “It didn’t work, but at least I’ve tried, so I have nothing to reproach myself for”. Pangs of conscience arriving at a time when you are unable to change anything any longer are a terrible thing to live with. So it is better to correct before it is too late.

    Just saying. You decide.

    Like

  8. December 23, 2012 9:54 pm

    “I also agree very much with the astute comparison you draw between the regimented life in the orphanage and the life Michael lived, where there was social maladaptation and disorientation that resulted in not knowing how to function in society as a free individual”

    Aldebaran, everybody knows that people who live with everything decided for them terribly lack initiative. Our orphans fall exactly into this category – some manage to adapt to adult life and even have a career (our business tycoon Roman Abramovitch, the owner of the Chelsea football club, is a graduate of an orphanage – yes he is), but the majority cannot and at the moment 80% of them end up good-for-nothing people.

    Michael also managed to tear himself away from the draconian system created for them by Joseph Jackson, while the rest of the brothers even now seem to be lacking something that could have helped them to build a stable foundation for their lives. I think that all of them are the product of Joseph’s monstrous upbringing, especially Randy.

    “his search for a ‘family’ stems from these lonely years. This reminds me of the mannequins he had around Neverland (to keep him from feeling lonely)”

    Oh yes, the mannequins were a substitute for friends, family or people in general whom Michael constantly wanted to see around him. When they were in his room he had a feeling that he was not alone. And mannequins cannot betray or deceive which is an additional benefit. They were life-size and Michael used to say something like “You cannot imagine how effective they are” (in terms of creating the illusion that he was not alone).

    This is what Michael said about his loneliness to Rabbi Shmuley – now these words sound different to me than before (and he is right, people do change – if they start to reflect):

    MJ: You feel like a prisoner and you feel like you are going to die. And that’s it. I am walking and I would just go walking down the street and traffic would get backed up and people would be taking pictures. I knew I looked sad and some people would come up and talk, and they would go. -“What are you doing?” I’d go, “I am walking.” They’d go, “Why are you walking? Where are all the guards?” I said. “I don’t feel like all that. I just want to walk and I am looking for someone to talk to me.” So they would talk to me. I’ve done that many times. I’d ask people to be my friend and they’d say. “Sure.” It’s true. I’d go to the parks. Then I realized that that could be dangerous too, but I was hurting that much.

    SB: Were they intimidated when you asked them to be your friend? Did they say, “I can’t be your friend. . . you are Michael Jackson?”

    MJ: I would even ask for their phone numbers.

    MJ: But I believe you can change a lot of people. That’s what’s so wonderful about it all. You can show them. There are grown-ups who come to Neverland and they say to me, “You know. I haven’t done the things I have done here in years. . . you can let your guard down and be a child again.” I say. “That’s what Neverland is for. To return to your innocence. To have fun.”

    Like

  9. December 23, 2012 2:49 pm

    “I agree very much with your perceptive assessment of Michael’s childhood, namely, his “parental deprivation”. As you say, his tutor Rose was the only supportive, nurturing presence to accompany him on his numerous tours. No wonder he came to love reading and learning. Incidentally, reading IS something you do alone, and I have no doubt it was an escape for him from a demanding, lonely world, as well as a way to be alone and to enrich his mind and knowledge.”

    Aldebaran, when Michael was speaking about his childhood and even wrote a song about it, I could not really understand what he was trying to say. I think this condition is actually very difficult to describe, especially for a child who doesn’t understand himself what happened to him. And this makes it all the more difficult for us to understand what he is trying to communicate.

    It was only when reading some perceptive analyses about how children deprived of their parents feel in orphanages and what problems they face upon graduation that some light began to dim at the end of this tunnel. And it was then that some similarities with Michael suddenly sprang to my eye.

    So many things began to fit in, and in addition to everything already mentioned even some contradictions in Michael’s character suddenly received an explanation. For example, after many years of living alone in the world of adults (and similar children) orphans develop severe contrasts in their character – they are vulnerable, frightened like hell, but always defend themselves by a don’t-meddle-with-me mask thus combining at least two personalities in one.

    They can also be both shrewd and intelligent on the one hand, but behave like total infants on the other hand having no clue about the most common and easiest things (how to use a refrigerator, for example). I recall that Michael derived exceptional joy from learning how to use a vacuum cleaner and showed it with pride to someone who visited him in a rehab in 1993. That person felt embarassed especially when he saw how proud Michael was of his ‘achievement’.

    Orphans living among adults form their own skills for survival but these skills have nothing to do with the skills of children entering the same life from normal families (even unhappy ones). They are half kids and half old people. They can make up contracts like Michael did but will spend thousands on toys at the same time or give away money to someone else without thinking twice. Their relations with money are also very peculiar – they are both money-saving and spendthrift.

    I suddenly recalled Michael’s words: “I was a veteran before I was a teenager” and realized that all these children are veterans before they are teenagers – they have gone through and seen so much by their teens that a rare adult has gone through under normal circumstances. Judging them by the merits of our world is the biggest mistake we can make – and this is what the media and the public were doing all the time about MJ.

    Now that I’ve read just a little bit about the world of orphans Michael’s desire to always have a substitute family by his side and preferably children (of whom he was less afraid and whom he understood best) becomes really understandable to me. To understand that it is just enough to know that they group together upon graduation in one flat in order to survive.

    Their problem is that on the one hand they crave for privacy which they never had, but at the same time cannot live alone in principle if no one takes care to socially adapt them. Some American parents laughingly write about their children adopted from Russian orphanages that they cannot sleep alone in rooms with their doors shut – the doors should always be open. After reading things like that Michael’s request that the whole Klein’s office sleeps in his room when he was on tour with them (so that he is able to sleep himself) does not surprise me in the least any more.

    Michael wasn’t ‘weird’ – he was an orphan who had to live alone among adults for too long.

    After making all these discoveries I feel like we have never really known Michael – and this after three years of our research! – and have to start it all over again, this time from a totally new perspective.

    Like

  10. Jay permalink
    December 23, 2012 12:11 am

    It’s quite inaccurate to call “Michael”, Michael’s last album. It is, instead, a compilation of unreleased material from over the years reworked

    Hold My Hand-recorded in 2008
    Hollywood Tonight- recorded originally in 1998-2001
    Keep Your Head Up
    I Like The Way You Love Me-recorded in 2000-2004.
    Monster
    Best Of Joy-originally recorded in 1990-91. Reworked in 2009
    Breaking News
    Another Day- Recorded in 2000-01
    Behind The Mask- recorded in 1982
    Much Too Soon-originally from 1981. Rerecorded in 1994

    I hope one day we do hear the material for the album Michael was working on

    Like

  11. Rodrigo permalink
    December 22, 2012 11:11 pm

    Thank you so much, Helena.

    He’s tried to make contact with me. He has his own business, and is quite well off now. But I don’t want his time or his money. He can offer me a thousand pounds, but I’ll always remind myself of that 5 pound he shoved through the door when I was born. I won’t be bought or bribed. My principles are more important. Money can never compensate for lack of love.

    And we can’t blame Michael for looking up to others with parents like his. I know he loved Katherine to bits, but she was under Joseph’s influence, and he must have hated it.

    And Joseph…yes, Michael thanked him for making him the entertainer he was, but not for the fragile human being he became.

    I myself only have a margin to reflect on in my life, that makes me believe this is why I am the way I am.

    I had a loving mother and grandmother who raised me. I had friends. I had a fun childhood.

    Michael had virtually NONE of that. What does that do? Looking at him, we know the answer.

    And people often remark on how good I am with children…this is because, I believe, I’m trying to compensate for not having a decent father in my life.
    I would say at a young age how much I wanted to be a dad, and people were baffled as to why when I was so young?
    Because I wanted to be something that I never had in my life, and I never understood it myself back then. Even Michael wanted to be a dad at a young age. Things happen that make you like that. Only he had it ten times worse in life.
    I don’t believe at all it twisted him into something THEY accuse him of. It turned him into a far better person than most could ever wish to be, so fragile, but a better man.

    And he was a primary male influence in my life, since I had to look up to others. The guys at Topix thought it strange. But you know what? If I hand someone something that I can ill afford who has nothing on the street, and giving up half my Christmas Day to visit an old lady in the Hospital who hasn’t been well with her nerves, you couldn’t meet a more caring person, I do this and have Michael and his music to thank for, I consider it a win in my books. That was his mission in life, and I can think of no better one.

    Like

  12. December 22, 2012 10:13 pm

    “And this blog seems to be becoming my life story lol”

    Rodrigo, I am very happy that it is. You are very much welcome.

    “all I got was 5 pounds shoved through the door. That to me, was how much I was worth to him”.

    This money shows the true worth of this man – he is worthless, and you are actually lucky that he did not take part in your life. He would have ruined it if he had. You and your wonderful mother who raised you so well should say a big thank you to the Almighty that he freed both of you from this human trash.

    Now that I am reading professional child psychologists I’ve learned a couple of clever things. They say that to develop a child into a positive personality the kid’s negative experience should be turned into a positive one by showing the good points of even the most negative situations. The absence of this worthless guy in your life is exactly the case. You have not lost but actually gained by not having him by your side. Only be prepared that he will reemerge one day, this time with his tail between his legs.

    Of course it is always better to have a full family, but with so many divorces these days and remarriages it is a big rarity. Even if the father is nominally there the relations within the family may be so bad that the constant stress of it takes away all the joy of having both of them. And step parents may also be a problem – I had a step-father who was very hard to live with. He humiliated me, which I fought by silence and taking pride in never allowing him to see me crying despite all my devastation. Eventually we more or less came to terms with each other, but it was hard.

    I’m not bitter, but it had driven me to be somebody who would never see any child go without or suffer any negative feeling. I can’t allow it to go by, because it hurts me.

    It seems to me that only those who have experienced pain themselves are capable of empathy. Michael is the best example.

    “if for not growing up listening to Man In The Mirror and Heal The World, I probably wouldn’t be a half a quarter of what I am now. I have Michael to thank for that.”

    I think each of us will find something to thank Michael for. He has overturned my whole life too, and I don’t regret a single minute of it.

    Like

  13. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 22, 2012 9:05 pm

    VMJ, I agree very much with your perceptive assessment of Michael’s childhood, namely, his “parental deprivation,” touring with his brothers and his father ( a parent in name only, the ‘cruel beast,’ as you say), and his mother at home, “a distant fairy,” whom he idealized. As you say, his tutor Rose was the only supportive, nurturing presence to accompany him on his numerous tours. No wonder he came to love reading and learning. Incidentally, reading IS something you do alone, and I have no doubt it was an escape for him from a demanding, lonely world, as well as a way to be alone and to enrich his mind and knowledge.

    I also agree very much with the astute comparison you draw between the regimented life in the orphanage and the life Michael lived, where there was social maladaptation and disorientation that resulted in not knowing how to function in society as a free individual and also in loneliness for real relationships. As you say, his search for a ‘family’ stems from these lonely years.

    This reminds me of the mannequins he had around Neverland (to keep him from feeling lonely and to remind him of how he grew up surrounded by adults). His looking for substitute families, while totally understandable and ‘normal’ considering his experiences, was probably maladaptive in the long run. I hate to in any way be critical of Michael’s choices, but I have been thinking of the tremendous risks he took in inviting families that he hardly knew to Neverland, families that were not used to his wealth and generosity, and that did turn against him, namely the Arvizos and Chandlers. He was very open and that may have been as a result of this childhood where he had little freedom, no friends, and yet a longing for friendships. Due to all the social disorientation of his youth, when he was on his own at Neverland, he did not act in a ‘savy’ way to protect himself from sharks. He did need, as you say, “rehabilitation” before going out “in the world” and bringing families back to Neverland. He was so vulnerable.

    Like

  14. Rodrigo permalink
    December 22, 2012 9:56 am

    It just goes to show how much Michael related to kids, because he’s always been in the same place they are. And that problem is far more tragic than any one of us could have thought.

    Growing up, I never had a father. I overheard my mother years ago saying that when I was born, all I got was 5 pounds shoved through the door. That to me, was how much I was worth to him. Years later when I met him, I handed the 5 pounds back to him and haven’t made contact since.

    I would always say to people I’d make a better father than he ever could be.

    I’m not bitter, but it had driven me to be somebody who would never see any child go without or suffer any negative feeling. I can’t allow it to go by, because it hurts me. It’s made me become this person who reflects on the sadness that I’ve been through and others must go through. I can’t help but care and be concerned, when others tell me it shouldn’t be my problem. I shouldn’t give my last piece of change to a homeless man on the street, in the freezing rain so he can buy himself a hot cup of coffee, I should have used it on the bus.

    And you know, if for not growing up listening to Man In The Mirror and Heal The World, I probably wouldn’t be a half a quarter of what I am now. I have Michael to thank for that.

    And that’s exactly what Michael was like, only more determined and driven than ever I could be, because he had been through far worse unfortunately.

    And this blog seems to be becoming my life story lol

    Like

  15. December 22, 2012 8:35 am

    “You’re a strong person, Helena.”

    Rodrigo, please don’t overestimate me – there is nothing extraordinary about me and my crises, feelings and emotions – all of us go through these processes, but not all of us tell others about it like I do. This is where the only difference is. Emotions are actually necessary as they help to understand things and reevaluate your previous thoughts and ideas. Every emotional crisis teaches something and then passes and this is the only way to look at them.

    “Looking at that video. We sit here, hoping for this and that that for Christmas, and all that little girl wants is a loving family, which is unlikely to happen for her on December 25th. My heart aches for her.”

    Yes, these children spend their whole lives dreaming of a better future, and when it never comes they eventually break down or get cold, unfeeling and even brutal. Now that I’ve read much more about their situation I’m amazed to find many points of similarity between their problems and the problems Michael Jackson faced as a child and then in his adult life.

    It turns out that even if these children live in more or less satisfactory conditions – are fed, clothed, schooled, entertained, medically taken care of and are even given numerous gifts by kind visitors and benefactors – the first thing they greatly suffer of is deprivation of an individual loving parent. There are many people around them, some are better, some are worse, but they desperately long for being singled out of the mass and be unique to someone. If they see warmth from someone they can form attachments for this person as if for a real mother/father, and it isn’t necessarily their ‘official’ caretaker, but may be anyone – a cleaning woman, or even a volunteer who comes only on occasions but singles out this child with special warmth.

    Michael suffered from parental deprivation very much indeed. He travelled with his brothers and father most of the time. Joe Jackson can be struck off as a parent and the fact that this cruel beast was a father to these children only makes things worse – children expect more of a father than of a care-taker in a state institution. And the mother in Michael’s life was a sort of a distant fairy who was somewhere in his dreams and recollections, but was mostly absent as they travelled while she stayed at home with the girls. The only person with whom Michael could more or less form a unique relationship was his Jewish teacher Rose who accompanied them everywhere on tours. Michael was the youngest and craved for such a unique relationship most and happily he had at least Rose. From what Michael said about her to Rabbi Shmuley she seemed to be a loving person and this probably saved Michael.

    It’s only when I started reading about our orphans that I began to understand Michael’s real problems.

    Children in orphanages are never left alone to themselves – they are always together in a group, they have meals three times a day in a group, go to school in a group, have numerous activities in a group, go on excursions in a group, go for a walk in a group. In fact everything is done in a group and they are not allowed to even go to their room and stay there by themselves. They are never left alone and are never given a single minute of privacy. Deprivation of privacy is not done on purpose, this is simply how it is organized as this way it is easier to keep an eye on them. This brings much discipline and regularity into their lives but makes them terribly dependent on others.

    And when they leave the orphanage they, in full contrast to all their past life, suddenly find themselves totally free. This is when their real problems start. They never had any spare time in their whole life, and have never been alone and now all of a sudden they have all the freedom in the world and no one beside them. They don’t know what to do with their freedom and have no one to rely on any longer. They don’t know the most basic things about individual form of living and are so disadapted that they don’t know how to use a refrigerator – in their orphanages there are no refrigerators, all food was brought from elsewhere or was cooked by the staff, so that the children had no food of their own and no money to buy it for anyway.

    They don’t know how to use the little money they have as they never paid for anything themselves – everything was provided for, and at some point they begin thinking that this is the only way it can ever be. When they receive their first money they spend it within the first three days on totally unnecessary things with nothing left for food. They don’t even know how to clean their flat because in their child-care centers this was done by cleaners and they are somehow sure that someone else should do it as people actually receive money for it – why should they?

    In short at the age of 20 they behave like demanding infants. This is what social disadaptation is all about.

    By the way since they are unable to function on their own and are not used to live alone, they often get together again, living in one flat while the rest of the flats are rented out – and again the same pattern of group living is reproduced. They don’t form families as a result, are unable to work but have all free time in the world with all its negative consequences.

    Michael’s childhood may look different only at first sight while in reality it wasn’t that much different. The only thing you can deduct from Michael’s childhood is overprotection, but all the rest of it was there – harsh discipline, often very cruel one, no spare time and no privacy, always staying in a group of his siblings and never having a chance to be on his own, constant rehearsing, working, travelling. No contacts with anyone else and no other activities except those on stage and not in the best social environment too considering that they had to perform even in sex clubs. Total social disadaptation and disorientation as a result, and only the religious services and associating with normal people there more or less formed a counterbalance to everything else.

    Michael was used to work and this helped him out a lot, but the rest of the signs were there – even up to him trying to reproduce a “group style” with friends and their children substituting for a “family” around him. And since Michael never had a proper family pattern it was extremely difficult for him to form a family of his own.

    Children like that require social rehabilitation and special corrective methods to teach them how to function in a society and acquire its patterns of behavior, as they don’t know the most basic things about ordinary life. This is why Michael was so much longing to see what family life is like and often stayed in other people’s houses. He never had it and wanted to learn how to. This is also how they are now trying to rehabilitate our orphans – by placing them in families before it is too late and before they get totally disadapted, otherwise they will need many years of post-orphanage monitoring and assistance with little result. The state system saved these children from the street where they found themselves in the difficult 90s but created new problems, which now show that only the family pattern works.

    The family is the crux of the whole matter.

    Michael was forced to follow the pattern of life of our social orphans almost to the letter of it – first he was subjected to parent deprivation and harsh discipline in a group, and later he had to close himself up in almost full isolation due to the mass adoration and hysteria around him. And I am not even talking about his illnesses like vitiligo, lupus and a burn which only add to the feeling of isolation which even the best socially adapted person will develop in such circumstances.

    As a result of all that Michael was not socially adapted at all. Add to it some racial problems too and you have soooooooo much of everything that I am totally amazed that Michael turned into a pure, kind and humane man he was.

    Like

  16. Rodrigo permalink
    December 22, 2012 4:32 am

    You’re a strong person, Helena. And you’re right, in this world, you have to be.

    Looking at that video. We sit here, hoping for this and that that for Christmas, and all that little girl wants is a loving family, which is unlikely to happen for her on December 25th. My heart aches for her.

    Like

  17. December 21, 2012 9:40 pm

    “The evil and injustice is unbearable, Helena. But me, you, and other’s out there who are fighting the same fight CANNOT afford to fall apart. It’s easier said than done. We’ve both experienced the evil and injustice on a grand scale, greater than what we started with.” – Rodrigo

    I am not falling apart – every crisis after the initial turmoil brings about better understanding of things and sometimes even helps to make a leap forward.

    Three years ago Michael’s death brought about a huge crisis in my life – it was a shock to realize the terrible injustice done to an exceptionally pure, innocent and harmless man whose only desire was to do good to the world. And see what we did to him in return… Three years of non-stop investigation has made me more than sure that Michael Jackson was completely innocent. I assure you that I can write a hundred more new posts to prove this point and shatter every remaining allegation into pieces.

    But suddenly a new crisis came along – research of all the circumstances around Michael Jackson opened up a terrible picture of at least two more processes taking place now. The first process is a totally despicable behavior of profit-seeking and hypocritical media which creates a smokescreen of “fight against pedophilia” by continuing to degrade innocent Michael and the hordes of lazy and ignorant people who believe their lies.

    And the second process is the erosion of basic morals of the society by real pedophiles who are very successful in sexualization children and are working to bring down the last barriers to pedophilia with the help of pseudo-scientists like Alfred Kinsey.

    The Pennsylvania University report of 2001/02 (http://es.scribd.com/doc/78886345/The-Commercial-Sexual-Exploitation-of-Children-In-the-U-S-Canada-and-Mexico-Complete-CSEC-020220) shows that pedophilia is spreading like the plague after Kinsey sowed the first seeds and his followers then promoted his pervertive ideas. Now we are reaping the rotten fruit of what they did and are still doing in the form of numerous Saviles, Sanduskys and thousands of ordinary family men who are not above at least occasional sex with underage children if such services are offered on the “market”.

    For information about it please see the section of Pennsylvania University report about the so-called “transient” males including members of the military, long-distance truck drivers, seasonal workers, conventioneers, sex tourists and “opportunistic” exploiters (i.e., personas who will sexually abuse whoever is available for sex including children) and the scale of the problem.

    I will post some pieces from that report one day and they will show to you (same as they did to me) that most of child-abuse cases take place within families, which is why children run away from homes and then their life goes further downhill with drugs, survival sex and diseases adding to the picture. When they find themselves in the street various “opportunistic” exploiters use these children for their pleasure – however the starting point for ruining these young lives is still in the families, and very often in quite prosperous ones too.

    Though the prospect of being abused even in a family is real, an even worse situation is when thousands of children are kept in child-care centers and have never known a family life at all. So adoption does remain the only option for these children and a way to provide a better future for them. Not all children kept in such centers are ill but all of them are traumatized by not having parents of their own. Many of them have a disastrous past and the forced need to live the first 18 years of their life in various state institutions doesn’t make things much better.

    So when we choose between an (adoptive) family which sometimes may be a risk to a child and similar dangers faced by the kid in child-care centers, we find ourselves between Scilla and Charybdis where every wrong move may result in a huge damage to a child – placing the kid in a wrong family may do enormous harm and leaving the kid in a special institution forever will surely do harm too.

    I’ve read the statistics and found out that even if the child lives in an ideal child-care center and is very well taken care of there, at the age of 18 all of them have to go out into life which is like open sea to them – they feel helpless in most ordinary circumstances as they have never lived alone.

    The situation is slowly getting better with the institutions themselves, but even if the child avoids the dangers of being exposed to harm, cruelty and abuse within the state walls, the biggest problem of these children is their further adaptation to society. When they leave their state institutions which was the only home they ever had, they feel all alone, have little money, and no social skills whatsoever. They don’t know how to handle even the little money they have, as they have never paid for the food, clothes, or utilities by themselves.

    They are fearful of others but being essentially helpless, they become easy prey to all sort of crooks who know how to win their trust. These predators cheat them out of the housing provided to them by the state, and many of the graduates of child-care institutions soon end up homeless as a result. It was with great joy that I learned that all graduates of Moscow child-care centers are provided with flats when they reach the age of 18, but the terrible news is that many of them are unable to keep the flats for themselves as they get easily cheated out of them.

    In the provincial areas housing is a much bigger problem due to scarce financing and children have to wait long until they are provided with a corner of their own. Some are allotted a room in a flat shared with another graduate, sometimes their neighbor is a total stranger, and who knows what this neighbor may turn out to be?

    Up till now adoption of these children by Russians accounted for two thirds of the whole number, while foreigners accounted for at least one third (if not more) and most of the adoptive parents were Americans. Now that our authorities have banned adoption of Russian children by the US the chances that these children will ever have a family and a stable future have greatly diminished, alas. The chance is left for all the others though and it will be horrible if this chance is lost, in my opinion. Our authorities can close this channel at any time now.

    I’ve spent several past days on adoption sites and it is with much trepidation, fear, doubt, but also hope that I will provide to you videos of children who in 5 or 6 years from now will leave the child-care centers and will find themselves facing our social environment which is not easy to survive in, especially for them. Given that at least part of those who closely monitor us may be pedophiles making such a step on my part may be very reckless.

    So let me address only those of you whom I trust and know to be good and reliable people from my correspondence with you over Michael Jackson’s issues – please make enquiries among your relatives, friends, colleagues and neighbors who are trustworthy people, and ask them if they want to adopt a young teenager in order to give the kid family warmth and a stable future. If there is such a desire and these people are ready for the difficulties this decision will surely involve I will be ready to help them in communicating with the necessary authorities.

    At the moment I will translate only one video. The girl seems to me a complete blessing:

    Vika (full name Victoria): My name is Vika, I am eleven years old.
    Voiceover: Vika is a born actress. When she is on stage in school performances she behaves absolutely natural and doesn’t feel self-conscious. On the contrary she opens up there and shows all her talents in full.
    Vika 0:20: This is a mouse made of seed beeds. I made it last Monday.
    Voiceover: Vika sings in a melodic voice, and has a good ear always hitting the right note. When she dances she gracefully repeats the dance moves she has learned. In short she surely has a talent for performing.
    Vika is a gentle and open child. When she is on duty in class she performs her chores well. She tidies up her bed each morning and accurately puts her clothes on hangers. She is very responsive to tenderness, thanks you for each word of encouragement and gives you her tenderness back.
    She also has a very valuable quality, worthy of respect. When she sees some injustice, Vika will not complain or report to anyone, but if you ask her about what happened, she will not be afraid to tell the truth. You may be sure that she will say everything as it really was without any exaggeration or unfairness. This is a very honest girl who sincerely hopes that her mother and father will soon come and take her into their family.
    Vika 1:11 “If I am adopted I hope that my family will be good, and that during school holidays we will travel, and in summer go to the beach, to the sea or some other country. And I dream that my family will be the best”.

    * * *

    There are many children like that. The thought of this girl spending six more years in a child-care center and sailing in the open sea all alone after that makes me take this unprecedented move.

    This is the first time I am doing anything of the kind and am trembling like a schoolgirl myself.

    I have no idea what past troubles this girl went through and what future difficulties might be awaiting her future parents, but the feeling that this cannot be left as it is does not give me quiet either.

    Let us do something about it. May the Almighty help us.

    P.S. Since this text is absolutely out of place in this post, I am adding it to the post of December 19 about children.

    Like

  18. Truth Prevail permalink
    December 20, 2012 10:28 pm

    @Linda

    ” It’s sad that so many fans aren’t supporting him”

    They do support him they just don’t support the estate decisions.

    “The album is his message and the voice is his. The product is not finished, but still the same message that he always tried to get out. I don’t understand why anybody that knows MJ’S music would even question it.”

    Really? hmm let me see maybe because his so called voice was so manipulated it’s obvious why any fan would question it and the fact his own children said it is NOT their father.

    “He wrote these songs with the intentions of us hearing them. Sadly his time ran out, so someone else had to do some fill-ins to their best abilities. Message is the same.”

    This is the same Michael Jackson who did not allow his songs once to be part of a game because he felt the quality in which his songs would be interpreted in this game console was inferior and did NOT want the public to hear his songs in this state.

    I was not part of a certain boycott but i do understand the people who took a stance against it they wanted answers.

    Like

  19. Rodrigo permalink
    December 20, 2012 10:26 am

    It’s a horrific thing that you’ve witnessed, Helena. From what you’ve shown us. It’s hard to believe that this is the dark side of the world what we have to live in.

    Kinsey and Savile were monsters. Both were celebrated in their own ways. Both were shielded during their sick acts. Whereas Michael was crucified for nothing.

    The evil and injustice is unbearable, Helena. But me, you, and other’s out there who are fighting the same fight CANNOT afford to fall apart. It’s easier said than done. We’ve both experienced the evil and injustice on a grand scale, greater than what we started with.

    To think monsters like them were considered heroes, and the real hero was considered a monster.

    And to finally realize just how sick and evil the world can be is disturbing. We can account for how good it can be. But I used to believe that the good outweighed the bad…now I think differently.

    But we shouldn’t let it destroy our quest to put things right. I won’t let it.

    I’m going to quote Christopher Reeve, one of my idols.

    ¨A hero is an ordinary individual who finds the strength to preserve and endure in spite of overwhelming obstacles.¨

    I always remember that when life gets on top of me.

    Like

  20. December 20, 2012 3:42 am

    “Almost all Russian-Finnish couples with children chose to live in Finland.”

    Of course they did. The emigration from Russia is very high and has been only on the rise, especially since Putin came to power again. I myself would have left already, only at my age it is difficult to do. But people leave the country in search of respect for their human dignity and rights, so it is an extreme shock for them to find that in another place they are treated even worse than in their own. At least at home their children could not be taken away from them so easily, while in this case four children including a newly-born baby were taken from their mother and (as we are told) due to some spanking done by a Finnish father. I wonder why they didn’t take all the Jacksons’ children from Katherine because of the abuse by their father Joe – which wasn’t just spanking as we know.

    “I know that in Russia Putin has made much trouble in order to discredit other countries.”

    Over here they always make much trouble to discredit other countries, only the majority of the population learned to divide it by a hundred. People are extremely distrustful of what officials say and often interpret their words in the opposite meaning. At least this is what I always do.

    However in this case numbers speak for themselves – already 101 children were taken away from Russian mothers in Finland. It is simply degrading for our women not to mention what a tragedy it is for them as mothers. Are they regarded as a sort of birth-giving machines working for the benefit of the host country?

    I myself have two friends living in Finland and am absolutely sure that they are now in a panic and after weighing up all the risks they may consider coming back. If European authorities wanted to stop emigration from Russia they are extremely successful in doing it. Putin doesn’t want emigration either, so such decisions only help him and in a very effective way too. We find ourselves in a situation when we both cannot stay and cannot leave.

    “The foreign specialists stated that these conflicts mirror problems within Russia.”

    Our problems are gigantic, and most of them concern suppression of any form of initiative, which results in people being unable to use their intellectual and business abilities and human potential in general – which brings about a drinking problem, especially among men. But the woman in question does not seem to have that problem. Our women generally drink much less. They have children to raise and cannot spend money and time on that nonsense. As to foreign specialists – why don’t they help find the reasons of behavior of that killer boy in the US in order to prevent such tragedies in the future, instead of fighting a harmless Russian woman?

    Like

  21. December 20, 2012 2:20 am

    “Because researching the likes of Jimmy Savile over the months has made me open my eyes to a whole new world, and it’s not a one where any child can survive. It’s wrong and needs to change.”

    Rodrigo, I’ll keep it short as it is the middle of the night here. What you are saying is the very essence of the problem. Your study of Savile and my studies of Alfred Kinsey’s doings and that Pennsylvania University report on child abuse have indeed opened up to us a whole new world, which we were not quite ready to see.

    It was indeed a shock to find that child-abuse is so deep-rooted, so common and so wide-spread. Seeing it with our own eyes makes all those accusations of Michael Jackson totally incredible. He was accused of some “tickling” and “on the outside of the clothes” too and on “two occasions” only, and even those two occasions were totally false – and all this time crimes like Kinsey’s were not only accepted, no, they were glorified!

    And Savile and Sandusky are the natural results of all that glorification with sham “fight” against pedophilia being carried out at the expense of poor and completely innocent Michael Jackson.

    Realizing now that what was black is actually white, and what was white is actually black is the shock that both of us are trying to survive now.

    Like

  22. December 20, 2012 1:58 am

    “All that reading about horrible things going on all over the world can get you down, but PLEASE don’t allow it to put you into a deep depression. Whatever you do, please don’t shut down this blog again.”

    Linda, I don’t know how to thank you for your support. Lately I’ve been so angry and harsh that I don’t deserve even half of all the good you say about me. No, I am not going to shut the blog and it isn’t even depression that makes it so difficult, though all this is indeed depressive.

    It is just a terrible turmoil of thoughts and emotions which resulted from frustration and disappointment with various things I believed in and no longer believe in now – like your media for example. It does not mean that I’ve started to believe our media or our system – no, absolutely not, but it was really frustrating for me to find out that things “on the other side” leave much to be desired too.

    As a result of this disappointment one can end up neither here nor there, and this suspended state is where I am indeed now and am trying to get out of.

    Like

  23. December 19, 2012 4:50 pm

    Below comment were meant for:MJ childred are the only reaso,, sorry…

    Like

  24. December 19, 2012 4:43 pm

    Nowadays finnish children are not adopted anywhere.Severy handicapped children are kept with the family, only attend special programs if necessary and for their benefit.

    Like

  25. December 19, 2012 4:38 pm

    Helena, you have to know the both sides of a story ot that family to be able to judge. Nobody removes children for the fun of it.I know that in Russia Putin has made much trouble in order to discredit other countries. The foreign specialists stated that these conflicts mirror problems within Russia.There has to be a mutually agreed upon procedure that both parties honor. Putin does not like that here health, family services and schools are of a high standard. For reasons you certainly understand these cases are not publicised in the press. Also you don´t know if the removal was temporary. Allmost all Russian-Finnish couples with children chose to live in Finland.

    Like

  26. Linda permalink
    December 19, 2012 10:42 am

    @Helena

    all this is simply impossible to live with.

    Helena, I feel your pain. We all feel your pain. You do so much research, and in doing so, you uncover a lot of tragedy. All that reading about horrible things going on all over the world can get you down, but PLEASE don’t allow it to put you into a deep depression. That is dangerous for you and all the people you influence.

    We have to feel for people that are suffering, or we wouldn’t be human or have God’s love in our hearts, But The last thing God wants for us is to be depressed. You feel for suffering humanity, you do as much as you can to help everyone you can and you pray. Then you follow God’s word.

    Philippians 4:8
    King James Version (KJV)
    Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, THINK ON THESE THINGS.

    There comes a time when you have to turn off all the bad and think good thoughts. Do your grieving, then get your mind back on all the good that is in the world. The more you think about and talk about any situation, whether it is good or bad, the bigger it gets in your mind. Your thoughts and words will control your life.

    You’re doing a great job with your site here. You have my utmost respect and admiration. I think you are a strong person who has gone through a lot this past year. You’ve bounced back and survived ridicule, persecution and loss of friendships, but think about all the friends you have here and new friends I see are being added. Don’t fret about the losses, dwell on the positives. They are many. Think on these things.

    Whatever you do, please don’t shut down this blog again. I need it and so do a few other people. If you need to take a break from writing for a while, that’s ok, we understand, but the rest of us can at least keep communicating here, and you can jump in whenever you feel like it. Elephant skin, right?

    Michael was a treasured gift to the world. I don’t think you realize it, but so are you. We all have a calling, a ministry. I believe this is yours. I know I’ve quoted this verse before, but I have to again, “To whom much is given, much is required. ” But God also said he wouldn’t put more on you than you can bear.

    Love you Helena and pray God’s strength to you.

    Like

  27. Rodrigo permalink
    December 19, 2012 5:33 am

    There is so much evil and suffering in the world. It’ll never die.
    But we, as decent human beings, all have to do our part to fight and suppress it.

    If MJ haters think dedicating their time and lives to fight Michael’s memory and us for saluting that memory is a ‘good cause’…they can go hang.

    We, Michael’s fans, supporters and just decent human beings, have to turn our attention to a real and worthwhile fight on our hands. To protect and save those who cannot stand up for themselves.

    Because researching the likes of Jimmy Savile over the months has made me open my eyes to a whole new world, and it’s not a one where any child can survive. It’s wrong and needs to change.

    Michael fought all his life to help children and the world. We’ve spent our time and lives fighting to defend him. Now lets fight for what he fought for and what we should all fight for, a better world. It should go without saying.

    Anything that we see that could make a difference, even a little bit, we should do all we can for it.

    Because I don’t want my children, or anybody else’s, to grow up in this sick, crazy messed up world.

    Make that change…

    Like

  28. December 19, 2012 1:27 am

    “Ms. Judith Reisman deserves a Great thank you. Can some body send her a letter or card as a thank you from us bloggers of VMJ?”

    Kaarin, Dr. Judith Reisman deserves a Monument and a Page in history for fighting for the truth so long and bringing all of us to our senses. We must really thank her, and one day we will.

    Guys, I must confess to you that now I am going through a terrible crisis. The latest events have turned me into a nervous wreck – a talk about mad professor Kinsey and his mad effect on Western society; the Pennsylvania report about sexual abuse of children in North America which I was retyping swallowing tears on the way – most of the children are abused in families, the abused form an army of street children who flock to sun-and-sand cities where fathers of families flock too for sex with the young; shooting 20 innocent children by a “harmless” guy who smashed his computer and for some reason started killing; his mother who had 5 guns and spent her time at a shooting range instead of trying to adapt her son to life; her own death; no one disclosing what ‘plans’ the authorities had for him and why his mother took him out of school though he had brains good enough for a college; and nobody even trying to analyze the inner reasons why all this happened, except those on the surface which are guns of course, but this is too obvious an evil even to discuss it …

    On the other hand we have our “parliament” now approving a law not allowing adoption of Russian children by the US people and I don’t know what to think about it as adopted children die one after another after horrendous wounds and sexual abuse from men and women in some US families, but on the other hand our own statistics show deaths of children in Russia from the hands of their biological parents at the rate of 1800 children a year (never knew it); the case in Finland of 4 children including a newborn taken away from a caring Russian mother who married a Finn – the father slapped a girl on her back with his hand and all four children were taken away from their mother in accordance with European norms…

    In other words life has suddenly focused on one single problem – children and I cannot think of anything else, even MJ.

    I have no solutions. All I can say is that these problems are simply impossible to bear – all this child abuse is impossible, all these politics are impossible, all these innocent deaths are impossible, all this human cruelty, misunderstanding, lies, hypocrisy, inability to find proper solutions – all this is simply impossible to live with.

    Please look at these reports yourself and think what can be done about it:

    The Commercial Sexual Exploitation of Children In The U.S., Canada and Mexico – report made by Pennsylvania University 2001/2002:
    http://es.scribd.com/doc/78886345/The-Commercial-Sexual-Exploitation-of-Children-In-the-U-S-Canada-and-Mexico-Complete-CSEC-020220

    Adoptee abuse cases per sending country – http://poundpuplegacy.org/node/46524

    Like

  29. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 18, 2012 10:03 pm

    Thanks, Linda, I agree with you 1000%.

    Like

  30. Linda permalink
    December 18, 2012 10:31 am

    “When I listen to what they offer us today I see that the “worst” of Michael’s is better than the “best” of what they do now, with very rare exceptions.

    As far as MJ’S last album, considered by so many fans to be crap, is so much better than what is out there today. I often watch top ten videos, and I can barely get through the first three and change channels. It’s sad that so many fans aren’t supporting him. The haters have caused a division in the ranks, and so many fans don’t even know what to believe anymore. All you have to do is listen to the message of the songs. The album is his message and the voice is his. The product is not finished, but still the same message that he always tried to get out. I don’t understand why anybody that knows MJ’S music would even question it. I’m still waiting for the next one.

    He wrote these songs with the intentions of us hearing them. Sadly his time ran out, so someone else had to do some fill-ins to their best abilities. Message is the same.

    Like

  31. December 17, 2012 10:11 pm

    Ms. Judith Reisman deserves a Great thank you. Can some body send her a letter or card as a thank you from us bloggers of VMJ?.

    Like

  32. December 17, 2012 10:04 pm

    Michael is on his way to being vindicated already.And this despite the Sullivan book.The world would still need him badly when slavery, commerce in children and humans is on an all time high.The very twarted and loopsided economy no doubt bears some responsibility for this.Where ever poverty is widespread children are sold for sexslaves and many boy-children are kidnapped to be child soldiers. And so little is written about this.
    Also Ms. Judith Reiman deserves much thank for working against such evil as described below.

    Like

  33. December 16, 2012 12:06 am

    Here is some news:

    Lisa Campbell will present “Michael Jackson: The Complete Story” on Catherine Gross’s Blog Talk Radio show today, on Saturday, December 15, 2012 at 6 p.m. CST http://www.blogtalkradio.com/a-place-in-your-heart/2012/12/15/lisa-campbell-presents-michael-jackson-the-complete-story

    David Edwards has sent me more information about it:

    Campbell will be discussing her new book “The Complete Story of the King of Pop”, which is now available as a Kindle eBook for only $8.99! http://www.amazon.com/Michael-Jackson-Complete-Story-King/dp/0988413019

    If you don’t own an Amazon Kindle, you can download the Kindle App for PC for free, and use it to read any Kindle eBook: http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.html?ie=UTF8&docId=1000426311 Here’s the Kindle for Mac app: http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.html?ie=UTF8&docId=1000464931

    Don’ forget to “like” Campbell’s fan page on Facebook! https://www.facebook.com/pages/Lisa-D-Campbell/218521298270820?fref=ts And here’s her personal page: https://www.facebook.com/lisa.campbell.90281?fref=ts

    Also, for those of you who missed Joe Vogel’s Bad 25 interview with Marty on Blog Talk TV, you can listen to it here: http://www.mediafire.com/?i85mw5cibf1ev

    Like

  34. Tatum Marie permalink
    December 15, 2012 11:41 pm

    Kaarin, I am sure of it too. From the very start of it there was something extremely strange, artificial, unnatural about all of them going after Michael only, as if he was the only one who could have been accused of this crime.

    Amen to that statement. Once the producers at TMZ went over the FBI files, even Harvey Levin thought it was strange and referred to the case as extraordinary when considering how many agencies were just out to get Michael with no proof.

    Like

  35. December 15, 2012 11:09 pm

    “You could find it through MJJ.777.com, Nov 20:th. That site is down for now. The whole lyrics could be found through that site.” -kaarin

    Why is MJJ.777 down??? I’ve tried to open it but it would not. Who knows what the situation is like?

    Below are the lyrics of “We’ve had enough” by Michael Jackson. What a powerful song! And after that some wonder why they harassed him? This song alone was enough for the establishment to develop a hate for him and exert all that pressure through various means, including prosecution and the media.

    In my country they would have done the same, only in a less sophisticated manner and a much quicker time. Over here they don’t listen to anything people tell them – every little protest is nipped in the bud and brings about only repression. And there is much hypocrisy too. And fools.

    Just saying.

    Love was taken from a young life
    And no one told her why
    Her direction has a dimlight
    From one more violent crime

    She innocently questioned why
    Why her father had to die
    She asked the men in blue
    How is it that you get to choose
    Who will live and who will die
    Did God say that you could decide?
    You saw he didn’t run
    And that my daddy had no gun

    In the middle of a village
    Way in a distant land
    Lies a poor boy with his broken toy
    Too young to understand

    He’s awaken, ground is shakin
    His father grabs his hand
    Screaming, crying, his wife’s dying
    Now he’s left to explain

    He innocently questioned why
    Why his mother had to die
    What did these soldiers come here for?
    If they’re for peace, why is there war?

    Did God say that they could decide
    Who will live and who will die?
    All my mama ever did
    Was try to take care of her kids

    We’re innocently standing by
    Watching people lose their lives
    It seems as if we have no voice
    It’s time for us to make a choice

    Only God could decide
    Who will live and who will die
    There’s nothing that can’t be done
    If we raise our voice as one

    They got to hear it from me
    They got to hear it from you
    They got to hear it from us
    We can’t take it
    We’ve already had enough

    They got to hear it from me
    They got to hear it from you
    They got to hear it from us

    We can’t take it
    We’ve already had enough

    They got to hear it from me
    They got to hear it from you
    They got to hear it from you baby

    We can’t take it
    We’ve already had enough

    Deep in my soul baby

    Deep in your soul and let God decide

    Deep in my soul

    It’s up to me and i’m still alive

    They got to hear it from us

    We can’t take it
    We’ve already had enough

    It’s going down baby
    Just let God decide,

    It’s going on baby
    Just let God decide

    Deep in my soul baby

    We’ve already had enough

    They got to hear it from me
    They got to hear it from you
    They got to hear it from us

    We can’t, we can’t
    We’ve already had enough

    Like

  36. December 15, 2012 9:15 pm

    Thet´s right, it is this song. On that site it was a bit more, a video from the war in Iraq.
    Just wondered if that was too hot for some.

    Like

  37. t6deja6igusmjj permalink
    December 15, 2012 7:44 pm

    do you mean We’ve Had Enough

    Like

  38. December 15, 2012 6:27 pm

    Anybody ever heard a song by Michael starting: Love was taken from a young life.. You could find it throgh MJJ.777.com, Nov 20:th. That site is down for now. The whole lyrics could be found through that site.

    Like

  39. Truth Prevail permalink
    December 15, 2012 6:00 pm

    @VindicateMJ

    “When I listen to what they offer us today I see that the “worst” of Michael’s is better than the “best” of what they do now, with very rare exceptions. The overall impression is that of garbage where excellence in music and lyrics was replaced by a huge number of butts and naked bodies forced on the viewers”

    Yes i agree with you Michael’s demo’s are better than most completed tracks by some other artists.and certainly better than most of the stuff out today.

    Like

  40. December 15, 2012 1:54 pm

    “So sad and sorry for the terrible tragedy in Newtown,CT.”

    Kaarin, yes, very sad. But in the context of our discussion of Kinsey’s “legacy” it does not look to me like something out of the way. I’ve read that the neighbors said about that 20-year old guy that he was “wasn’t quite well” and that his mother was “very rigid”. She also used to work as a volunteer in that school where he later killed people. He was clearly taking his revenge on his mother by shooting at innocent children and teachers in the same school. All of it is springing from some abnormal relations between him and his parents. In this case it was probably his mother’s rigidness, unflexibility and lack of love which resulted in the tragedy.

    Michael was right. It is love that’s missing. Love would have found a way out even with the most difficult child. And then the tragedy would have been averted.

    P.S.
    No sooner did I press the button to post this when a music TV channel showed my favorite Michael’s “History remix”. Once I even made a video adding lyrics to it. The following words suddenly stood out to fit the moment:

    How many people have to cry
    The song of pain and grief across the land

    And how many children have to die
    Before we stand to lend a healing hand

    And how many struggles must there be
    Before we choose to live the Prophet’s plan

    Everybody sing…

    All nations sing
    Let’s harmonize all around the world

    Like

  41. December 15, 2012 1:31 pm

    “they should have went into the vault and released a compilation of unreleased completed tracks surely that would have been better instead of someone inferior trying to remake Michael Jackson songs.”

    Truth Prevail, for sure they will release a compilation of completed tracks too – at least I hope they will.

    But I’ll tell you what will happen to these new albums if some vigilant Michael’s fans don’t change their ways. They will say that those completed songs are not worth releasing either as Michael rejected them himself and did not include them in the earlier albums. So he didn’t think them perfect and worthy of release. And since they are not perfect the public should not hear them – Michael was a perfectionist after all.

    You see that with naysayers it always ends in the same way no matter what songs you take.

    All of it is only pretexts and lies spread by Michael’s haters and upheld by unsuspecting Michael’s fans. Haters do it to avert the public from listening to Michael’s songs in the same way they did it while he was alive. The primary thing they don’t want people to hear is Michael’s message – they don’t want Michael to influence today’s audience with his lyrics in the first place.

    When I listen to what they offer us today I see that the “worst” of Michael’s is better than the “best” of what they do now, with very rare exceptions. The overall impression is that of garbage where excellence in music and lyrics was replaced by a huge number of butts and naked bodies forced on the viewers.

    I am no hypocrite but I am sick and tired of it. It’s boring, monotonous and dulls your senses. I personally wake up only when I see some humor inserted into a song.

    Like

  42. December 15, 2012 12:11 pm

    “Whatever he started in Ireland with Will. I. am. Etc, remains to be seen. What ended up as the ‘Cascio’ music on the ‘Michael’ CD are in effect manufactured ‘jingles’ in the home of the Cascio’s that Michael would never ever, ever have put out for public consumsion … This, as you know, would never have happened if he was alive. I have my own particular opinion on this family..”

    SaraJane, this requires a long conversation and we have been through this before. It just surprises me that you are so sure. Especially about the family. I wrote an angry and vehement post about it exactly two years ago: https://vindicatemj.wordpress.com/2010/12/07/on-true-and-fake-michael-jacksons-friends/

    As to the Michael CD all we need to do is change the status of this album from “finished” to “unfinished” and regard it as such. Finished songs are one thing while unfinished are another.

    All world famous composers of the past had their unfinished music made public. Mozart and his unfinished Requiem is the most vivid example. Mozart fans do not object. Though in order to make it public another musician had to finish it off.

    Like

  43. SaraJane permalink
    December 15, 2012 5:47 am

    VMJ. Helena,
    With the utmost respect, for this site and for you, and others – which I truly believe do a fantastic job, I have to say this –
    SOME of the songs on the ‘Michael’ album are definitely NOT Michael Jackson material in any shape or form.
    They are neither ‘ garbage or junk’ but they do not have MJ’s ‘final’ input/ stamp, and they have been manipulated on a major scale.
    If his input ( MJ’s) was ever there in those ‘Cascio’ tracks that is NOT where he finally decided to put his heart and soul and his music – That was not MJ.. Whatever he started in Ireland with Will. I. am. Etc, remains to be seen.
    What ended up as the ‘Cascio’ music on the ‘Michael’ CD are in effect manufactured ‘jingles’ in the home of the Cascio’s that Michael would never ever, ever have put out for public consumsion …
    This, as you know, would never have happened if he was alive.
    I have my own particular opinion on this family..

    Like

  44. December 15, 2012 3:28 am

    So sad and sorry for the trrible tragedy in Newtown,CT.

    Like

  45. December 15, 2012 3:17 am

    It seems to me that the unfinished tracks should also be made available to the public and particularly those who do study Michaels music.
    I understand that the Estate needs to make money to pay off debts, it would be fair though to somehow mark that they are Michael´l music, but completed by..whoever it was.
    Kinsey,the movie I saw and don´t even specially remember,.just that it made me very depressed ,like everything” Kinsey” does..Animals are not perverse.Some humans are..

    Like

  46. Truth Prevail permalink
    December 15, 2012 2:52 am

    It’s a bit silly to say the “Michael” album was Michael’s last album because the songs were left unfinished and i pretty much believe Michael would NOT want his unfinished material released he was a perfectionist everything needed to sound just the way he heard it in his head it’s more like a estate project than Michael himself because he could not give it his blessing.

    I have thought how many Michael songs that are finished and just waiting to be released they are because why all the fuss running around by the estate trying to find any recording with bits of Michael on it. When they should have went into the vault and released a compilation of unreleased completed tracks surely that would have been better instead of someone inferior trying to remake Michael Jackson songs.

    You need to understand the fans who did not support the “Michael” album had good reason too they weren’t just against it for no reason. Michael was a artist in the real sense NOT a statistic it’s not about trying to get anything with the name Michael Jackson on it to number one on the charts it’s about quality those fan’s are just thinking about what Michael would want and remembering the perfectionist that he was.

    Like

  47. December 15, 2012 1:43 am

    “No doubt, had Michael lived to complete them, they would have been brilliant. As they stand, they are certainly a far cry from brilliant but by no means are they “garbage” or “junk” or any of the other insulting labels that were unfairly hurled. As for the voice, parts of those songs still “bug” me when I listen but it is not because I don’t believe it’s him; it’s just the over processing that irks me most. “

    Oh Raven, over here another subject suddenly arose – important but extremely hard – so I am happy you give me a chance to relax and return this post to where it was at the beginning. Of course those tracks would have been brilliant if Michael had lived to finish them – they have all the makings of it like a rough diamond, only uncut. Now the songs are over-processed and this is indeed what irritates most, not even the voice which we can live with after all. Hopefully one day someone else takes these songs and restyles them, probably using some new technology.

    Words like “garbage” in respect of these songs hurt like hell. You know, I almost burst out crying when I realized how joyful and enthusiastic Michael was when recording them and how eager he was to share them with the people. And the scorn the album got as a result…

    I hope that those who spoke with such contempt about the album will realize one day that they scorned not the album – they scorned Michael himself shattering into pieces all his joyous hopes.

    Like

  48. December 15, 2012 12:58 am

    “I am now more sure than ever that “Michael This or That” was splashed all over the news to cover something dark or evil beneath.”

    Kaarin, I am sure of it too. From the very start of it there was something extremely strange, artificial, unnatural about all of them going after Michael only, as if he was the only one who could have been accused of this crime.

    You remember Corey Feldman, who was interviewed by police detectives about Michael? He could not recollect a single suspicious episode concerning MJ. Instead Corey blurted out something like: “I would have known it if I had seen something as I was molested myself by another guy”. Then he actually gave the name of that guy in Hollywood, but the police … simply did not pay attention.

    They were not interested in a real pedophile! And after that some people wonder why Corey Feldman does not give the name of his abuser now? He DID give his name, but no one even checked!

    All the time while Michael was investigated by two District Attorneys and two sheriffs of Santa Barbara and L.A., and the Department for Family and Children Services, and the FBI and for so many years too (resulting in nothing), real sex offenders like Sandusky and Jimmy Savile were free to do whatever they wanted! And how many more hundreds or thousands of them were doing the same with everyone closing their eyes on it?

    Why were they? Because Kinsey actually taught all of them that “anything goes in matters of sex”. One morality served as a beautiful window for the public, while another morality was actually for “inner consumption”.

    Where was the media all this time? The media was lulling the public into thinking that “pedophilia was under control” as they were demonstrating it on the example of poor Jackson. But these media screams were actually covering up for the systematic erosion job done by the followers of Kinsey and those who were fooled by him.

    They just used Michael Jackson as a sacrificial lamb – in order to divert public attention from what was going on behind their backs.

    “Michael must have had some sense of this. Except maybe for his early youth, he was well read and informed.”

    I think he felt that it was all around him, but he could not place it on anyone in particular and didn’t understand why they were doing it to him.

    Like

  49. December 15, 2012 12:15 am

    “About Reisman, the Wikipedia site does give info about her…. When the government refuses to fund sex education in schools and yet wants to fund the teaching of abstinence in schools, I have a problem with that.”

    Aldebaran, please don’t believe everything Wikipedia tells you. I also have problems with some things like the abstinence forced on people by religious fanatics or bans on premarital sex for example, but this has nothing to do with what we are discussing here.

    We are talking of Kinsey’s criminal practices in using and encouraging pedophiles in their crimes against children. His conclusions from all that experience is another story. Though I am not sure his conclusions about people being animals only is correct (we are animals, but we are only half-animals so to say), this is still a separate issue to discuss.

    For the moment here is an excerpt from Kinsey’s biography, written by James H.Jones. The biographer is describing Kinsey’s relations with the pedophile named Mr.X (real name was Green, the one who molested 800 children).

    Please remember that this is written in the official Kinsey biography:

    Kinsey began his courtship of Mr. X in the fall of 1943… [He] correctly divined that Mr. X longed for recognition and approval. From the beginning, therefore, Kinsey treated him like a colleague, a fellow seeker of truth who had compiled valuable scientific data. In a letter that combined flattery and praise, Kinsey wrote, “I congratulate you on the research spirit which has led you to collect data over these many years.”…[H]e was “very much interested in your account [of certain illegal behaviors Mr. X had practiced in hotels, such as drilling holes in walls to film people engaged in sex in adjacent rooms].…

    There are difficulties enough in this undertaking to make it highly desirable for all of us who are at work to keep in touch. I hope we keep in touch with you.” Much to Kinsey’s delight, the materials arrived by return mail, the first of many shipments over the next several years. “Your instant willingness to cooperate and your comprehension of the problems involved in these studies make me all the more anxious to meet you,” replied Kinsey.… “Mrs. Kinsey and I should be glad to entertain you in our home.… Everything that you accumulated must find its way into scientific channels.”

    Kinsey offered to cover the expense of bringing the serial child molester to his family home in Bloomington, and expressly hoped “to work out further plans for cooperating with you.” Jones continues:

    Kinsey’s benign view of pedophilia does not fully explain why he was so taken with Mr. X. To fathom their relationship, one must understand that Kinsey considered Mr. X not merely a sexual phenomenon but a scientific treasure. Privately, Kinsey had long believed that human beings in a state of nature were basically pansexual. Absent social constraints, he conjectured, “natural man” would commence sexual activity early in life, enjoy intercourse with both sexes [any and all ages] eschew fidelity, indulge in a variety of behaviors, and be much more sexually active in general for life. To Kinsey, Mr. X was living proof of this theory.
    Describing Kinsey’s joy in discovery, Nowlis [a junior Kinsey staffer] declared, “This was like finding the gall wasp which would establish not a new species but a new genus” ..…As Nowlis put it, Kinsey looked upon Mr. X as a “hero” because “the guy had the courage and the ingenuity and the sexual energy and the curiosity to have this fantastic multi-year odyssey … and never get caught.”

    http://www.drjudithreisman.com/archives/chapter7.pdf

    It is INSANE.

    Like

  50. December 14, 2012 11:17 pm

    “Kinsey & Co is one of the largest scams and crimes of the century. Many lives, families and childrens lives have been destroyed. … The Kinsey scandal needs to be revealed and stopped. Does that institute still bear his name? If so it is a shame.”

    Kaarin, I agree, it does look like the largest scam of the century. All it needs to be revealed is what Dr. Reisman insists on – a US congressional investigation which will open up Kinsey’s archives and look into what he was doing and how. After all the Kinsey Institute itself should be interested in it if there is nothing for them to hide.

    The information that they are open for public scrutiny is false. Paul Gebhard himself said that Kinsey insisted on top ‘confidentiality’ and that everything they did was encoded. So even if the papers are open to all, no one will understand what they mean except the few initiated. Paul Gebhard said it himself.

    It was always the position of Kinsey not to share his information with anyone. When Interpol asked for the diaries of the Nazi criminal who was suspected of murdering a 10-year girl, Kinsey refused to cooperate and said they would not have them as the diaries were “confidential information”.

    Just think of it – he refused to provide the evidence to Interpol! Paul Gebhard speaks about it in this documentary of the award-winning Yorkshire Television shown on British TV in August 1998. The jolly man who constantly smiles is Paul Gebhard, Kinsey’s associate who replaced him as director of the Institute.

    This is only one part of the series.

    Like

  51. Rodrigo permalink
    December 14, 2012 10:51 pm

    Michael received a ridiculous amount of ridicule and crap for his lifestyle, which in the long run of things, was absolutely harmless.

    Yet this FREAK is respected?

    What a f-ing disgrace. I feel absolutely disgusted by this society sometimes.

    Like

  52. December 14, 2012 10:32 pm

    “I’m also ashamed to tell you that I never heard of this Nazi Fritz von Balluseck”

    Susanne, you shouldn’t be ashamed of anything!

    “But I understand the significance of all of this. These insane people never had been pilloried publicly like it happened to MJ who was totally innocent. This is the essence of the whole story and shows me what kind of world we are living in.”

    Yes, the contrast in the way the media treats true information about Kinsey and all those fantasies about Michael is astonishing. Fantasies are passed for the truth, while true information is totally suppressed or told to be a lie.

    It is sheer hypocrisy in the best case, and a distraction from real problems in the worst. In Michael’s case the media is clearly overdoing it, while in Kinsey’s case the same media is keeping mum though Kinsey’s insanity and autrocities are glaring into everyone’s face.

    “This makes me so sick, I wouldn’t be able to investigate it.”

    It makes all of us sick. After initially finding this information I sort of shut it out of my memory. Now that we have somewhat unexpectedly returned to it it gives me a terrible headache even to read it and a feeling that this cannot be true. It is like stepping into another reality with every moment of it giving you a feeling that you might not survive here.

    Have you ever seen David Lynch’s TV film “Twin Peaks”? Everything connected with Alfred Kinsey reminds me of this film. The same unsettling, surrealistic feeling of something dark, sinister and totally impossible taking place.

    When I saw the photo of Kinsey I realized that David Lynch knew more that he cared to say outloud – he didn’t pronounce it, but actually said it all by his film. The actor selected by David Lynch for the role of the main villain is almost the exact replica of Kinsey. In the film that character Leland Palmer was a respected lawyer and family man, who had a dark side to him – he was possessed by some demonic entity and under its influence he was molesting and finally killed his own daughter without realizing what he was doing.

    Judging by the atmosphere of the film, its symbolism and the actor selected for the role I think that David Lynch created all the nightmare/soap opera/black humor/fantasy film about Alfred Kinsey. Kinsey, same as the main character of the film, was probably insane too.

    Here are the photos of the actor who played the role of Leland Palmer (actor Ray Wise) and Alfred Kinsey:

    Like

  53. December 14, 2012 10:05 pm

    Thank you so much for this wonderful piece! Coming from someone who always believed in those tracks, this confirms for me a lot of what I felt. I always knew those tracks were Michael’s work, even if he did not 100% complete the vocals or production. For me, they still remain more of a tantalizing glimpse of what might have been had Michael completed the album. But it was always very hurtful to me when I would hear fans, for instance, calling Breaking News “garbage” (and yes, that was the exact word I heard used). I felt these were the same ones who would have been fawning all over the track had it been released on a Michael Jackson album in his lifetime. As it stands, most of these tracks-including Breaking News and Monster-are not “great” tracks strictly in the sense that they were never finished. No doubt, had Michael lived to complete them, they would have been brilliant. As they stand, they are certainly a far cry from brilliant but by no means are they “garbage” or “junk” or any of the other insulting labels that were unfairly hurled. They are fascinating glimpses of what Michael’s final vision would have been. I also took a lot of issue at the time with those purporting to be such experts that they could say with surety what Michael “would” or “would not” do. Michael wouldn’t rap about himself in third person; Michael wouldn’t sing this, etc. To me, that represents the worse kind of insult because it is denying his ability to evolve as an artist. Perhaps at one time Michael would never have rapped about himself in third person, but who’s to say where he was at in 2007, and what he was willing to experiement with? All of the rappers do it, and Michael proved throughout the years that he was sometimes as much of a trend follower as a trend setter. I could absolutely see him being willing to go with the times; to expand and do something out of the norm. Who are we as fans to box him into a corner?

    As for the voice, parts of those songs still “bug” me when I listen but it is not because I don’t believe it’s him; it’s just the over processing that irks me most.

    Like

  54. December 14, 2012 9:35 pm

    Naturally appropriate sex-education in a must. Nobody wants extreme puritanism which also can lead to various unfortunate and even tragic results. But Kinsey was himself a pervert and went in a bad way into a bad direction. And there ia a difference between a child and an adult in these matters. Responsible older teens fall there in between, for them trust and affection for the partner are important factors to emphasize.

    Like

  55. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 14, 2012 9:20 pm

    About Reisman, the Wikipedia site does give info about her–that she was given a large almost 800k grant from the Dept of Justice during a very conservative administration to study the Playboy, Hustler type magazines. She has been taken up by very conservative groups, whose approach to sex education in schools is very negative and who promote abstinence. I do believe that sex education is important, and that abstinence is a valuable option but not the only one and to promote it alone is unfortunate and unhelpful. When the government refuses to fund sex education in schools and yet wants to fund the teaching of abstinence in schools, I have a problem with that.

    The Kinsey Institute, according to the lengthy PBS special on Kinsey, which included questions and answers, says that their complete files are open to people who visit the Institute, but that they do not want to publish them or put them online.

    Kinsey published the first report on males in 1948, and females in 1953, at a time when there were many laws on the books against certain sex practices, even in marriage, and against sex between people of different races, and people were in a dark ages about sex in general, including homosexuality and masturbation, and women weren’t supposed to enjoy sex or masturbate as they were considered too pure. Yes, he opened Pandora’s box and used self-reported criminal behavior as ‘data,’ and was psychologically disturbed himself. I think he did not see sex as an act of love or did not want to look at it that way. The later work of Masters and Johnson was superior.

    Like

  56. December 14, 2012 6:43 pm

    I am now more sure than ever that “Michael This or That” was splashed all over the news to cover something dark or evil beneath. Michael ,whose later life was lost or plagued and finally murdered. Michael must have had some sense of this. Except maybe for his early youth ,he was well read and informed. And the world lost him too early. Imagine what music we would have gotten had his very life not been destroyed this way. And his messages to the world. Thank you VMJ and posters for the good work.

    Like

  57. December 14, 2012 5:49 pm

    Despite being swowed in and uncertainty re fligts I have scanned your posts&comments on Kinsey.He & Co is one of the largest scams and crimes of the century. Many lives,families and childrens lives have been destroyed.I am pretty sure they are at the root of Nambla too.
    Not to speak of AIDS, still rampant in many countries . Recently found out that surprisingly AIDS cases which have been falling are on the rise again, this a result of elderly men using Viagra and being sexually active again, but don´t give a damn about precautions.No doubt there are still people who believe him.
    The Kinsey scandal need to be revealed and stopped. Does that institute still bear his name? If so it is a shame.

    Like

  58. December 14, 2012 4:12 pm

    OMG, I’m indeed puzzled, but even more disgusted. I didn’t know of this kind of studies implemented by “scientists” and almost can’t believe it. What should they be good for?
    I’m also ashamed to tell you that I never heard of this Nazi Fritz von Balluseck, and I am appalled that my short online search for him brought even no GERMAN information about him.

    But I understand the significance of all of this. These insane people never had been pilloried publicly like it happened to MJ who was totally innocent. This is the essence of the whole story and shows me what kind of world we are living in.
    This makes me so sick, I wouldn’t be able to investigate it.

    Like

  59. December 14, 2012 2:11 pm

    “Re Judith Reisman in Wikipedia” – aldebaran

    Wiki is a place where people write selecting information from the available sources. Selection is the key word – you select neutral and trustworthy articles and the result is okay, you select from tabloids and the result is the opposite.

    However in respect of Kinsey there is very little even to select from. The truth about him is being massively suppressed. Kinsey’s “facts” are the foundation of a huge sex industry permeating the media, education and even pharma products, so there is very little chance that they will allow any “negativity” to be leaked about their god.

    “I looked up NAMBLA. It was founded in 1978, and Kinsey died in 1950′s, so what was the precursor organization to NAMBLA that Kinsey corresponded with?”

    If we knew it we would give its name, but we don’t. Paul Gebhard as Kinsey’s successor spoke about that organization himself, but they always refer to “confidentiality” as their main argument.

    This is exactly why Dr. Reisman insists on their “confidential” documents to be made public. All she says is that since public money went into the research, as soon as the project was over its documents should have been made open for everyone to see (and check up). However the Kinsey Institute claims that the documents are “confidential”. Those questionnaires were anonymous (marked by numbers only), so whose privacy would it disclose? Nobody’s.

    As regards her lawsuit against the Kinsey Institute Dr. Reisman is writing about it on her site. Interesting that at the time when the first ugly truth about Kinsey began to be uncovered the press started paying much attention to … Michael Jackson. They could have looked into Kinsey instead, but no, over there they kept mum, though Kinsey’s doings were a bigger sensation than anything MJ ever did (or to be more exact, didn’t do).

    Here is an excerpt from Dr. Reisman’s site on legal actions against the Kinsey Institute:

    1985: Dr. Reisman completes her study, “Images of Children, Crime and Violence in Playboy, Penthouse and Hustler,” over significant obstacles. The research is successfully used at the US Supreme Court level as well as in lower courts.

    1990: Kinsey Institute Director, June Reinisch threatens to sue a radio station should Dr. Reisman be interviewed about her recent 1990 book, Kinsey, Sex & Fraud. The radio station drops Dr. Reisman’s planned interview.

    1990 Dr. Reisman discovers that The Kinsey Institute is secretly circulating “confidential” defamatory materials about her, worldwide. The cover page of the 89 page tome states these “confidential” materials “are not to be attributed to the Kinsey Institute”.

    1990: A nonprofit law firm offers to represent Dr. Reisman pro bono for defamation against the Kinsey Institute and June Reinisch. Although her DOJ peers approved Reisman’s findings (the past president of The American Statistical Association concluded “This is a sound study”) the secret Kinsey Institute package mailed to numerous recipients injures Dr. Reisman by falsely claiming the DOJ research is not peer approved.

    December 1990, Dr. Reisman appears and handily exposes Kinsey’s child abuse culpability on “Phil Donahue.” Later Dr. Reisman discovers Donahue was threatened with a lawsuit if Dr. Reisman appears on air. He is not sued.

    1991: A lawsuit for defamation is filed by Dr. Reisman against The Kinsey Institute and its (then) Director, June Reinisch.

    May 1993: In deposing June Reinisch at Indiana University , Dr. Reisman discovered handwritten file notes. One note said, “sue Am. University for sponsoring things she threatens to do.” Another note said “had lengthy conversation” … “Am. Univ. Institutional Review Board for Human Subjects.”

    Dr. Reisman believes this “lengthy conversation” explains why the AU Institutional Review Board censored her legitimate study of Kinsey in her U.S. Justice Department research.

    March 22, 1994: Dr. Reisman’s pro-bono law firm said they could not financially continue the lawsuit. If plaintiff (Dr. Reisman) could pay $53,000 in court costs the judge ruled that this would allow her to file the same lawsuit later against the same defendants. Therefore, considering the non frivolous nature of her complaint, the judge would dismiss her case WITHOUT PREJUDICE, pending its reopening.

    Circa May 1994: Unable to obtain $53,000 to continue the case for a “without prejudice” decision, the judge dismissed the case “with prejudice” meaning Dr. Reisman could not sue for this collection of “confidential” papers, but could sue later on any other charge.

    In sum, due to lack of money not lack of merit this defamation suit was dismissed.

    The judge did not absolve the Kinsey Institute or June Reinish of defamation.

    This legal proceeding was not about the facts or fraud with respect to Kinsey’s research. The court NEVER ruled that Dr. Reisman’s defamation charges have no “merit.” The defamation case NEVER even addressed Kinsey’s crimes.

    [Note: It has been brought to our attention that The Kinsey Institute claims otherwise, and thus continues its history of trying to twist the facts. Just ask them for a complete copy of the law suit briefs, motions and rulings should you have any doubt.]

    Dr. Judith Reisman has proven that the research conducted by A. Kinsey, his associates and collaborators was fraudulent and has invited and continues to invite the Kinsey Institute to debate her publicly about her research. The Kinsey Institute has never taken Dr. Reisman up on her offer, neither has the Kinsey Institute ever sued anyone who claimed that Kinsey’s research was fraudulent.

    To date, the Kinsey Institute has failed to repudiate any of the facts Dr. Reisman has brought to light against the Kinsey research. Rather than admitting that Kinsey’s research had no scientific merit, the Kinsey Institute has engaged in secret cloak and dagger missions to destroy the reputation of those who seek to uncover the truth.

    The Kinsey Institute until today continues to deny access to its files to any researcher critical of the “research” conducted by Alfred Kinsey.

    For the legal documents proving that the above is true see the site: http://www.drjudithreisman.com/the_kinsey_coverup.html#history

    Like

  60. December 14, 2012 1:11 pm

    The review also says that Judith Reisman is herself “controversial.” – aldebaran

    Yes, she is vehement and is often somewhat extreme in her ideas, but I think it is mostly because she is facing a wall of silence which she did not expect. By denying the obvious they force her to be vehement.

    However no matter what her style is facts about Kinsey cannot be disputed. What I’ve written here is again only part of what I’ve read and seen. Some of it is so terrible that you’d better never look.

    Of course the media will say that Dr. Reisman is controversial, but this is exactly where their agenda is manisfesting itself – they vilify her in the same manner they vilify Michael.

    Dr. Reisman is not just a “nobody” – she was one of the main investigators for the Department of Justice whose job was checking up on the media and doing research of the media effect on the society (for example, the effect of pornography on children). The media and especially sex industry regard her as their intrinsic enemy as they want full freedom for themselves, while her reports showed that “soft pornography” was contributing to more crime.

    Here is an independent letter from the President of the National Right to Read Foundation (freedom of press) assessing Dr. Reisman’s qualifications:

    The text of it shows excellent standards of Dr. Reisman’s research:

    The National Right to Read Foundation

    August 25, 1994
    To whom it may concern

    As past Administrator for the Office of Juvenile Justice and Delinquency Prevention (OJJDP) at the U.S. Department of Justice, (1990-92) I have had the opportunity to carefully review both the methodology and results of OJJDP’s nearly $800,000 project stewarded by Dr. Judith Reisman, from 1983-1985.

    Without hesitation I can state that Dr. Reisman’s product Images of Children, Crime and Violence in Playboy, Penthouse and Hustler (1953-1984) had a direct and powerful affect both upon the self-policing activities of the publishers of these erotic/pornographic magazines, and their impact on the family marketplace, both nationally and internationally.

    Dr. Reisman is a scientist of outstanding exactitude and courage. She is a scholar with an eye for the cutting-edge social problems of our time and does not blanch at the study of politically volatile areas of inquiry, largely avoided by academicians of her mature abilities.

    While the massive, affluent sex industry has employed nearly every technique in their arsenal, short of violence, to stop Dr. Reisman’s work, they have not shown her findings to be incorrect or methodologically flawed – in even the smallest detail.

    Sincerely,

    Robert W. Sweet, Jr.
    President

    Board of Directors (13 names)

    Like

  61. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 14, 2012 4:27 am

    Re Judith Reisman in Wikipedia:

    “Children in the Kinsey reports
    Over the following years her accusations against Kinsey became increasingly serious; she said he was a fraud who had employed and relied on pedophiles for his research,[5] and went on to claim that Kinsey himself sexually abused children. This allegation drew a response from Kinsey biographer James H. Jones, who wrote that unless new evidence to the contrary becomes available, Reisman’s claims that Kinsey may have witnessed or personally participated in child molestation under the guise of scientific research must be considered groundless.[6]
    Prior to the release of the 2004 film Kinsey, Reisman and Laura Schlessinger attempted to place an advertisement “alleging Kinsey was a pervert and a pedophile”.[7]

    In 1991 Reisman, with an attorney from the Rutherford Institute, sued the Kinsey Institute, its then director June Reinisch and Indiana University for defamation as well as intentional and negligent infliction of emotional distress regarding alleged attempts to censor her book Kinsey, Sex and Fraud.[30] The case was ultimately dismissed with prejudice in 1994.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judith_Reisman

    I looked up NAMBLA. It was founded in 1978, and Kinsey died in 1950’s, so what was the precursor organization to NAMBLA that Kinsey corresponded with?

    (Reisman and Schlessinger tried to place that ad in Variety, but it was rejected.)

    Like

  62. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 14, 2012 4:10 am

    Yes, VMJ, Kinsey should have reported the activies of Rex King and the Balluseck for sure. However, the NYTimes review of the 2004 film of Kinsey says this about Balluseck:

    “An article on Oct. 3 about the film “Kinsey” referred incorrectly to legal proceedings against Fritz von Balluseck, a German convicted pedophile who corresponded with Dr. Alfred C. Kinsey. While von Balluseck was named by the Berlin police as a suspect in the murder of a young girl in 1957, he was not placed on trial. This correction was delayed for research in court archives.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/03/movies/03crai.html?_r=0

    The review also says that Judith Reisman is herself “controversial.” You can check further, if you want, what they say. Also there is a wikipedia page on her that says the same.

    In the PBS transcriopt, it says that Kinsey saw sex as apart from love, and that created problems for the women in his circle, including his wife. In one of the wife-swapping events, one of the wives actually fell in love with the other man and Kinsey then told the man (who he had originally wanted to be involved in having this affair) not to continue the affair b/c it was wrecking the marriage. He got his associates to partake in these sexual experiments, esp. wheh he was working on the Report on Female sexuality. He had done extensive research on wasps before, and when he switched his research to humans, he approached the subject the same as the wasps, lots of data recording and observation, and didn’t take many human characteristics into consideration, like love or indeed emotions at all (wasps not having emotions). This is where he failed miserably, as well as in accepting the reports of those pedophiles and not reporting them to the police.

    (I don’t think the other link to the NYT review worked, but the one I just cited should work.)

    Like

  63. December 14, 2012 3:17 am

    I am inpressed with all the ifno you VMJ and aldebaranredstar has collected. I iam trying to prepare for my trip and we are drowning in a snowstorm, every little errand outside becomes an ordeal. But thank you for your work. I never liked Kinsey.just instinctively before I even knew all., the dirt about him.I have read critic on him before,but what you tell is shocking.Fortunately my training was at the highest ethical level and by the the President of the Board os American Child and adolescent Psychiatry.,and Kinsey´s “research” was not a part of it.He is dead ,fortunately, but it is wrong that an institute has been named after him.If pedofilia is worse than murder, Kinsey is a serial killer. All should be exposed about him and his collaborators.This makes the false allegations aganst Michael just ridiculous.
    There is more I would like to tell, but some practical complications and lack of time are in the way.Personally I never met a child who benefitted.in any way.And what is the nonsense about the “good” of sexualizing girls at an early age. Just look at countries where girls are forced into early marriage and childbearing, those countries have the highest maternal and neonatal mortality.

    Like

  64. Rodrigo permalink
    December 14, 2012 2:32 am

    It’s a sick nightmare.

    Like

  65. December 13, 2012 11:28 pm

    Guys, from your puzzled reaction I get that you don’t understand the implication of all these discoveries concerning Kinsey in our talk with the official press regarding Michael Jackson.

    The fact that all these data are in the open and the press still keeps total silence about it shows the incredible bias of the media to Michael Jackson as well as the fact that they media has an agenda.

    – A person who was examined inside out for 25 years and was never found guilty of anything is being ridiculed beyond measure.

    – And the one who was actually an accomplice in crimes against children is a hero of the nation.

    I would love to see the media explain this strange phenomenon.

    Like

  66. December 13, 2012 11:12 pm

    “Narrator: In fact, Kinsey had drawn nearly all of the material from the diaries of one person. In 1945, he had heard of a man with an astonishing, if perverse, sexual history. Intrigued, he went to meet 63-year-old Rex King.” – aldebaran

    “Intrigued”? Interesting word. Okay, even if this story is true, he could have reported him first and only then could have used his diary – but he didn’t. The abuse went on and Kinsey encouraged his “informants” to continue.

    A quote (please pay attention to the word “trained”):

    Alfred Kinsey himself attributed the data on the 317 children to at least nine men, according to his statement on page 177 of the 1948 edition of “Sexual Behavior in the Human Male”:

    “Better data on pre-adolescent climax come from the histories of adult males who have had sexual contacts with younger boys and who, with their adult backgrounds, are able to recognize and interpret the boys’ experiences … 9 of our adult male subjects have observed such orgasm. Some of these adults are technically trained persons who have kept diaries or other records which have been put at our disposal; and from them we have secured information on 317 preadolescents who were either observed in self masturbation, or who were observed in contacts with other boys or older adults,” wrote Kinsey.

    There can be no denial that they were indeed specifically trained as all of them kept diaries, meticulously putting down the time of “stimulation” and all the other “data” which I don’t even want to describe. The studies have a fantastic uniformity and accuracy! How can that be done without prior instructions by a “third” party?

    One more quote about Kinsey keeping correspondence with a Nazi pedophile for many years:

    Another consort was the notorious former Nazi and pedophile Dr. Fritz Von Balluseck. Von Balluseck contributed data about his child abuse to Kinsey’s research database during the twenty-year period of 1936-1956. Von Balluseck was on trial in Germany for the rape and murder of a ten-year-old girl when correspondence from Kinsey was found in his possession. Kinsey’s letters encouraged Von Balluseck to continue sending the results of his “research” on children and even warned him to “be careful.”

    And finally, here is information from Kinsey’s colleagues. In fact, all of it is there in the open, so no one needs to do any “investigation”, and this is the worst part of it – everyone knows it, but doesn’t pay attention:

    In the 1995 Herald-Times article, Gebhard also acknowledged the Kinsey Institute declined to report its contacts with pedophiles to the police, for fear of jeopardizing its ongoing research.

    “There couldn’t have been any research if we turned them in. Of course, we knew when we interviewed the pedophiles that they would continue the activity, but we didn’t do anything about that.”

    While being interviewed for the 1998 BBC documentary, Gebhard acknowledged off-camera that the Kinsey researchers obtained information not only from individual pedophiles, but a pedophile organization which preceded the present-day North American Man Boy Love Association.

    Two of the pedophiles Kinsey worked with can be identified individually. The “one man” referred to by Bancroft, on whom Kinsey certainly relied for much of his information about “orgasms” in prepubescent boys, is said to be known by several names to Kinsey Institute researchers, including Rex King, Mr. Green and Mr. X.

    King was “an Arizona pedophile who raped 800 children,” wrote Kinsey colleague Wardell Pomeroy in his 1972 book “Dr. Kinsey and the Institute for Sex Research.” Pomeroy said King was introduced to heterosexual intercourse by his grandmother and homosexual intercourse by his father, and had sex with “countless” adults of both sexes, as well as animals.

    Gebhard told Yorkshire Television that King was an exceptionally valuable source of information.

    “Nursery school people … parents … couldn’t give us the extraordinary detail that Green did. It was illegal and we knew it was illegal, and that’s why a lot of people are furious … they say we should have turned him in instantly … [but] if we had turned him in it would have been the end of our research project.”

    “Kinsey began his courtship of Mr. X in the fall of 1943,” wrote Pomeroy.

    “He correctly divined that Mr. X longed for recognition and approval. From the beginning, therefore, Kinsey treated him like a colleague, a fellow seeker of truth who had compiled valuable scientific data.”

    According to Pomeroy, King had spent years keeping records of his rapes of young children, and eventually turned the records over to Kinsey.
    According to one of Kinsey’s biographers, Jim Jones, in March 1945 Kinsey offered to pay King a salary if he would take leave from his government job to pull together all his records, particularly those on “preadolescent orgasms.”

    Also in 1943, during the Second World War, Kinsey began a correspondence with a German pedophile, Nazi officer and doctor, Fritz von Balluseck.
    Balluseck pursued “quite a correspondence” with Kinsey and the Kinsey Institute, according to Gebhard. Yorkshire Television’s 1998 transcripts record Gebhard saying, “Police [seeking a child sex murderer] went through his possessions … found his correspondence with Kinsey … they got Interpol … and the FBI … put … pressure on Kinsey to reveal the guy’s … sexual diary … Kinsey said, absolutely not … .[T]he poor paedophile … had his reputation destroyed … finally quit corresponding with us.”

    In 1957, Balluseck was convicted of abusing children over a period of 30 years. The abuse took place in Germany and in Poland, where von Balluseck, a member of the Gestapo, was given access to Jewish girls as young as 9. Balluseck reportedly made the girls choose between submitting to him and facing the gas chambers.

    Dr. Balluseck … [recorded measurements] of his crimes committed against children between 9 and 14 years old …. in four thick diaries … of a pseudo-scientific character … while in correspondence with the American sexual researcher Kinsey,” reported the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, May 22, 1957.

    During Balluseck’s trial, the judge reportedly said, “I had the impression that you got to the children in order to impress Kinsey and to deliver him material.” According to Neues Deutschland, Balluseck replied, “Kinsey himself asked me to do so.”

    http://www.drjudithreisman.com/archives/2010/10/wnd_exclusive_p.html

    Kinsey was INSANE.

    Like

  67. December 13, 2012 10:54 pm

    “I do not think infants or children have the same sexuality as adults and frankly, it would be contray to what we know about animal behavior.”

    Aldebaran, there is no need to do any (criminal) research to know that children do not have the same sexuality as adults. Recall your own feelings and you will remember that what you felt at four is no comparison with what you felt at 16. The child naturally has sexuality but it is unripe – it is only the beginning of what was implanted into a child by nature, like a bud of a future leaf. But it does not mean that this bud should be forcefully uncovered or put into a warmhouse or other artificial conditions to make it blossom before its time. Even if it does it will still be crooked, undeveloped and will fade very soon. Same with a child – leave the child to develop and blossom in a natural way, as nature predetermined it.

    “Kinsey collected histories of people who agreed to answer questions (300 of them) about their sexual life.”

    Yes, adults can read, write and answer questions. However not everyone agreed, so the selection was made mostly among prisoners, male and female prostitutes, etc. – a very good “representation” of the nation. As to children, especially infants, adults had to fill in the questionnaires for them, and this is exactly what raised questions.

    One of the victims (the woman who is ready to testify before Congress in an investigation of Kinsey’s activities) explained the way everything was happening:

    WND: Would your father have abused you if he hadn’t been involved with Kinsey?

    EW: I don’t know. My grandfather got him into it. I think the Kinsey people at IU talked my grandfather into getting involved. They brainwashed all the students about how important the research was, that knowledge was God.
    My uncle was involved in this, too. He molested his stepdaughter, and of course the split in the family was horrible, and his wife divorced him. It was all kept very quiet, I didn’t find out about it until maybe five years ago when his second wife told me. But this man became a devout Christian man and repented profusely. He realized he had been duped by Kinsey, I think…

    WND: Can you tell me what your father did to you?

    EW: Everything. It makes me blush just to think about it. He was giving me orgasms and timing it with a stopwatch. I didn’t like it, I went into convulsions, but he didn’t care. He said all little girls do this with their daddies, they just don’t talk about it.
    …I resisted probably the whole time, but I wasn’t permitted to resist. I would tell him no, but he wouldn’t listen. I would have convulsions, but he wouldn’t pay any attention. I was sworn to silence. I was not to tell my mother because I would cause a divorce, and that was my greatest fear. That was awful in those days, nobody had divorces.

    WND: Was Kinsey aware of what was happening to you?

    EW: Kinsey or his partners knew. In 1943, when I was 9, I found a sheet of paper that had boxes on it and my father was checking off things he was doing to me. He grabbed it away from me and put it in a brown envelope.

    WND: Can you describe the sheet of paper?

    EW: It was a form with little boxes down the left side of the page and a list of statements describing sexual acts. The form was instructions on what to do. It was for training. He was supposed to check things off when he’d done them.
    One of the statements included the words “timed orgasm.” I didn’t know what “orgasm” meant, so I asked him. Then he explained to me exactly what he was doing, and what an orgasm was. I knew he was holding a stopwatch in his hand when he did it, but I didn’t know what he was doing. I was very young, I just didn’t understand any of this stuff, I was just doing what my daddy told me to do. He claimed to be doing it in love.

    WND: And this was done to you in the name of science? By people who were conducting research?

    EW: I don’t know for sure if my dad was involved with the Kinsey thing in the beginning.
    In 1947 my father gave me a prepublication copy of Kinsey’s book on the human male. I was supposed to read it and give my evaluation of it. I was 13. By then the abuse had stopped, because my mother found out.
    My dad told me he helped Kinsey write the book and that it was going to change the way the world looked at sexuality. He wanted me to do a two-paragraph review of the book. I wouldn’t do it. When I read the book it made me sick. I realized then what they were doing. The charts were in there, they were timing orgasms, and I didn’t want anything to do with any of it.
    I wasn’t really fully aware of Alfred Kinsey, it was just the book. I didn’t want any part of it, and I gave it back to him. It stayed in his library until he died, and then I threw it out. He was a great fan of Freud; he had three of Freud’s books, and I threw them out, too.

    WND: Did you ever meet Kinsey?

    EW: I was interviewed by him. He and Pomeroy came to my grandfather’s home in Columbus, Ohio, sometime in the early ’40s. My great-grandmother was there, I think she must have known there was something wrong, because she treated me terribly.
    Kinsey was supposed to come for luncheon, but there was a big snowstorm and they were late. My great-grandmother had prepared a great big luncheon. I think she was upset because they were late, and they didn’t have time to eat the luncheon. Kinsey had to leave because he was delivering a lecture at Ohio State.
    Kinsey did interview me, he asked me some questions, things like whether I loved my family. My father had told me what I needed to say to him; we wanted to make a good impression. I found out later we had to make a good impression because we were getting paid for this.
    When Kinsey was about to leave, my grandfather said, “What about the check?” Kinsey said, “I almost forgot,” and I saw him give my grandfather a check. Kinsey said “I made it out to both of you because I didn’t know which one was going to get the money.” That was in the winter of 1943.
    They had to do the charting first, then they got paid for it. The check was probably $6,000. It was a 6 with a bunch of zeroes after it. Shortly after that my family bought a brand new house. The check was enough to put a down payment on the house.

    WND: Did the Kinsey Institute ever follow up with you?

    EW: Not at all. They didn’t care about me. Actually neither did my dad; he didn’t care what this was doing to me. He thought everything was supposed to be better because of this, that I would be a better person, much more broadminded. http://www.wnd.com/2010/10/214105/

    “As far as Rex King, his histories, like all the others, were self-reported. In other words, completely unverified.”

    To make them “verified” all Kinsey was to do was report the pedophile to the authorities. He did not.

    Like

  68. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 13, 2012 10:09 pm

    This is from a transcript of a long PBS special on Kinsey (lots of info and comments from those involved in the Kinsey Reports and the biographers of Kinsey).

    “Narrator: But what the world did not yet know was that there were serious flaws in Kinsey’s methodology, flaws that would come back to haunt him. Buried deep in the male volume, in four small tables, was the most contentious data in all his work.

    Bancroft: Tables 31 to 34 are about orgasms in pre-pubital boys. And they describe how many of the boys experienced orgasm, boys, young boys having repeated orgasm. Uh, it’s not entirely clear from reading the book where this comes from.

    Narrator: In fact, Kinsey had drawn nearly all of the material from the diaries of one person. In 1945, he had heard of a man with an astonishing, if perverse, sexual history. Intrigued, he went to meet 63-year-old Rex King.

    Hardy: He had a family tree of thirty-six and he’d slept with seventeen of them. His grandmother introduced him to heterosexual intercourse, his father to homosexual intercourse, he’d slept with quite literally countless men and women.

    Narrator: King claimed to have molested several hundred children, most of them Mexican migrants living nearby. He’d recorded detailed descriptions of his crimes in several cramped notebooks, which he handed over to Kinsey. The notebooks, Kinsey believed, were a unique record of the sexual responsiveness of children. He decided to use them in the study. But even some of his own team were dead set against it. “To get data,” Pomeroy said later, “Kinsey would have made a deal with the devil.”

    Boyle: There is no moralizing in what he’s doing. And perhaps one of his pitfalls is that at some point with sexual behavior, there should be some kind of moral restraints. That is especially with regard to pedophilia.”

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/kinsey/filmmore/

    Kinsey collected histories of people who agreed to answer questions (300 of them) about their sexual life. That was his methodology for the first Report on Males. He was criticized b/c he refused to use a statistical sample method, and instead insisted on collecting thousands of histories. (The argument was that only certain groups agreed to the interviews, thus leaving out the groups who refused.)

    As far as Rex King, his histories, like all the others, were self-reported. In other words, completely unverified. Who knows if these events actually took place or if they were his own fantasies?? I am not saying they didn’t happen, I am saying they are unverified as having happened. Kinsey relied on people who gave him their histories as being truthful, but maybe they were not.

    I do not think infants or children have the same sexuality as adults and frankly, it would be contray to what we know about animal behavior. Male puppies, for example, may sometimes do humping but that doesn’t mean they are initiating sex. Girls holding dolls and so on, this is play, not sex, in the adult definition of procreation, intercourse.

    Like

  69. December 13, 2012 8:47 pm

    “The charts 31-34 come from this person Rex King. These charts are not in any way reliably scientific as the data came from a single pedophile.” – aldeberanredstar

    One or nine as Kinsey said it himself – what does it matter? That one pedophile alone molested 800 children, and Kinsey never stopped him. No, he kept using the pedophile’s “data” instead. Penal Code qualifies it as an accessory in a crime, by the way.

    As to Kinsey’s research, the reliability of his findings and his legacy this is what Dr. Reisman has to say about it:

    WND Exclusive: Expert talks about the calamity of Kinsey

    By Brian Fitzpatrick
    WorldNetDaily, October 20, 2010

    Editor’s note: Dr. Judith Reisman is the world’s leading whistleblower and critic of Alfred Kinsey and the Kinsey Institute. Since 1981 she has been calling attention to scandalous shortcomings in both Kinsey’s methodology and ethics, and challenging the accuracy of his conclusions. A prominent researcher about sexuality issues, Reisman has authored two books on pornography and three books about Kinsey and his research, and has been a consultant to four U.S. Department of Justice administrations, the U.S. Department of Education and the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

    WND: What are your academic credentials and your field of study?

    Judith Reisman: My Ph.D. is in Communications Studies, focusing on mass media effects. I’ve also done extensive postgraduate work in the study of human sexuality. I’ve conducted extensive sexuality-related research for the U.S. Department of Justice. My testimony has been crucial in numerous court cases. For example, the Mapplethorpe trial judge accepted my groundbreaking evidence that pictures are not “speech” and the prosecutor urged these data be heard in “any analysis of pornography.” My research helped convict Dwaine Tinsley, Hustler’s “Chester the Molester” cartoonist, of felony child abuse. Massachusetts Attorney General James Shannon quoted my study of sexually exploitative pictures of children in “soft pornography” to win a major case at the U.S. Supreme Court and Southland 7-Eleven stores divested from Playboy and Penthouse sales after reviewing my findings on child sexual abuse in those magazines.
    I [previously] spent decades as a professional writer, performer and producer for CBS, ABC, NBC and PBS [and] producing music video segments for Captain Kangaroo!

    WND: How did you get involved in the Kinsey controversy?

    JR: It started when my research on Playboy at Case Western Reserve University in 1976 was presented at the Wales, U.K. British Psychological Association Conference on Love and Attraction. I screened 160 slides of child sex abuse scenes in Playboy, including rape and incest. The conference changed my life. It was my first experience with the academic pedophile lobby. A slew of “scientists” there were members of this primitive chic sex cult. Unexpectedly, an infamous pedophile was to speak on pedophile rights, and I became the center of a big pedophile furor. The conference led to a periodical publication, “Paidika, the Journal of Pedophilia,” published in Amsterdam. Paidika publishes interviews with famous Western sexologists who are pedophile advocates.

    In Wales, a Canadian psychologist insisted Playboy had no pictures of children. After my presentation he was outraged as the child cartoons and photographs were pulled up out of his memory. Until he saw the images together, he had been in denial. Yes, he said “these were jokes and pictures of adults having sex with children, a sophisticated program to condition viewers to lust after minors. If that’s happening to me, a trained psychologist,” he said, “what’s happening to men worldwide?” He said, “To understand child sexual abuse, look at the Kinsey Reports.” “Why” I asked. “I worked with Kinsey and Pomeroy. One of them is a radical homosexual and the other is a pedophile,” he replied.

    Between Playboy’s child porn, the well-connected academic pedophile lobby and their sick buddies at the Kinsey Institute, I realized there would be a plague of child sex abuse unless these people were stopped. They weren’t; and now look around us. Just in 1998, 58,200 kids – that we know of – were kidnapped by non-family members. Now, since they got back home within 24 hours they don’t get headlines, nor do all the other 200 kidnapped children who are killed, or the 1 in 4 girls and 1 in 6 boys who are sexually violated. This is outrageous.

    So in 1976 I started looking at the Kinsey Institute and I thought, “this is impossible.” This is the No. 1-quoted sex maven in the world, he founded the whole field of human sexology. I’m looking at charts of children as young as 2 months being raped and tortured around the clock, and nobody is saying anything about this?! I went through thousands of articles and books about Kinsey, and nobody said a word about the rapes and sodomizing of these children. The American Statistical Association did wonder how he got this information, but that’s all they did.

    I was thinking, “Was everybody crazy? There were some strong criticism by scientists of Kinsey, Abe Maslow being the most important, but even they didn’t see what was in front of their eyes. Kinsey did use some tricky language to confuse his readers. But who times babies to “orgasm” with a stopwatch? A pedophile. Who watches a baby being sexually molested and writhing in convulsions and concludes that is an “orgasm”? A sadomasochistic pedophile. And the Kinsey Institute still gets philanthropic, state and federal funding. Why not name it after Mengele?

    In 1998, they republished the Kinsey Reports without great fanfare and no apologies. The Obama administration apologized for U.S. scientists’ sex experiments on Guatemalans carried out from 1946 to 1948. On the same day as that apology (Oct.4) the Kinsey Institute released yet another of its pedophile biased sex studies of children and orgasms. How do they get away with it? OK, apologize to Guatemala, [but] now raid the Kinsey Institute in Bloomington, Indiana!

    WND: How did you first bring this story to light?

    JR: I gave a paper in 1981 at the Fifth World Congress of Sexology, and if they could have lynched me, they would have. [Laughs] I was thinking, “these are all my colleagues, they’re going to be really concerned.” [Laughs again] The paper was called “Child Sexuality or Child Sexual Abuse: A Consideration of Ethics Violations.” It was a beautiful day in Jerusalem, Israel, but no one was at the beach, my meeting room was jam-packed, standing room only. They’re all there, listening to my presentation. I put up Kinsey’s charts and graphs, Tables 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, and asked “How did he do that? Where did these data come from?” The audience was traumatized. They looked like they could have stoned me. I was so naïve, I called for an investigation by my colleagues and I really thought they would do it. I thought everybody would be as livid as I was.

    This was when I began to understand that everyone at that conference had cited Kinsey’s data as accurate. All of them. Kinsey and/or his disciples. Kinsey is the foundation of their field, so they all quote him. But after I dropped an atomic bomb in the middle of the room – at least that’s what a Swedish reporter said – I was considered a pariah in the field.

    The real issue was Kinsey’s professional legacy – that sex is nothing, and so it’s OK with animals, same-sex, adults and children of any age. Just try to get “consent.” One of Kinsey’s sex partners, Wardell Pomeroy, said that even with infants you can tell by the way they look at you , smile at you, that it’s OK. How can a child give consent to this activity? Kinsey said children “consent” when they fight to escape from their rapist! A child is not mature by definition, it can’t understand the consequences of sexual activity. No child can give consent.

    WND: How did the American public and the media respond?

    JR: How could there be a public response if the press censors what happened? In the 1980s John Leo did two Time magazine articles where he documented sexology’s push for incest and pedophilia. I’m told that’s why he had to leave Time. No, the press has always hidden the Kinsey crimes.

    No other journalist wrote about it until Pat Buchanan. May 21, 1983, Pat Buchanan wrote a blistering article about the Kinsey Institute based on my evidence. Buchanan interviewed me on CNN’s “Crossfire.” His foil, Tom Braden, wound up on my side; he said Kinsey should be dug up and his head put on a post. On May 25, Buchanan was attacked by the Kinsey Institute. They threatened to sue him for libel. He responded with “Buchanan vs. Kinsey Round 2,” where he documented all of my charges, every one of them. We had everything on them, and they immediately backed down.

    There was no news, radio or television response to Buchanan’s articles. No, the New York Times, Washington Post, nobody followed that up. Kinsey, lauded as a conservative, sex pioneer is making illegal sex films in the 1940s, oversees children being raped, and nobody in the media cares? There can’t be a public reaction when the crimes are hidden from the public.

    Following Buchanan’s show, I got a call from the U.S. Department of Justice. Al Regnery was running the Juvenile Justice division at DOJ. He said they were having a major increase in childhood sexual abuse. He asked why I linked this to pornography. He said, “We keep finding Playboy and Penthouse in the hands of juveniles molesting younger kids.” I had written extensively on this and gave him some of my findings. DOJ offered me a grant through the juvenile prevention division. I ended up at American University in Washington, D.C., with a huge $800,000 grant to research Kinsey and children in “soft” pornography. It was Christmas time in Congress and so my grant request sailed through the vetting process.

    WND: How did Congress respond?

    JR: I got hit with politics – massive politics everywhere. Three congressional investigations were organized to try and kill my grant. I know of no other grant that had three congressional investigations. And this was during the Reagan administration! Sen. Arlen Specter went after me with a sledgehammer. Senators Specter, Metzenbaum and Kennedy did everything they could to sabotage my research, coordinating their efforts with their media mafia. Nasty cartoons appeared in newspapers everywhere, ridiculing, costly PR marketing. All the newspapers carried the same stories. Suddenly the papers had a lot to say about me, but they never interviewed me, using my words. No, it was a coordinated hatchet job across the country, L.A. Times, Cleveland Plain Dealer, Washington Post, the same smears appeared everywhere. The Kinsey Institute, among others, threatened American University, so I was illegally forbidden to study Kinsey’s data. I completed my study of Images of Children, Crime & Violence in Playboy, Penthouse and Hustler in 1985 in the midst of harassment, threats, thefts and significant intimidation.

    WND: In 1995, U.S. Rep. Steve Stockman introduced a bill in Congress to investigate the Kinsey Institute. Why didn’t Congress follow through?

    JR: Stockman read my first book, “Kinsey, Sex and Fraud.” He was outraged and tried to launch a congressional investigation. He had 51 legislators co-sponsoring his bill. However, before the bill could be moved through the process he was up for election. His opponent suddenly picked up about a million dollars and Stockman lost. I am certain they got rid of him because of that.

    WND: Now let’s turn to the academic work produced by Kinsey and the Kinsey Institute. What do you think about Kinsey’s ethics?

    JR: [Laughs] You ask, is it ethical to ask people to break the law for scientific research? Kinsey had no ethics. They don’t exist; they never existed unless you figure “anything is ethical if it accomplishes my ends.” Kinsey’s data are based on deception and on a hidden agenda to gut the Judeo-Christian moral system, which he’s done. His own people admitted that they were often immoral and criminal. One of his co-authors who headed the Kinsey Institute for years, Paul Gebhard, said, “We knew it was illegal, we knew it was criminal, but we did it anyway.” The word “ethics” has no meaning to these people. They founded a primitive sex cult in suit and tie.

    WND: Is it ethical to pay people for scientific research?

    JR: Yes, you can pay people for scientific research, if it’s ethical research. You cannot pay people with special interests, like scientists invested in tobacco stocks, to research tobacco harms. You can’t pay pedophiles to “research” children. You cannot pay anyone to molest children.

    WND: Is “Esther White’s” family the only family that volunteered their children for Kinsey’s research?

    JR: No. We know that there were others. John Bancroft [a former head of the Kinsey Institute] stated that he was concerned that the children of other victims were going to come forward to sue them. As my research eked out through conservative channels, I had calls from people who felt they or their parents had been used in the Kinsey research. We have no idea how many because the Kinsey Institute hides the research records, which is also illegal. Their research records are supposed to be public domain. As soon as the project is done, the taxpayer has paid for it, and the university hasn’t the right to hide the data. They’re supposed to blank out the names if there is confidential information, but if they have a criminal, that all should have been turned over to the police immediately. They always refused to turn any of these people over to the police and they knew they had rapists, child molesters, incest offenders.

    WND: What do you think about Kinsey’s academic credibility? Was his methodology sound? Did he produce good scientific data?

    JR: I’m always tempted to just laugh. There is just no science here, it was always political sexual propaganda. There is no methodology here . Roughly 87 percent of his males were already aberrant, and he calls them normal American men. This is a guy who threw away 75 percent of his research population, the people he said he interviewed. His methodology was simply to lie, whatever lie he could concoct to create his sexual fantasy world, leaving his deviant fantasy as our national legacy.

    Kinsey wrote in his book that if someone doesn’t give you the right answer you can force the answer you want. You start yelling at them and say you know they’re lying until they give you the right answer. It’s in bold print! Page 55 in the male volume, “Forcing a subject.” He says you can force them to change their answers. And you’re asking if this is proper, ethical, scientific methodology? This is science? It’s in his own book! He also said if someone doesn’t give you the right answers you can change what they said. It’s in his own book! Remember, he was an elitist, a eugenicist who would sterilize a tenth of the population, so he thought himself god.

    Here we have a man who is a bi/homosexual masturbation and pornography addict, a sadomasochist who for years mutilated his own sex organs. This is a man who needed to be whipped, an adulterer with scores of known and unknown sex buddies in bars, baths and hotels. We have this all on record. Who is he likely to force? Anyone who has, or wants to have, a normal, healthy sex life.

    WND: In spite of his sexual peccadilloes and hiring pedophiles and the rest, can we trust any of the data that he generated?

    JR: [Laughs] Of course not. This was always brazen propaganda wrapped in statistics. He said children loved to be raped. Why would anybody believe that? That’s false data. He said children having convulsions were having orgasms. That’s false data. He said he interviewed 4,441 women and reported that no women were ever seriously raped. That’s false data. Nobody has ever commented on the fact that not one of his 4,441 women ever had a serious rape experience. Nowadays one woman in four is supposed to have been raped. I know things were better in the ’40s, but they weren’t paradise. Life never is. If that’s the case, why don’t we return to the 1930s? Where are all the scientists who are reviewing this material?

    WND: What do you think of the Kinsey Institute’s current work?

    JR: It’s the biggest con job in the history of science. And I count Russia in that. You’ve got all these people carrying on about global warming, all those exposes yet nobody dares expose this guy. Big Pharma and the pornography industry have been funding the Kinsey Institute for years, and no mainstream media will look into it.

    WND: How has the Kinsey Institute affected American society over the years?

    JR: People really should read my book, “Sexual Sabotage.” We have based our entire legal, social, educational and behavioral system on one insane sexual psychopath and the cult that he collected around him. Do not be surprised that the Pentagon had 265 people caught downloading child pornography, that our teachers, along with priests and others, are off the charts raping and sodomizing children, that our divorce rate is similarly off the charts, that STDs are rampant (Kinsey likely died of an STD and sexual trauma) and that every single measure of sexual pathology has increased a thousand-fold since Kinsey. We are his legacy! Our presidents are, our judges are, our lawyers are, our legislatures and educators are, they all reflect his legacy. As does our mass media certainly.

    Kinsey has spun off into a huge industry. These are the people who are educating our children in colleges, high schools and grade schools. For years they’ve been giving one another graduate degrees. It’s a sex cult industry on the backs of the so-called scientific sexuality field. They’re all over the Web and all over the universities. It’s not just through the mass media, it’s definitely through the university system. Those who see themselves as the elite, the ones who will lead us all into their own personal, painful pathologies.

    The medical profession was the first to be seduced. Before sexologists, the place people went for sexual guidance was either to religious leaders or to their medical doctors. Now, both of those groups were the most conservative groups in the country. MDs and clergy saw the suffering – STDs, out-of-wedlock pregnancies, rapes, all the consequences of out-of-control sex. Kinsey went out and lectured to these professions in particular, and to the legal profession because he wanted to change the laws. He and his disciples developed their first training programs for medical doctors. The excuse given was that doctors had to be desensitized so they could help all patients nonjudgmentally. Once you controlled the medical profession, seduced them, they would echo Kinsey’s sexual morality, telling their patients just to be careful, use condoms, homosexuality is normal, and supporting drugs for the subsequent diseases. They would not block Kinseyan sexual radicals.

    WND: What can people do to rid the culture of Kinsey’s influence?

    JR: We certainly are calling for, at last, a congressional investigation. ALEC (The American Legislative Exchange Council) has called for states to hold an immediate investigation of Kinsey’s influence, to end funding of all groups that are grounded in Kinsey’s work, including Planned Parenthood and SIECUS. The most important thing is to educate both the law courts and the court of public opinion, that we’ve been conned, tricked and manipulated by a corrupt man, a corrupt institute, and a corrupt field of “sexology” with its offshoots – or we’ll never survive.

    No civilized world can remain civilized mimicking Kinseyan sexuality, the repudiation of Judeo-Christian moral standards. We must fight to retrieve our nation back, our pre-Kinsey sexual standards. With all its warts, pre-Kinsey we still were the greatest, safest, healthiest, wealthiest, most family-protective nation in the world.

    http://www.drjudithreisman.com/archives/2010/10/wnd_exclusive_e.html

    Like

  70. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 13, 2012 8:00 pm

    There is a NYTimes review of the 2004 movie made about Alfred Kinsey that has info:

    “But the most controversial scene in the movie is Kinsey’s infamous meeting with a sexual omnivore, whose history of sexual encounters with men, women, boys, girls, animals and family members took 17 hours to record. In Mr. Condon’s version, Wardell Pomeroy, a research assistant played by Chris O’Donnell, walks out in disgust, leaving Kinsey alone to face the monster whom his refusal to moralize about sex seems to have conjured up. It was actually another of Kinsey’s associates who disapproved (“I don’t think, to tell you the truth, that Pomeroy would have cared twopence,” says Mr. Gathorne-Hardy), but the rest is accurate.
    The meeting took place in June 1944, when the pedophile, said to have been a man named Rex King, was 63. Before and after the meeting, Kinsey wrote to King, coaxing him to send his detailed diaries of his sexual exploits, including those with children. Jones reports that on Nov. 24, 1944, for example, Kinsey wrote, “I rejoice at everything you send, for I am then assured that that much more of your material is saved for scientific publication.” Kinsey published much of King’s data in “Sexual Behavior in the Human Male,” where tables summarized King’s attempts to bring to orgasm boys between the ages of 2 months and 15 years, in some cases over a period as long as 24 hours. Kinsey attributed the data not to one source but to many. But in 1995 John Bancroft, who was director of the Kinsey Institute until this spring, discovered that all the data came from King. In a forthcoming article, Dr. Bancroft suggests that Kinsey might have wanted to shield King from public attention.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/03/movies/

    The charts 31-34 come from this person Rex King. These charts are not in any way reliably scientific as the data came from a single pedophile.

    In a section on the web about sexuality in children, it only spoke of parents not being alarmed or confused if infants touched themselves or if boys had erections, as this is normal, and that children 3-5 may be curious about their own or other’s bodies, but that this is normal too. In no way, was there a suggestion that the children are ‘sexual’ in an adult way–just that they are exploring, and that parents should give them factual info and not be judgmental.

    Kinsey was a sexual mess, it seems, the NYT review talks about his various activities, wife-swapping, tying himself with ropes, and even circumcising himself a year or so before he died! OMG.

    Like

  71. December 13, 2012 7:01 pm

    I am not against scientific research either, but if it is done by criminal methods it is the same as Mengele’s experiments on prisoners in Nazi concentration camps, irrespective of results and conclusions.

    The information about Kinsey’s methods became known already in early 90s – this is when Dr. Reisman’s findings were made public – but it is amazing that neither mainstream, nor tabloid media turned it into any news worthy of attention. No, Kinsey still remains an “authority” despite his criminal experiments, while innocent people like Michael Jackson were harassed in the most ruthless manner.

    It is the CONTRAST of it which is so amazing.

    In these circumstances one can’t help thinking that Michael’s harassment was done for distracting everyone’s attention from some processes implanted into the society and encouraged to develop deep inside it.

    While people were talking and talking and talking (about Michael) the society was quietly eroded by “scientists” of Kinsey’s kind. Now I understand perfectly well why professors like Kincaid felt absolutely safe to recommend a pedophilia book by O’Carroll “for family reading”. He is not alone – there is a huge lobby of them and under the cover of all that psydo-scientific research they are getting away with anything!

    Dr. Reisman say that when she disclosed those findings she faced a fiece opposition from an academic pedophilia lobby and from those psychiatrists who never wondered how he had obtained his results but were used to look at Kinsey as god. She said they would have lynched her if they only could.

    I am more than sure that these are the real roots for Michael Jackson’s harassment.

    The real reason was DISTRACTION from what they were doing.

    Like

  72. December 13, 2012 6:48 pm

    To jump to something more positive.The pic. in the article inspired me:Michael as the arch-
    angel defeating satan. -Although my country is mostly protestant. the second being Orthodox christianity, we do have “Saint days”. St. Michael´s day is on Sept. 29.

    Like

  73. December 13, 2012 6:31 pm

    And using pedofiles as assistants, I guess performing the stimulation on children. I can
    hardly think of anything worse.And he became somekind of authority on the subject.
    I don´t have time now to research Kinsey, but of late, only too late, there has been critisism of him.

    Like

  74. December 13, 2012 6:26 pm

    VMJ, those experiments, immoral and should have been illegal too.The most reductionist view of human sexuallity.Not that I am totally agains scientific, ethical research on the subject.And Kinsey subjected children to his experiments- that is criminal.They made a film about those too. Now I cannot remember that movie exactly, just that it made me depressed.

    Like

  75. December 13, 2012 4:54 pm

    Kaarin, of course we know that a dream about a bad wolf chasing a child is no proof of sexual abuse. But since this conversation suddenly started in this post I would like to have your opinion about Kinsey’s sex experiments on children, conducted with the help of pedophiles? This is not an “allegation” but is a proven fact admitted by Paul Gebhard who replaced Kinsey as director of their Institite. He used to be Kinsey’s associate.

    What is your opinion of a page like this one from Kinsey’s book showing that some 4 year-old boys were stimulated for orgasm for 24 hours?

    This is what Dr. Reisman is writing about the way these “data” were obtained:

    “This is “Table 34” from Sexual Behavior in the Human Male (1948) page 180, 5 month baby tested for “orgasm” allegedly has “3” and the 4 year old has “26” in “24 hrs,” which is a round the clock experiment on this child, and others. This was obtained, the Kinsey people claim, from the Nazi, Von Balluseck, and/or from “Rex King,” the Arizona rapist of 800 children that Kinsey and his colleagues celebrate. http://www.drjudithreisman.com/archives/2010/10/table_34.html

    Past Kinsey researchers including Paul Gebhard, who helped research the Kinsey Reports, have acknowledged on the record that indeed Kinsey worked with and covered for pedophiles.

    Kinsey and his colleagues also refused to report to law enforcement the ongoing child molestation while compiling data for Kinsey’s 1948 and 1953 books on human sexual behavior, according to Gebhard.

    “It was illegal and we knew it was illegal and that’s why a lot of people are furious,” said Gebhard in 1998. “They say we should have turned him in instantly … [but] if we had turned him in it would have been the end of our research project.”

    Gebhard assumed leadership of the Kinsey Institute after Kinsey died in 1956.

    Kinsey and his colleagues admit to protecting the identities of at least two pedophiles, an Arizona government employee and a Nazi, because the men were producing data on childhood sexual response that was valuable to their research on prepubescent orgasm.

    …”The information we got on childhood sexuality came from the observations of nursery school people, parents and pedophiles,” Kinsey’s co-author Paul Gebhard told the Bloomington, Indiana Herald-Times in 1995.

    “Kinsey had contact with all [the pedophiles] that he could find,” according to Clarence Tripp, Kinsey’s photographer, in an interview with Yorkshire Television for its 1998 documentary, “Kinsey’s Paedophiles.”

    “[Kinsey] was deeply affected by five paedophile headmasters who … had … loving relationships with young adolescent boys of 12 or 13,” Kinsey biographer Jonathan Gathorne-Hardy told Yorkshire Television in 1998.

    Gebhard told Yorkshire Television, “We got them [pedophiles] in prisons, a lot of them. … We’d go after them … Then there was also a pedophile organization in this country … not incarcerated … they cooperated.”

    Alfred Kinsey himself attributed the data on the 317 children to at least nine men, according to his statement on page 177 of the 1948 edition of “Sexual Behavior in the Human Male”:

    http://www.drjudithreisman.com/archives/2010/10/wnd_exclusive_p.html

    Like

  76. December 13, 2012 3:33 pm

    Also;”, I dreamt that a bad wolf chased me..”,is by itself no proof of SA.Thay type of dreams are very common in childhood. As often dreams convey anxiety, and some amount of anxiety is ubiqutous of the human conditon.,be it in a child or adult.

    Like

  77. December 13, 2012 2:24 am

    Re interviews of possible sex abused children. Much depend on the childs age, that is, the way you conduct an interview. Each interview is a separate event and it is somewhat diffucult to set forth concrete rules. Occasionally, as the first case above a 3yo boy went into sexual behaviour spontaneously and immediately after entering my office. This is usually not the case. I have never understood why children disclose events (not speaking about sex here). like accidents years ago, or something else traumatic. When I later ask the parents they are surprised: Oh, he never speaks about that at home.-My strategy is to start a totally open interview ,by for ex asking; How come you are here (In my office)Some may give a concrete answer:I came by car.Me:Whose idea was it that you come here?Then asking what he/she herself feels about it.and also what parents told her..Already these simple questions give you a lot.Then I take a deep dive into the childs unconscious,to his or her fantasy by various means.Not asking any direct questions re sex at all, You will be surprised how much is revealed by this method.,Based on the info through these means you get a lot.. At that time the child feels totally at ease, almost always, and you can ask a few questions based on what you got throug “the unconsios way”. I had the luck of a very skilled art therapist who did not have any background info on the cases. I sent the child to her.
    Then later we compared “notes” and it was surprising how they fit . You leave question and answers to the very end. Just about every child will give an answer to the question:Has anybody messed with your private parts.?.-I know this is a complex issue and would need a whole seminar, or better still observation of expierienced interviewers and practice, practice. Sometimes only observation on an in-pt unit will give answers.

    Like

  78. December 13, 2012 12:41 am

    “Thanks very much for the info re Kinsey–wow!–I had no idea. He was always respected, I thought. Gardener is repeating the same things as Kinsey re infants and even newborns having orgasms and being highly sexual, so he was familiar with Kinsey’s take on that and his ‘research.’ It seems he found Kinsey’s arguments convincing.”

    Aldeberan, it isn’t that Gardner “found them convincing”. You didn’t understand – the whole science world was shattered to its very foundation by Kinsey’s studies and didn’t dispute his findings. Kinsey is the reason for the sexual revolution of the 60s and changes towards homosexuaity, and this is why he is considered so big an authority. Gardner just repeated some of Kinsey’s ideas in the same way other scientists repeated them.

    The people in the site you mentioned were outraged by Gardner? Oh, they have never read Kinsey then! I know about him from the time when I did research of the professors who recommended Tom O’Carroll’s book. When I first read that they advised this pedophilia book “for family reading” my hair stood on end and I did an extensive research. A small fraction of it was posted here in the blog – while the rest stayed somewhere in the background (in the comments and my memory). The Kinsey subject is too specific, and too horrible to read about, so I put most of it aside. However his views are all around us, as the situation with Gardner shows it.

    Why are you so sure that he did not support pedophilia?

    Because what I’m writing here is only a tiny fraction of what I read. Richard Gardner contributed his articles to the Institute for Psychological Therapies founded by Ralf Underwager: http://www.ipt-forensics.com/staff/underwager.htm

    Ralph Underwager (28 July 1929 – 29 November 2003) was an American minister and psychologist who rose to prominence as a defense witness for adults accused of child sexual abuse in the 1980s and 1990s. Until his death in 2003, he was the director of the Institute for Psychological Therapies, which he founded in 1974. He was also a founder of Victims of Child Abuse Laws (VOCAL), a lobby group which represented the interests of parents whose children had been removed from their care by social services over abuse allegations. He was a founding member of the False Memory Syndrome Foundation. He earned a masters degree from Concordia Seminary of St. Louis and a Ph.D. from the University of Minnesota. He was a pastor of Lutheran Churches in Iowa and Minnesota. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ralph_Underwager

    I read a huge number of their publications when I was looking for correct ways to interview children in order not to implant false ideas of molestation into their minds. Actually I was searching for information about Dr. Katz and his fiasco in interviewing children at St.Martin’s school. This is how I found this Institute and read almost all the articles related to false accusations (it took me a week or so non-stop). And this is how I found that Gardner and Underwager were absolutely not pro-pedophilia – they were working on the problem of false child abuse accusations. And advocating the innocent and wrongly accused is absolutely not the same as being an advocate of pedophilia.

    One thing should NEVER be confused with the other. In fact a false accusation in this horrible crime is no better than the crime itself. It also ruins the lives of people, and we know it by Michael Jackson’s example.

    Here is a link to the journal of that institute – look for yourself: http://www.ipt-forensics.com/journal/index.htm

    And here is a link to one of Richard Gardner’s articles there – on the problem of correct interviews of children: http://www.ipt-forensics.com/journal/volume3/j3_1_7.htm

    In the hysteria of child abuse accusations every word Gardner and Underwager said was snatched out of context and condemned. Underwager was also accused of being an advocate of ped-lia due to some misquoted words, though none of his research suggested it. Moreveor Underwager was the one who criticized James Kincaid, the “professor” who recommended Tom O’Carroll’s book and wrote an opus with an incredible title “The culture of child molesting” http://www.amazon.com/Erotic-Innocence-Culture-Child-Molesting/dp/0822321939

    Actually it is James Kincaid who is a highly suspicious guy. He is quoted by NAMBLA on every corner – however you will not find sites accusing Kincaid of anything. And the sites telling the truth about Alfred Kinsey are very scarce too, all of them appeared only recently after Dr. Reisman’s sensational discoveries. For the rest of the public Kinsey unfortunately remains an “authority”.

    He should not be. Alfred Kinsey used CRIMINAL methods and was totally INSANE.

    When I see that those who have nothing to do with pedophiles are accused of pedophilia, while perverts live a long and happy life and are applauded to I feel like Alice in Wonderland.

    Why do they talk about Gardner and Underwager? And Michael Jackson? This is what they should be talking of – see the quote from Dr. Riesman’s site:

    Nearly 70 years after being molested repeatedly by her own father, “Esther White” (a pseudonym) is speaking out in hope of prompting Congress to investigate the controversial research. White said she would be willing to testify in person on Capitol Hill if an investigation results in opening the Kinsey Institute files to public scrutiny.

    “He was giving me orgasms and timing it with a stopwatch,” White told WND. “I didn’t like it, I went into convulsions, but he didn’t care. He said all little girls do this with their daddies, they just don’t talk about it.”

    White was 7 when her father began abusing her.

    “There’s no question that Kinsey broke a number of laws and conspired to break a number of laws to conduct his faux research,” said Matt Barber, a law professor and associate dean at the Liberty University School of Law.

    Kinsey’s 1948 and 1953 books on human sexual behavior contain tables of information about sexual responses in children as young as 2 months old. Several tables record how long the children needed to be stimulated to achieve “orgasm,” and others record how many orgasms the children achieved in given periods of time…

    Full story: http://www.drjudithreisman.com/archives/2010/10/wnd_exclusive_s.html

    Like

  79. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 13, 2012 12:02 am

    Yes, Rodrigo, it WOULD have been good if Evan had left a note, but as VMJ revealed, admitting he lied in 1993 or that Jordan lied could imperil the $$ they extorted b/c the steelement said they could not talk about the case outside a courtroom. Maybe he could have left a more vague note without a specific reference, such as “I told many lies that hurt other greatly,’ or something like that. But he couldn’t do even that much for his own conscience let alone those he damaged.

    “If the child feels guilt about participating in the sexual activities with adults, Gardner (1992, p. 549) recommends that the child be told that in other societies such behavior is considered normal and that our society has an exaggeratedly punitive and moralistic attitude about adult-child sexual encounters. Older children may be helped to appreciate that sexual encounters between an adult and a child are not universally considered to be reprehensible acts. The child might be told about other societies in which such behavior was and is considered normal. The child might be helped to appreciate the wisdom of Shakespeare’s Hamlet, who said, “Nothing’s either good or bad, but thinking makes it so.” (Gardner, 1992, p. 549)

    I just think this is way too intellectual for a child who has been violated and traumatized. It is very remote from personal experience to talk about “other societies” or the rather intellectual, philosophical content of Shakespeare’s quote, which is a translation of what was on the royal coat of arms (and on Michael Neverland Gate”–Honi soit qui mal y pense). I think therapy needs more attention to the individual’s emotional/psychological reactions. Also a child will know that our society does not condone this act, so how much will it help to know about other societies, such as Afghanistan or ancient Greece, etc.??

    Like

  80. Rodrigo permalink
    December 12, 2012 11:05 pm

    That is indeed disturbing, and I had no idea Gardner was dead, or he killed himself for that matter.

    So many people who were around Michael have died in unusual ways. Murders passed off as suicides and accidents? Even Michael himself.

    Looking at Gardner’s wounds, that really doesn’t seem like a suicide. Something isn’t right with any of it.

    Even Evan’s death could boil down to guilt over what he did, since we know Michael was innocent. I’ve always wondered why he never left a note.
    But wasn’t there the explanation that he was losing all his mental capabilities, to the point that he couldn’t even write? How convenient. I wouldn’t be surprised if had left one and somebody disposed of it. So many questions surrounding his death have been left unanswered, and nobody in the media has even bothered to ask, which is odd.

    All these deaths are just bizarre.

    Like

  81. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 12, 2012 10:56 pm

    Thanks very much for the info re Kinsey–wow!–I had no idea. He was always respected, I thought. Gardener is repeating the same things as Kinsey re infants and even newborns having orgasms and being highly sexual, so he was familiar with Kinsey’s take on that and his ‘research.’ It seems he found Kinsey’s arguments convincing. Why are you so sure, VMJ, that he did not support pedophilia?

    The whole thing with Gardener and his interview with Jordan is very interesting and suspicious. He died in 2003 and Halperin published the interview (not the complete part, as you and Kaarin point out) in his book in 08-09 (I am not sure the exact date of his ‘Unmasked’ publication). I am wondering why Jordan did not sue him for that?

    His death comes, as you note, VMJ, at a very important time in Michael’s life. The doctor-patient confidentiality is a legal protection. I am wondering how that interview got leaked. Was Gardener’s name ever brought up in the trial? I would imagine not but maybe it was.

    As far as Gardener’s theories, it is interesting to me that he self-published his major works, instead of finding more scientific publishing houses. He is generally criticized for lack of scientific support for his views, so maybe that’s why he self-published?

    From the NYT obit:

    “He wrote ”The Parental Alienation Syndrome and the Differentiation Between Fabricated and Genuine Child Sex Abuse” in 1987 and ”Sex-Abuse Hysteria: Salem Witch Trials Revisited” in 1991, each self-published.

    Correction: June 14, 2003, Saturday An obituary on Monday about Dr. Richard A. Gardner, a psychiatrist and psychoanalyst, misstated his position at Columbia University. He was a clinical professor of psychiatry in the division of child and adolescent psychiatry — an unpaid volunteer — not a professor of child psychiatry.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2003/06/09/nyregion/richard-gardner-72-dies-cast-doubt-on-abuse-claims.html

    His 1992 book ‘True and False Accusations of Child Sex Abuse’ was also self-published Oct, 1992, around the same time as Jordan’s interview. I think he was selected by Feldman b/c he was sympathetic to fathers, known to support fathers in custody cases.

    His suicide is certainly strange, to say the least. A few of the wounds seem superficial (1/16 of an inch is not deep), but why he didn’t just take meds is not clear. Or even shoot or hang himself. His was a very gory way to die (understatement). Maybe it WAS a murder??

    The suicides of people significant to Michael are mounting up. Evan, the force behind the 93 allegation and extortion; Gardener, the doctor who supported Evan’s claims or at least gave them some legitimacy; Peter Lopez, the lawyer who knew about the various business deals and the backstory; Wishna, the businessman who persuaded Michael to return to USA. I did know about DiLeo’s accident re overdose of anesthetic. wow.

    Kaarin, I hope you get some more sleep. We must take care of our own health, and be careful about stress.

    Like

  82. December 12, 2012 8:22 pm

    “I can’t see how anyone could live long enough to inflict this many wounds to himself, but drs. called this suicide?” -Linda

    I am sorry but instead of looking into Jack Wishna’s suicide I looked into Richard Gardner’s death on May 25, 2003 and can’t believe my eyes that they called it a “suicide” with a straight face.

    All in all there were nine wounds. Three knife cuts were on the right side of the neck:

    the 1st was 1/16 inches = 0,15cm deep
    the 2nd was 1/8 inches = 0,3 cm deep and around 4 cm long
    the 3d was 1/2 inches = 1,25cm deep and 3 1/4 inches = 8cm long. The knife incised the muscle and the vein, starting a hemorrhage.

    There were also two separate V-shape incisions = 0,6cm each in the same area

    On the left side of the chest there were four knife wounds:

    the 1st was 3/8 inches = 1cm deep
    the 2nd was 2 inches = 5 cm deep
    the 3d was 2 inches = 5 cm deep
    the 4th wound was 5 inches = 12,7 cm deep. It penetrated the heart and this is where the knife was found.

    So they expect us to believe that first Dr. Gardner made two v-shape incisions, and then cut himself three more times on the right of the neck, so that one of the attemps produced an incision 1,25cm deep, 8cm long which cut the vein…

    Then, as if this wasn’t painful and bloody enough, he inflicted himself three more wounds, two of which were 5 cm deep…

    And after all that he was still strong enough to deliver himself a fatal blow which went direct into the heart and was 12,7 cm deep?

    And having such a description we are supposed to believe that Dr. Richard Gardner committed suicide?
    Who do they take us for?

    To me this looks not only like murder, but like torturing him first.



    Source: http://cincinnatipas.com/dr-richardgardnerautopsy.html

    Like

  83. December 12, 2012 5:01 pm

    “Paris noted Nov.20th which is childrens day. There is an article on MJJ.777.com on that date. She had not forgotten it. I think somewhere you, Helena said you cannot access that site. That is a pity. It is different in style and format than this, but very good.” -kaarin

    Seven contacted me soon after I’d written about it and now MJJ.777 site is working for the area I come from too. Her site is indeed very good and it is only about Michael’s last album that we adhere to opposite views. I hope one day she will also look at it in a more appreciative way.

    Like

  84. December 12, 2012 12:45 pm

    Michael was a great humanitarian and one only hopes the Estate gets the money where it belongs,to Michaels children. They are still young but Paris noted Nov.20th which is childrens day. There is an article on MJJ.777.com on that date. She had not forgotten it. I think somewhere you, Helena said you cannot access that site.That is a pity. It is different in style and format than this, but very good.

    I woke up after only 4 hrs sleep after I had read the sites for Dr. Gardener. It was only then I got to know what he was about. I still din´t know about that piece , allegedly from an interview with Jordan. There is neither a beginning nor an end to that piece. It would not surprise me if Evan had gotten a hint from someone that there was where to go. A psych. interview starts with identification of the interviewee, date etc. Reason for referral. Referred by (it was Feldman I believe) and at the end of course the conclusions and recommendations.

    The interview itself was not what I would call a usual type for children, adolescents – but here the aim of the interview was stated to be finding out if Jordan told the thruth.

    Or maybe an exercise for Jordan.

    Like

  85. December 12, 2012 12:30 pm

    “I can’t see how anyone could live long enough to inflict this many wounds to himself, but drs. called this suicide? Something doesn’t jive here, and the timing is interesting, like Evan Chandler. Didn’t he commit suicide a few months after Michael’s death?”

    Linda, the timing of Dr. Gardner‘s “suicide” is even more interesting than you think. It happened on May 25, 2003 or just before the Arvizos started making their allegations about Michael. This was when they went to Larry Feldman, and Larry Feldman in his turn sent them to Dr. Katz.

    Considering that both Dr. Gardner and Dr. Katz had earlier worked on the Jordan Chandler case, the timing of the “suicide” is getting more interesting than ever.

    Let us suppose that Dr. Gardner gave a negative opinion about Jordan Chandler after the interview with him in 1993 (I highly suspect that he did as we have only the transcript but no doctor’s resolution).

    Let us suppose that in 2003 Dr. Gardner could be approached to share his views on the past allegations and he shared his opinion that the boy in the earlier case was not telling the truth.

    Then, with no “prior acts” supporting the Arvizo case there was no “pattern” to describe and the new case would have easily fallen apart even before starting!

    In these circumstances 4 stabs in the chest and 3 incisions in the neck as Dr. Gardner’s “suicide” look even stranger than they are.

    Now if we add to it the death of Michael’s lawyer Peter Lopez who allegedly shot himself but there was no weapon found beside the body, and the death of Michael’s manager Frank Dileo who was accidentally given a double doze of anesthetics, went into a coma and then died, and the recent suicide of Jack Wishna, the man who closely cooperated with Michael upon his return to the US, a healthy 54 old man who died of carbon monoxide intoxication in a car in his own garage which turned out to be a big surprise to his best friends – well, I am sorry, but it does begin to resemble the Kennedy case.

    I need some time to put together the articles I’ve found about Jack Wishna’s role in Michael Jackson’s life.

    Like

  86. December 12, 2012 12:25 pm

    That was Framk Dileo whom Michael had appointed his manager week(s?) before he died.
    After he fired Thome that is. Thome just refused to leave and was at the hospital when Michael died too.

    Like

  87. Linda permalink
    December 12, 2012 11:14 am

    @Helena

    Four stabs in the chest and three incised wounds by a knife on the neck do not look to me like a suicide. If it was, it was a very painful and long method to do it. If a doctor wanted to commit suicide he could have chosen some medication which was surely available to him.

    I can’t see how anyone could live long enough to inflict this many wounds to himself, but drs. called this suicide? Even I could kill myself faster and with less pain than this. Something doesn’t jive here, and the timing is interesting, like Evan Chandler. Didn’t he commit suicide a few months after Michael’s death? Then that cigar smoking guy, darn what was his name? Had a heart attack and was given a double dose of anesthesia by mistake, went into a coma and died. So much weirdness surrounding Mike’s death. This is getting as crazy as Marilyn Monroe and Pres Kennedy’s deaths. Much speculations, but no answers, so far.

    Like

  88. December 12, 2012 4:31 am

    There are newer approaches being developed to PTSD now.Of course the pt will tell his/her expierience, but constant dwelling on the trauma is not the case. In no way will the trauma be trivialized. These new techniques apply esp. to very severe traumas, there are many of those now, from US service men in Afganistan and other coutries. I have not come upon anything stating their use in sex abuse trauma.

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  89. December 12, 2012 4:06 am

    Re high sexual urges infancy. Sure, after somebody has often, repeatedly, over time “messed with their private parts”. It renders the child into a very unpleasant state.
    There is a female disorder where she constantly feels on the brink of orgasm, I don´t know much about it, but some gynecologists are familiar with this. The women are desperate to get rid of this as it it unpleasant.. So far I haven´t come upon anything that relates this to sex abuse. Mostly the gynecologists see it as a neurological disorder.

    Like

  90. December 12, 2012 3:48 am

    Thank you alderbaranredstar and helena for educating me on what this Dr. Gardener really meant by that term and what wildly dangerous practices he advised. I took it initially to mean estrangement from the non custodial parent or cases where a child was kidnapped to another country and the other parent lost all contact with the child. Estrangement can be bad enough as children who have been removed from severely disturbed parents, usually with drug abuse and violence, often years after start asking if they have a father and where is he. In my expierience mothers, drugabusers, where more interested in some contact, even when this had to be superwised. As a M.D. he was a mandatory reporter of suspected sex or other abuse, in NY there was an 800 tel.nr. for that. I know how hot these topics can get and received death threats from some fathers.

    I don´t much like to tell about pt. experieiences on this blog, but can tell something in general. A young boy 3yo had been sexabused. Once in the office he grabbed a female doll and put her on the floor faking SI, then turned her on top and did it again. Another family (fostercare) were distressed what to do about a young boy who masturbated constantly, they finally had tied his hand “with silk” obviosly with good intentions, but thats not what to do.-It surprises me that he was allowed to practice at all.-These children need psychotherapy and you need to find a good foster home, and foster parents who are willing and will work with you too. These children are not happy and don´t enjoy the masturbation. In a good home and with years of therapy they can turn out well. I have many horror stories, but I´ll let it be by those 2. Where I worked his theories were for sure not applied. I was also impressed by the many really good and caring fosterparents, often they ended up adopting the child. A scent of NAMBA. We will never know

    Like

  91. December 12, 2012 1:09 am

    “Also the statement re “high sexual urges in infancy” seems incredible to me. Who is having all these sexual fantasies–children or adults?”

    Aldebaran, our conversation about these things is surely taking place in the wrong place and wrong time. I am absolutely no specialist in matters like “sexual urges in infancy” and don’t even want to be one, but I need to tell you one thing.

    What surprises me greatly is that one phrase out of Dr. Gardner is taken out of some unknown context and is linked to ped-les, but at the same time no one, I mean NO ONE is speaking about what another, totally criminal doctor was saying and doing. I mean Dr. Kinsey.

    Dr. Kinsey is considered to be an untouchable authority, though he conducted sexual experiments on small children including infants! To do that he employed the “services” of pedophiles who did it to children for years.

    Later on he published a book about his findings, where he was proving that children (including infants) also have “sexual urges” and broke his “data” by age groups.

    Everyone was amazed by his findings but no one asked a single question how he managed to obtain those results. Only recently the first questions were ventured by Dr. Judith Reisman – she called it the Kinsey Coverup: http://www.drjudithreisman.com/the_kinsey_coverup.html.

    And when they did look there was no end to their horror – he trained pedophiles to use stop watches to measure the climax after “stimulation” in children from age 5 months to adolescence!

    Here is his table http://www.drjudithreisman.com/archives/2010/10/stopwatch.html:

    Kinsey experiments

    Dr. Kinsey – this is the real father of modern-day pedophilia.

    Not only did he use totally criminal methods in order to obtain his results, but he was popularizing the idea that children are sexual beings. Even if they are, it does not mean that children need to be sexualized and that their instincts put into their bodies by nature should be exploited!

    What for? To give satisfaction to some adults?

    Michael Jackson, by the way, adhered to exactly the opposite point of view – he defended the right of children to innocence and be free from the influence of adult life for as long as it was possible. This is why he was trying to prolong the childhood of every kid – through games, innocent child play, water fights, etc. He wanted to shield them from the dirt of this world and allow them to face it only when they were adult enough to handle it.

    Like

  92. December 12, 2012 12:27 am

    “Here’s info from Wikipedia on Gardener’s theory of PAS. In the link I gave you the entire autopsy report is included, the link that you noted was not the best.”

    Aldebaran, I read that autopsy report long ago and was very much impressed by it. Four stabs in the chest and three incised wounds by a knife on the neck do not look to me like a suicide. If it was, it was a very painful and long method to do it. If a doctor wanted to commit suicide he could have chosen some medication which was surely available to him.

    As regards Gardner’s theory of PAS I personally think that it was some nonsense. But the point I am trying to make is that Dr. Gardner did not favor pedophilia which some people try to accuse him of. Many of his quotes were taken out of context. In many cases he was simply trying to help the victims of molestation, though probably not in the best way. The idea of desensibilization through constant talking about the abuse may be right – the more you talk the less burden it is. Here is a quote from a negative review about his research:

    Gardner (1992, p. 535) views post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) as “nature’s natural form of systemic desensitization.” Gardner recommends that the mother be discouraged from involving herself with litigation [2] as “it will interfere with the natural desensitization process and will subject the child to a wide variety of interrogations that will inevitably be damaging” (Gardner,1992, p. 577). Moreover, legal and psychiatric investigation of the trauma may cause more psychological damage to the child than that done by the abuse (Gardner, 1988, p. 75). The PTSD-desensitization process involves repetition of the trauma verbally, emotionally, and during fantasy play (Gardner, 1992, p. 532). The child becomes preoccupied with thoughts and feelings about the trauma. Each time the child relives the experience, it becomes a little more bearable (Gardner 1988, p. 75). Over time “the preoccupations diminish often to the point where they may be entirely forgotten” (Gardner, 1992, p. 536). Eventually, the process may help the child to “bury the whole incident” (Gardner, 1988, p. 75). According to Gardner (1992, p. 536): the goal of therapy should be to “facilitate the desensitization process, not artificially prolong it” with psychotherapeutic “muckraking.”

    If the child feels guilt about participating in the sexual activities with adults, Gardner (1992, p. 549) recommends that the child be told that in other societies such behavior is considered normal and that our society has an exaggeratedly punitive and moralistic attitude about adult-child sexual encounters. Older children may be helped to appreciate that sexual encounters between an adult and a child are not universally considered to be reprehensible acts. The child might be told about other societies in which such behavior was and is considered normal. The child might be helped to appreciate the wisdom of Shakespeare’s Hamlet, who said, “Nothing’s either good or bad, but thinking makes it so.” (Gardner, 1992, p. 549)
    Gardner notes that the child may exhibit strong sexual urges when the abuse discontinues. These children should be encouraged to masturbate (1992, pp. 580, 585).

    Though his methods of therapy may look controversial if they helped in the dramatic circumstances of child abuse they may still be okay. However this matter should be left to scientists who are doing research in this very sensitive sphere where every wrong step is as dangerous as in a minefield – so it is not up to us to make conclusions here. What is important is that Dr. Gardner was not spreading the ideas of pedophilia, though his PAS theory could be wrong.

    Like

  93. December 12, 2012 12:02 am

    “So, over 3 years later we’re still fighting to prove the fact that the vindicated has already been vindicated. Did that make sense to anyone, lol?”

    Linda, it makes very much sense. Only now that we know almost all the truth about Michael we are fighting for the people to look at themselves, admit that they were wrong and learn from their mistakes.

    However this is the most difficult part. They thought themselves to be “virtuous” and “upholding moral values” but it turned out that they haunted a completely innocent man and acted like barbarians themselves. This is hard to accept. So now they are getting out of their way to prove that they were right in harassing Michael.

    I wonder what they will say when they learn that while they were going after Michael real pedophilia was spreading like the plague, only they did not notice it because their attention was elsewhere. The truth is already surfacing with Sandusky and the other guy in England (forgot his name) being only a start.

    Like

  94. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 12, 2012 12:00 am

    Here’s info from Wikipedia on Gardener’s theory of PAS. In the link I gave you the entire autopsy report is included, the link that you noted was not the best.

    “Parental alienation syndrome (abbreviated as PAS) is term coined by Richard A. Gardner in the early 1980s to refer to what he describes as a disorder in which a child, on an ongoing basis, belittles and insults one parent without justification, due to a combination of factors, including indoctrination by the other parent (almost exclusively as part of a child custody dispute) and the child’s own attempts to denigrate the target parent.[1] Gardner introduced the term in a 1985 paper, describing a cluster of symptoms he had observed during the early 1980s.[1]
    Parental alienation syndrome is not recognized as a disorder by the medical or legal communities and Gardner’s theory and related research have been extensively criticized by legal and mental health scholars for lacking scientific validity and reliability.[2][3][4][5][6] However, the separate but related concept of parental alienation, the estrangement of a child from a parent, is recognized as a dynamic in some divorcing families.[2][7][8]
    The admissibility of PAS has been rejected by an expert review panel and the Court of Appeal of England and Wales in the United Kingdom and Canada’s Department of Justice recommends against its use, but has appeared in some family court disputes in the United States.[9][10] Gardner portrayed PAS as well accepted by the judiciary and having set a variety of precedents, but legal analysis of the actual cases indicates this claim was incorrect.[6]
    No professional association has recognized PAS as a relevant medical syndrome or mental disorder, and it is not listed in the American Psychiatric Association’s Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders or the International Statistical Classification of Diseases and Related Health Problems of the WHO.

    PAS has been cited in high-conflict divorce and child custody cases, particularly as a defense against accusations of domestic violence or sexual abuse.[4][21] The status of the syndrome, and thus its admissibility in the testimony of experts, has been the subject of dispute about the extent to which PAS has been accepted by the professionals in the field, as well as a scientific methodology that is testable, has been tested, has a known error rate, has been published and is peer-reviewed.[21]
    PAS has not been accepted by experts in psychology, child advocacy or the study of child abuse[5] or legal scholars.[6] PAS has been extensively criticized by members of the legal and mental health community, who state that PAS should not be admissible in child custody hearings based on both science and law.[6][4][5][21][28]
    PAS is not recognized by the American Medical Association or the American Psychiatric Association.[6][14][15][29] The American Psychological Association declined to give a position on PAS, but raised concerns over its lack of supporting data and how the term is used[30] and the APA’s 1996 Presidential Task Force on Violence and the Family expressed concern that custody evaluators use PAS as a means of giving custody to fathers despite a history of violence, a concern shared by other commentators.[4][31][32] The United States National Council of Juvenile and Family Court Judges rejected PAS, recommending it not be used for the consideration of child custody issues.[26]

    PAS is not included in the American Psychiatric Association’s Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-IV).[6][14][15][29] Gardner and others have lobbied for its inclusion in the next revision of the manual.[17][33] In 2001, Gardner argued that when the DSM-IV was released there was insufficient research to include PAS, but since then there have been enough scientific articles and attention to PAS that it merited being taken seriously.[17] A survey of American custody evaluators published in 2007 found that half of the respondents disagreed with its inclusion, while a third thought it should be.[12] A related formulation, parental alienation disorder, has been proposed as well; it was suggested that inclusion of PAS in the DSM-5 would promote research and appropriate treatment, as well as reduce misuse of a valid and reliable construct.[2] When a draft version of the DSM-5 was released in 2010, PAS was not included,[33] though parental alienation disorder does appear as a “Condition Proposed by Outside Sources” to be reviewed by a working group.[34]

    Gardner’s formulation of PAS is critiqued as lacking a scientific basis,[35][36][37] and as a hypothesis whose proponents have failed to meet the scientific burden of proof to merit acceptance.[6][35][37] The first publications about PAS were self-published and not peer reviewed,[8] and though subsequent articles have been published in peer reviewed journals, most have consisted of anecdotal evidence in the form of case studies;[38][39] in addition, the limited research into PAS has lacked evidence of its validity and reliability.[4][5] The lack of objective research and replication, falsifiability, and independent publication has led to claims that PAS is pseudoscience or junk science.[3][35][36] Proponents of PAS concur that large scale systematic controlled studies into PAS’s validity and reliability are required,[8][12][40] supplementing a single small study in 2004 which suggested practitioners could come to a consensus based on written reports.[28]
    The theoretical foundation of PAS has been described as incomplete, simplistic and erroneous for ignoring the multiple factors (including the behaviors of the child, parents and other family members) that may contribute to parental alienation, family dysfunction and a breakdown in attachment between a parent and a child.[8][13][31][38][41] In this view, PAS confuses a child’s developmental reaction to a divorce with psychosis, vastly overstates the number of false allegations of child sexual abuse, ignores the scientific literature suggesting most allegations of child sexual abuse are well founded and thus well-meaning efforts to protect a child from an abusive parent, exaggerates the damaging effects of parental alienation on children and proposes an unsupported and endangering remedy for PAS.[4][28] Concern has been expressed that PAS lacks adequate scientific support to be considered a syndrome and that Gardner has promoted PAS as a syndrome based on a vague clustering of behaviors.[8][15] Despite concerns about the validity of testimony regarding PAS, it has been inappropriately viewed as reliable by family court judges.[6] Proponents of PAS and others agree that using the designation of syndrome may be inappropriate as it implies more scientific legitimacy than it currently deserves.[19][24][40]
    While PAS is not accepted as a syndrome, parental alienation is a somewhat less controversial dynamic that has also appeared in the mental health and legal literature.[22][24] Since Gardner proposed PAS, other researchers in the field have suggested focusing less on diagnosing a syndrome and more on what has been described as the “alienated child,” and the dynamics of the situation that have contributed to the alienation.[13][24]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parental_alienation_syndrome

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  95. December 11, 2012 11:48 pm

    “One more suicide of people connected to Michael: Dr. Richard Gardener committed suicide May 25, 2003. He stabbed himself after taking medication. So he stabbed himself after the allegations against Michael were made widely public after LWMJ.” – aldebaran

    Dr. Gardner’s “suicide” is interesting – he actually stabbed himself with a knife (several times). This is strange. The very first stab would have incapacitated him so much that he wouldn’t have been able to make any more. To me it looks like murder all right.

    Like

  96. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 11, 2012 11:48 pm

    Hi, VMJ, thanks for that link. I just came across the Gardener stuff last night and was so shocked that he committed suicide in 03! I agree the site I last listed was not neutral (I also listed a NYTimes obit and I checked Wikipedia for PAS). The info you linked to, which I have to study but I am giving a quick reply, is, in my view, biased in favor of Gardener. The NYT obit says that he was a volunteer (unpaid) at Columbia. He tended to inflate his ‘expert credentials.’

    “Gardner (1992, p. 15) states: “There is good reason to believe that most, if not all, children have the capacity to reach orgasm at the time they are born.” In addition, some children experience “high sexual urges in early infancy” and “the normal [italics in original] child exhibits a wide variety of sexual fantasies and behaviors, many of which would be labeled as `sick’ or `perverted’ if exhibited by adults” (Gardner, 1991, p. 12).”

    I have ordered the 1992 book but just as a reaction, I find these statements unbelievable. How can a newborn have an orgasm? This makes no sense to me. Is this supported in any way that newborns have their erogenous zones so developed that they have a verifiable orgasm at birth?? Also the statement re “high sexual urges in infancy” seems incredible to me. Who is having all these sexual fantasies–children or adults?

    It IS interesting, though, that the link specifically brings up NAMBA and tries to rebut any shared views.

    Like

  97. December 11, 2012 11:32 pm

    http://cincinnatipas.com/richardgardner-pas.html -aldebaran

    Aldebaran, sites like the one you provided a link to can only mislead people, instead of telling them the truth. I have a much more serious article about Dr. Gardner – it is also terribly critical towards him, but at least provides longer quotes from him: http://www.leadershipcouncil.org/1/res/dallam/2.html

    And this review is more positive: http://www.deltabravo.net/cms/plugins/content/content.php?content.363

    NO, he absolutely WASN’T a supporter of pedophilia. But when he said that some cultures accept it he was unfortunately right. Even now you can see pictures like this one – both these girls were married at the age of SIX!

    The picture comes from the World photo competition held in London in 2012:

    ‘Child brides’: This image by Stephanie Sinclair won first prize in the Contemporary Issues Stories category. Pictured are Tahani (in pink), who was married at the age of six, and her former classmate Ghada, also a child bride, standing with their husbands outside their home in Hajjah, Yemen

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2230601/World-Press-Photo-2012-Picture-drug-addled-Ukrainian-prostitute-startling.html?ICO=most_read_module

    Like

  98. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 11, 2012 11:21 pm

    “I find it disgusting, no matter in which “culture” it takes place. In my place people are also quickly losing conscience and the ability to tell good from evil – making nasty pranks on people for the sake of a laugh on TV is also becoming a norm. I don’t watch TV any more as all of it is unbearable.” VMJ

    Yes, I agree we are seeing a sad decline of civilization and descending into a mental state much worse than any savagery ever seen before. The efforts of humans over time to achieve moral values and virtues, the many teachers who have come to teach us and lead us forward in our evolution, all this work over centuries has been LOST. I just read an article about a new movie about the Bin Laden capture that graphically shows the torture of prisoners. This torture, first of all, did not lead to any good intelligence information, although the movie presents it as if it did, and then the fact that it is illegal and immoral is overlooked. Instead, people are going to flock to see this movie and are going to be convinced that torture is acceptable. When we get to the point that we see torture as a good thing, we are truly LOST as a society.

    I am glad you are working on the Wishna connection, VMJ, and I look forward to reading the results of your work. I recommend that you also look, when you have time, at Richard A. Gardener. There is a LOT more here than meets the eye. Please read my comments about him and check the links, when you have an opportunity.

    Like

  99. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 11, 2012 11:12 pm

    About Jordan, I think Evan was claiming he was being alienated from his own son and that Michael was taking his place and June was allowing this to happen. Of course, the real reason was that he wanted $$ from Michael, whom he saw as a target.

    According to what I have read from the maid’s account, Jordan did not spend much time with his dad until the allegations started. Then Evan got full custody by lying that he would return Jordan after a week but he did not. Jordan told Gardener that he preferred being with his dad b/c his mother was strict, had rules, and Evan did not.

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  100. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 11, 2012 11:02 pm

    http://cincinnatipas.com/richardgardner-pas.html

    “If sexual urges continue after the abuse ends, Gardner suggests such children be encouraged to masturbate.
    Gardner suggests that the molesting-father’s behavior should be understood. The father “has to be helped to appreciate that, even today, [pedophilia] is a widespread and accepted practice among literally billions of people” and “he [the father] has had a certain amount of bad luck with regard to the place and time he was born with regard to social attitudes toward pedophilia.”

    Hi, Kaarin, Yes, Parental Alienation is accepted as a psychological reality but not the Patental Alienation Syndrome as developed and argued by Dr. Gardener. Gardener recommended that when mother accused the fathers of sexually abusing the child in a custody case and turned the child against the father, that this PAS was going on, and that the child should actually be returned to the father, or spend more time with the father, rather than the contrary. He thought that child sexual abuse was less frequent and less traumatic to the child than was generally accepted. I decided to order his book, which as published in Oct, 92, to see for myself what his theories are. If you check the link, he enraged a lot of people, including in the scientific community, for his approach. His theory of PAS is not accepted. Check out the links I gave you before too.

    In the interview with Jordan, it is clear from some things that Gardener says, that he is sympathetic to Evan and thinks Evan is trying to protect Jordan and be a good dad. He is on the father’s side here and in general that seems to be his approach, that the mothers accused the fathers to get custody. He also did not seem to think child sexual encounters with an adult was so abnormal. If you check the link, he says we all have a bit of pedophilia in us!

    Due to Gardener’s favorable comments about pedophilia, I am wonderiong if he was known to NAMBLA supporters back in 93?

    Lynande, you once gave us the link to the full Gardener interview, but I can’t seem to locate it. Could you post it again? Thanks.

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  101. December 11, 2012 8:54 pm

    A bit more on “parental alienation”.I did not know that Dr. Gardener tied it to sexulal abuse, or such allegations. Only that if one parent illegally and unreasonably withholds child, esp. a young child from the other parent,the child can feel estranged from that parent.Nor do I think such estrangement by itself leads to false allegations.Unfortunately feuding parents, in divorce proceedings or later may put ideas of sex abuse into a childs mind.This was the case with the Chandlers.And I cannot say that sex abuse has never occurred after parental divorce. -In that piece of interview Jordan lied.

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  102. December 11, 2012 5:08 pm

    A devoted fan and a good friend of Michael’s (from Ireland, by the way) named Talitha, whose photo is in the background of that picture in the People Magazine, wrote in her blog how much Michael loved Ireland and its people.
    He told her that he had written several songs in Ireland and couldn’t wait to share them with the world. Just think of it – he couldn’t wait to share the new songs with the world, and it is only the world (his fans) who didn’t want to hear them! A totally heart-breaking thought!

    Talitha’s story:

    The Emerald Isle

    When Michael returned to Los Angeles from England in March, I went to the airport to greet him. He invited me into his car and he and his children talked to me about the time they had spent in Ireland the previous year. They spoke of carefree days on hillsides, of flying kites and riding horses and of Irish mythology and music.

    Over the coming months and years, Michael would often speak about this period in his life, always with warmth and fondness. He told me he was in love with the Irish people and culture, that he dreamed of owning a castle in Ireland and that he’d written a number of songs while there, which he couldn’t wait to share with the world.

    While speaking with me on 9 December 2007 [a year after he left Ireland], he said :

    “You know, I always felt a special affinity to Ireland, even before I ever went there. How could you not love that beautiful emerald island? It’s so green and luscious and has such beautiful forestry. And I love all the folklore about fairies and elves and leprechauns.”

    My native home (I was born and raised in Co. Cork) was a refuge for Michael and his children, a place where they could escape from the glare of the media spotlight and live in relative obscurity. I wish with all my heart that they had stayed there forever.

    http://www.michaeljacksonthelastangel.com/michael-jackson-2007.html

    Talitha is in the background:

    Here is another photo from her blog (she is in the background). It is the same Wynn resort in Las Vegal, April 2007 and Michael looks smashing:

    P.S. I’ve added Talitha’s blog to our blogroll. Here is a link to its index page: http://www.michaeljacksonthelastangel.com/michael-jackson-contents.html

    Like

  103. December 11, 2012 4:38 pm

    “There was such a huge storm over that album it was truly depressing. I liked the album myself and did not understand the reaction. I recognized Michael’s voice without any problem. I was surpirised it didn’t sell better. I think I read that it has sold 600,000 copies in USA.”

    Now that I’ve realized that we are talking about the album Michael was working on while in Ireland (and then in the Cascios’ house) I got absolutely outraged by the campaign against it. If it was really someone in the Jackson family who started it I’m even ready to reverse my usually complacent attitude towards them (“all of us have our faults”) and strangle the instigators with my own hands.

    Just think of it – what Michael was putting his heart and soul into was brushed away as some trash! They fought the album as if it was their worst enemy! What did Michael’s work in Ireland have to do with Sony? Or the Estate? No matter how “bad” they are? NOTHING!

    And the “fans” are no better. They allowed themselves to be fooled in so simple a matter. Well, if someone didn’t like the album, why didn’t they simply shut up and stop imposing their views on the others? Sorry for the harsh words. Michael hoped so much that his last album would be a success! And what did they do to it? It was simply the worst of insults to him personally. My heart breaks when I think of his expectations of it and what it ended up with…

    Like

  104. December 11, 2012 4:23 pm

    “the media led the way and people followed and what they produced–the hate, the bullying – that is the monster. They sunk to the bottom in their inhumanity, attacking a gentle and innocent and talented man who only gave us his beautiful artistry to make us dance and sing and be happy. Have you read about the latest media travesty–2 DJ’s from Australia impersonating the Queen to get access to Kate while in the hospital? Due to their juvenile and inhumane act, a woman who was fooled and put the call through committed suicide. The media is never responsible, never do they think of the consequences of what they do with their lies and slander, to themselves, to their targets, to the culture. And they get paid for trashing all admirable values that people have worked so hard for all these many centuries. All down the drain for filthy lucre. ‘Gutter press’ is a good description.”

    Well said, aldebaran. I agree that irresponsible media is a monster, but those who listen to them and follow their style are no better. If someone had said to the media – enough of your name-calling and insulting manners – and simply stopped buying their nonsense, tabloid journalism would have died on its own. But people love it and behave in the same way!

    I find it disgusting, no matter in which “culture” it takes place. In my place people are also quickly losing conscience and the ability to tell good from evil – making nasty pranks on people for the sake of a laugh on TV is also becoming a norm. I don’t watch TV any more as all of it is unbearable.

    The prank the two Australians played on the woman in the hospital was murderous in the literal meaning of the word. I hope that everyone will sober up a bit after this tragedy. It is another wake-up call for all of us – stop the moral degradation before it becomes irreversible.

    Like

  105. December 11, 2012 3:33 pm

    “BTW, I wonder about that intervention that the Jacksons, according to an article you cite, planned in 2006 b/c Michael was not in USA in 2006.”

    Aldebaran, yes, I also noticed the mistake in the People Magazine – of course it was 2007, and the phrase that Jermaine Jackson “confirmed to PEOPLE on July 21 that he’s worried about his brother’s health” referred to July 2007 too. This was only a month before Michael went to the Cascios home on August 19, 2007.

    Michael stayed with them for two and a half months until beginning of November 2007 and Frank Cascio did not notice signs of any medicine used, as he specially noted in his book, so Jermaine’s worries were totally unjustified.

    The magazine quotes Jessie Jackson who saw Michael also in July 2007:

    “Adds the Rev. Jesse Jackson, a longtime friend and adviser: “I was with him [in July] and he was healthy, spry, effervescent. After all the pressure of the trial, it weakened him to some extent, but he bounced back.”

    No wonder that Michael was reported to “get pissed off” at all these “interventions” and his siblings’ “worries”. Michael did not want to see the family most probably because they were treating him like the worst of the media, thinking that he was abusing drugs while in reality he wasn’t. He could feel bad due to all the stress and lupus which gets exacerbated by the stress. It was probably due to a lupus flare that he was seen and photographed in a wheel-chair a few months after he arrived in Las Vegas.

    But imagine Michael’s need to meet his siblings and constantly assure them that this was not what they were thinking of him! It is so humiliating. I am not surprised that he completely shut them off.

    When our own relatives intrude too much into our lives we also have to do it though they are acting out of their best inentions and we still love them. Some of those close to us simply would not listen – for some reason they think they know better.

    Like

  106. December 11, 2012 1:47 pm

    “It is strange that Wisna and Peter Lopez both commnitted suicide, both people who were involved in Michael’s businesses.”

    Aldebaran, I hope to write a special post about Jack Wishna. The reason why I stayed away from the blog for so long is that I was looking for information, sometimes deep into the night and could not be distracted by anything else. A thought process is like running – you can’t stop until you get to the destination point.

    Like

  107. December 11, 2012 11:48 am

    As I said parental rights and obligations are already spellt out at divorce by the court or lawyers.If a parent does not follow what has been agreed upon He/she may seek legal help.
    The case with Jordan was somekind of aberration,had he not spent much time with his father writing that script?They had their own motivations for that interview,if it now is genuine.We only get to see apart ot whatever it was.- Sorry for typos below.

    Like

  108. December 11, 2012 11:34 am

    Parental alienaltoin does occur. In divorces one parent who has main cusotody may not let the children see the other.Usually custody rights are spellt out in the divorce proceeding.It has found that a child faeres best when he(she has a relatkonship with both parents. A violent or alcoholic parent may see the children under supervision.Just because such alienation does occur does not men you have to make an official diagnosis of every thing.

    Like

  109. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 11, 2012 11:10 am

    Gardener’s obit in the NYTimes:
    http://www.nytimes.com/2003/06/09/nyregion/richard-gardner-72-dies-cast-doubt-on-abuse-claims.html

    Seems his theory of Parental Alienation Syndrome (PAS) was NOT accepted as scientific by the medical community, he tended to support the fathers who had been accused of child abuse by the mothers, and his work was mainly self-published and not peer-reviewed. I read some excerpts from his book (True and False Accusations of Child Sex Abuse) that he thought adults having sex with children was accepted in other cultures. Where have we heard that before? According to Wikipedia, if you google’ PAS,’ he testified in over 400 court cases. In one case he testified in support of a father who shot his wife during a custody case multiple times as she walked to her car. Seems like he generally sided with the dads, and maybe that’s why Feldman picked him. He was not accepted as a ‘gold standard’ as his work was not, even today, accepted as scientific. He was controversial. His work was picked up by groups that wanted to defend fathers in custody cases.

    Like

  110. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 11, 2012 10:13 am

    One more suicide of people connected to Michael: Dr. Richard Gardener committed suicide May 25, 2003. He stabbed himself after taking medication. So he stabbed himself after the allegations against Michael were made widely public after LWMJ.

    Like

  111. Linda permalink
    December 11, 2012 10:13 am

    It’s always been the media that convinced the masses that MJ was weird. The only weirdness about Michael was how he had to deal with his fame and the media. I think the “Michael” album did great after all the controversy, and the division of the fans. With so many fans boycotting, refusing to buy it, and even his family saying it wasn’t him, the album was still a great success.
    All the songs are great. Monster is probably my least favorite, although the lyrics are good. “Breaking News” did it for me. In that song I really felt his frustration. I can’t even imagine what it was like to be in his shoes, but kudos to Ireland for being true friends. He didn’t have many true friends in his private circle, but he did, and still does have a lot of true friends all over the globe, who are still fighting to vindicate him. Too bad the masses don’t, or won’t realize that he has already been vindicated.
    So, over 3 years later we’re still fighting to prove the fact that the vindicated has already been vindicated. Did that make sense to anyone, lol? I love “Michael” and I am waiting for the next album. I thought we would have one this last year. I’m ready for the next one, no matter what anyone says about it.

    Like

  112. December 11, 2012 5:55 am

    Thanks for talking sense about the Cascio tracks. I’m so tired of the conspiracy-seekers.

    Like

  113. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 11, 2012 5:49 am

    Sorry, I misspelled the name–it’s Jack Wishna, the man who got Michael to return to Las Vegas from Ireland, discussed in the article above by VMJ.

    Like

  114. December 11, 2012 4:28 am

    The suicide of Peter Lopez was surprising to his family ,I understand.,and poorly. investigated..Plese let me know who Wisna was.

    Like

  115. aldebaranredstar permalink
    December 11, 2012 3:38 am

    Thanks, Helena. Michael was not the monster, but the media led the way and people followed and what they produced–the hate, the bullying–that is the monster. They sunk to the bottom in their inhumanity, attacking a gentle and innocent and talented man who only gave us his beautiful artistry to make us dance and sing and be happy. Have you read about the latest media travesty–2 DJ’s from Australia impersonating the Queen to get access to Kate while in the hospital? Due to their juvenile and inhumane act, a woman who was fooled and put the call through committed suicide. The media is never responsible, never do they think of the consequences of what they do with their lies and slander, to themselves, to their targets, to the culture. And they get paid for trashing all admirable values that people have worked so hard for all these many centuries. All down the drain for filthy lucre. ‘Gutter press’ is a good description.

    BTW, I wonder about that intervention that the Jacksons, according to an article you cite, planned in 2006 b/c Michael was not in USA in 2006.

    About the fans attacking the album ‘Michael,’ the fans seem to be in turmoil, ready to attack each other and others. It’s good to keep disagreements rational and respectful, but too much emotion tends to get involved. I can be guilty of that too! It’s not always easy to stay calm and reasonable. There was such a huge storm over that album it was truly depressing. I liked the album myself and did not understand the reaction. I recognized Michael’s voice without any problem. I was surpirised it didn’t sell better. I think I read that it has sold 600,000 copies in USA.

    The fans have ‘buttons’ that when they get pushed, they go off the wall, even losing respect for each other. It is sad b/c it would be valuable to focus on Michael’s art and the restoration of his reputation and standing.

    It is strange that Wisna and Peter Lopez both commnitted suicide, both people who were involved in Michael’s businesses.

    Like

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  1. Michael Jackson and Jack Wishna in 2007 | Vindicating Michael

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